A different kind of Ford: '51 Vedette V8 25.500 EUR Offers

[Leif in Calif]

This later became a Simca model. The engine is a V8 60... I believe the gearbox is similar to that used by Cord. 

Looks a bit like a Buick that had the wrong setting on the clothes dryer! 

http://www.finecars.cc/en/detail/car/668819/index.html?no_cache=1&ret=63

old new in France. Was in the collection of Andre Weber for about 40 years. He and his team restored the car and transformed the car from a coach into a convertible. Was a French body off restoration in the eighties of last century.

 

 

[58L-Y8]

The basic body design was developed under E.T, Gregorie's leadership in the Ford Design Studio to be a smaller postwar Ford. It was to be teamed with a larger Ford which eventually became what was marketed as the 1949 Mercury.  When Ernest Breech was brought in by Henry Ford II to help run the company in July 1946, Breech immediately recognized the larger Ford package was too costly to build for the low-priced segment to complete affectively with Chevrolet.  Tooling for both Fords had already been prototyped and contracted out.  What to do?

 

What Breech decided to do was kick the large Ford tooling up to become the 1949 Mercury and the small Ford tooling to be assigned to Ford of France for their 1948 Vedette, powered by the V8-60.   This was the point where the crash program to develop the 1949 Ford as let to George Walker and the car we received as the 1949 Ford was develop by the outside team as well as a parallel design by the in-house Ford Design Studio.

 

The immediate postwar years were chaotic times in the Ford Motor Company, a scramble to develop updated products and impose disciplined management methods in the wake of Edsel's death, old Henry Ford's increasing sensile state, and management power struggle between a cadre of unsavory characters as Joe Galamb, Harry Bennett et al versus HFII and his team.

[wayne sheldon]

Definitely tough times for the Ford family. Sadly, too many people remember the aging Henry and his associations with as you say "unsavory" characters, rather than the man who did so much good in the early days of the automobile. Henry should have retired permanently fifteen to twenty years before he died.

[Lee H]

2 hours ago, wayne sheldon said:

Henry should have retired permanently fifteen to twenty years before he died.

If he had, I have doubts the company would have survived the depression. I like Edsel, but was he the same hard-headed businessman as his father? Often, the second generation of a family company consider their legacy a burden, rather than a joy. I see his tenure as half-hearted at best.

 

And without Henry’s impetus, would we have ever seen cheap horsepower for the masses, vis a vis the flathead V8? Maybe, but the hot rod landscape of the 20th century might look very different.

 

And who can say if his resistance to labor union demands didn’t help save the country (at least for a while) from some of the left wing extremes of Europe?

 

A complicated man, with a complicated legacy.

[alsancle]

It looks like it might have a preselector but is rear wheel drive so no Cord like transmission.

[Leif in Calif]

2 hours ago, alsancle said:

It looks like it might have a preselector but is rear wheel drive so no Cord like transmission.

Similar to Cord in that it is a preselector. 

[58L-Y8]

2 hours ago, alsancle said:

It looks like it might have a preselector but is rear wheel drive so no Cord like transmission.

A.J.:

Being French, suppose the Vedette used a Cotal preselector more so for driver convenience than to overcome drivetrain access for shift mechanisms?

Steve

[Leif in Calif]

2 hours ago, Lee H said:

A complicated man, with a complicated legacy.

I'll say! From uneducated tinkerer, to one of the richest people in the world. It seems that often has the effect of causing the person to think "they know best" in every arena, not just the one that made them successful. He thought he could stop World War One. 

It is interesting to think about what might have happened if Henry had retired when the V8 came out. He was almost 70 at that point. From that point on, its very difficult to make a case that the company was well managed, so I don't think Henry gets much credit for steering it through the depression. Viewed through the lens of contemporary events, America got through that difficult period by swinging left, while several countries in Europe swung right.  

[D2R]

7 hours ago, alsancle said:

It looks like it might have a preselector but is rear wheel drive so no Cord like transmission.

If I am thinking about the right Cotal transmission - it is an electromagnetically controlled epicyclic gearbox which has very little, or even nothing, in common with Cord.

 

 

There is a short, but adequate description in English in an old issue of Commercial Motor.

Edited June 11 by D2R (see edit history)

[Leif in Calif]

Similar "user interface"

[JamesR]

I think it's a cool looking car. Seems to incorporate some elements of Mercury, Buick and Nash styling. Thanks for posting, Leif, and thanks for the education on these, Steve.

[58L-Y8]

On 6/12/2024 at 7:46 PM, JamesR said:

I think it's a cool looking car. Seems to incorporate some elements of Mercury, Buick and Nash styling. Thanks for posting, Leif, and thanks for the education on these, Steve.

JamesR:

 

You're welcome.  My 'Aa Ha' moment came from the book Edsel Ford and E. T. Gregorie: The Remarkable Design Team and Their Classic Fords of the 1930's and 1940's by Henry Dominguez.  I had noticed the similar front fender sculpting flowing into the body side character lines of both the 1949-'51 Mercury and the Ford of France Vedette V8-60.  Coincidence?  By design?  A bit of both: they were both initially intended for the postwar American production of 'small' and 'large' Fords. 

 

The motivation for these developments was it was common knowledge throughout the industry that GM had been developing a smaller, compact car that would be retailed by Chevrolet dealers code named the Cadet.  Why that never came to pass at the time was once it was costed out by engineering and production folks, it was found to be as nearly as costly to manufacture as the regular full-sized Chevrolet so was uneconomic to proceed. 

 

Ironically, along comes Nash a few years later to prove it was possible to field a compact car if it was packaged and promoted cleverly and correctly.   Folks would embrace a small car if it didn't scream "my owner is dirt poor or a miserable miser!"  Just one of those crazy twist and turns the automotive industry takes at times...

 

Steve

[deac]

1 hour ago, 58L-Y8 said:

My 'Aa Ha' moment came from the book Edsel Ford and E. T. GHenry Ford was a great inventor, tinkererregorie: The Remarkable Design Team and Their Classic Fords of the 1930's and 1940's by Henry Dominguez. 

I have read that book; I couldn't put it down.  Henry Ford was a great tinkerer.  He had a vision when he was young and fought to see come to life, and it did in spades!  But he had his short comings as well.  He had a son, Edsel, who was raised in his younger years by his Mom, Clara.  The Henry took the reins from Clara when Edsel became a teenager.  Henry gave him cars and even a personal a machine shop.  And then Henry brought him in to the company and in good time Henry promoted Edsel to be president of the company.  Edsel saved Ford Motor from going bankrupt during the depression.  Edsel fought hard to replace the model T numerous times and Henry wouldn't allow it.  Henry maintained a close relationship with Harry Bennett who was a bully mobster like creature who spied on Edsel at Henry's behest. Moreover Henry want to have Harry Bennett take over the company until Clara stepped in.

 

So I agree Henry Ford did great things for the world. However he created his own enemy in his son and probably helped bring on his son's illness that eventually killed him.

Edited June 14 by deac (see edit history)