1960 Lincoln Continental convertible

[BadBrad]

I have a 1960 Lincoln Convertible and I need to know if there is someone in northern or Southern California that works on these. The top went up and down two weeks ago when I purchased the car but now it will only go down and the back lid will not open or shut

[old car fan]

John Cashman, the roof doctor. He may still do it?.

[Rusty_OToole]

Jay Leno did a show about this. There is a guy who can tune up the top mechanism and make it work even though no parts are available. It may take a couple of days and no doubt, cost $$$$$. Lincoln seems to make their cars complicated and hard to fix just for the hell of it.

 

 

[rocketraider]

Lincoln and Thunderbird convertibles use the same basic mechanism and electrics, as do the 57-59 Ford Skyliner retractable hardtop convertibles. These are complex systems with limit switches, electric motors, screw jacks, and what seems like miles of wiring. Any one or combination of which can make them act up. But there are people who have figured out how to repair them.

 

Coincidentally all three were cars designed to attract gadget freaks. "Push a button! The roof goes down and disappears! Push the button again! The roof reappears and raises!"

 

Makes you wonder how many Ford service techs had nightmares or complete mental breakdowns because of these things.

[Rusty_OToole]

22 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

Lincoln and Thunderbird convertibles use the same basic mechanism and electrics, as do the 57-59 Ford Skyliner retractable hardtop convertibles. These are complex systems with limit switches, electric motors, screw jacks, and what seems like miles of wiring. Any one or combination of which can make them act up. But there are people who have figured out how to repair them.

 

Coincidentally all three were cars designed to attract gadget freaks. "Push a button! The roof goes down and disappears! Push the button again! The roof reappears and raises!"

 

Makes you wonder how many Ford service techs had nightmares or complete mental breakdowns because of these things.

Mercedes 1963: Ve vill build ze most luxurious most complicated car in ze vorld and call it ze 600

 

Lincoln: Hold my beer

Edited November 2, 2023 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history)

[pfloro]

24 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

These are complex systems with limit switches, electric motors, screw jacks, and what seems like miles of wiring.

I don't know the specifics of these mechanisms but do know that they are electrically & mechanically "sequential".  Upon starting the opening operation, the 1st "task" must mechanically complete before the next task is triggered electrically. As rocketraider mentioned, properly functioning & adjusted limit switches electrically (via relays) start the next task. There are several of these tasks which occur before the top is down and stowed.  The closing operation reverses the entire set of tasks...!  

 

I can see why both the engineers and service techs went mad...

 

Paul

[m-mman]

4 hours ago, pfloro said:

I don't know the specifics of these mechanisms but do know that they are electrically & mechanically "sequential".  Upon starting the opening operation, the 1st "task" must mechanically complete before the next task is triggered electrically.

Correct. There are two halves of the system. Power from the main operation switch goes from one "part" to another, then at each junction power is sent to a relay that sends power to do something. (open the lid, unlock the #1 bow, hydraulically lower the top) 

 

The "parts" or nodules are "limit switches". They are located near by the part that needs to trip it to tell the system that the next thing can happen. This means that these limit switches are located in: the top bows, the deck lid, and down in the quarter panel. (to be tripped when the roof is fully down) 

 

The motors and cables that lock & unlock parts and raise the boot lid are robust and mechanical operated and need only cleaning and adjustment to be reliable. The roof is raised and lowered hydraulically. (buy a new pump, hoses and rams, fill the system with ATF and this action will be good for life) 

 

Since it is all electrical the biggest problem you have is with BAD CONNECTIONS!!  The limit switches are "sealed" but they are exposed to water and dirt (Hey they are 60 years old) and they are closed with rivets and bent metal tabs such that they resist opening for cleaning.  

The inconsistent connections the limit switches make are the cause of all the intermittent operations.  They have adjustment concerns also. There are circuit breakers that can fail and they are on the ground side of each motor. (not where you would expect to find them) 

 

BUT if you trip/engage/power each relay individually (jumper wires) you can make (force?) each mechanical action happen (for testing). 

When the boot opens and closes (by jumping) and the #1 bow locks and unlocks (by jumping)  and the top goes up and down hydraulically THEN you can begin tracing the circuits as electricity is passed between the limit switches.

 

On my car I created an emergency box. A harness of wires connecting to each relay, the main power and 4 switches in a box. It lives under the back seat and I can pull it out in an emergency. With it I can control each action and open or close what is needed at that moment when the limit switches inevitably fail. 

 

Owning a Lincoln convertible 1958-1967 isn't just a hobby, it's a lifestyle. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JACK M]

I was in a shop earlier this week and there was one if these Lincoln convertibles in there that was all opened up so the guy could work on the top mechanism.

He had purchased a HUGE mechanics fold out of that system and hung it on the wall in front of the car.

I guess it was about three feet by five feet and was a vinyl thing so pretty durable.

Having worked on a 57 retractable recently I was comparing some things.

Not much the same, as the retractable had no hydraulics, rather used acme type screws, which incidentally was the biggest problem as the grease was hard as rocks and those screws just wouldn't turn.

The Lincoln on the other hand was hydraulic so the systems weren't really the same. Even though they both and numerous relays, solenoids and limit switches to make them equally complicated.

[m-mman]

The Ford trunk lid and the Lincoln boot are both moved with mechanical screw jacks.  Both the Skyliner and Lincoln have small screws that lock the top to the windshield. (The Ford also locks at the C pillar). 
 

The Lincoln does use hydraulic to raise and lower the top, where, as you stated, Ford used screw jacks.  
 

1961-1967 Lincoln used hydraulics for the trunk too.