Can anyone help us to identify this car?

[Remraf]

Hi all,

 

The car pictured belonged to my great, great grandmother in England. We're struggling to workout what it is, can anyone out there help? We think the picture is sometime in the early 1900's - apologies for the angle!

 

 

Many thanks.

[JACK M]

Ha !

looks the same front side up as it does rear side up.

[keiser31]

[Ariejan NL]

This body looks a bit like the body by Phénix, presented at the Paris Salon of 1912. The chassis was different, which was Bellanger. Your car certainly is somewhat later, 1914 or maybe already 1919, looking at the body style, the electric (side) lights and the closed wheels. I have no idea of the make at the moment, though.

[viv w]

Possibly a Trojan, it would appear to have solid rubber tires

[dictator27]

This is very much a WAG, but based entirely on the shape of the radiator I think it is possibly an 11.9 hp Humber of about 1916 or so.

[Vintman]

Great  work Ariejan. Got me interested so further research suggests that Phénix actually made the car chassis (maker of engines nowhere mentioned) and that they were bodied by Ateliers Loustaunau.  Phénix was apparently  a follow-on to  Prunel Freres, Dumas & Cie in Puteaux 1900-1907,  who made the Prunel, Prunello  and the JP car. These were also marketed in England as the Gnome. Prunel were apparently active to 1914 and factory was used 1912 to 1914 to make the Phénix car. These were advertised at the Paris Salon of 1912 as coming in  10, 12 and 14HP fours, shaft drive.  Confusingly, the address for the Phénix cars at the Salon was shown as  Loustaunau - Carosserie Phénix, Ile de la Jatte, Neuilly-sur-Senine, this being on the island in the Seine. Alternative information suggests only two models were made on same chassis but 1460 or 2121cc engines. The Prunel Company was also involved with Boyer Cars, these being made in the Prunel factory in 1906.  Boyer Cars were marked in England as York and in USA as Boyer. I cannot find any mention of Phénix putting bodies on other people’s chassis. My pictures of the original  Phénix have carbide headlamps so perhaps this car  had later electric headlights fitted in England. The wheels would have been wire and it was common in the UK to fit conical wheelcovers to hide the spokes. As Prunels were available in UK, a dealership for the Phénix would have been existing for the UK market. Phénix were only mentioned  pre WW1 so am presuming manufacture no later than 1914, although photo could be later. My only photo of a  surviving Phénix is of a two seater with no facility for the roof system, which further suggests  a possible Loustaunau addition.   So to my way of thinking this would seem to be a cca 1912_Phénix Two Seater'Dickey Transformable with a three position top, bodied by Loustaunau.  I have had a go at cleaning/repairing of the original photo.

Regards Vintman (UK)

www.svvs.org