Painting from ground up

[jeff53]

6 hours ago, TAKerry said:

what part of the country are you located?

 middle Wisconsin

 

[jeff53]

Okay guys,thanks for all your suggestions and input.. They helped a lot.

    Time for the next question-- Is there a website that has the actual mix recipes for colors- The original colors were called Blue Lake Blue ( metallic) at some sites and Oyster grey... which actually looks like an 18% Gray--- I wanted to use the actual original color scheme and maybe updated it a little by using metal flake or making both colors metallic.. but I wanted to have samples made 1st ( may not even like the metallic look--- The rustoleum I had on it in the 2017 photo is close- but it wasn't metallic nor was it the original Gray or Blue.  1st one - left column, Top left should be the original colors,- Yes, I know the colors are reversed- but since this has landed in my hands and it's only primed- I can go with any color scheme-- I'm also open for suggestions

 

[RansomEli]

TCP Global has a 1948 Pontiac color chart. They can mix any of those colors in acrylic lacquer,  acrylic enamel, or base coat/clear coat.

 

https://www.autocolorlibrary.com/pages/1948-Pontiac.html

 

[jeff53]

12 hours ago, RansomEli said:

TCP Global has a 1948 Pontiac color chart. They can mix any of those colors in acrylic lacquer,  acrylic enamel, or base coat/clear coat.

 

https://www.autocolorlibrary.com/pages/1948-Pontiac.html

 

Thank you but as mentioned I already have the "correct colors" and there are a tone of online place that will mix- even that web-page " Actual" color may be different" What I'm looking for is the actual--

 FORMULA OR RECIPE-- so I can take that to the local auto paint store and have a sample made up- to see if I even like the color--- doing it online is a headache--- You pick what you think is the right color ( according to your monitor) order it at about 7-10 bucks a pop- plus S&H because after all it's usually not free for that little of amount.- then wait, then pray- it's the right color and  shade---- if not-then start over.... By having the formula/recipe- go to the store -they make it according to you- you say- well can you make it a little more bluer or lighter-they go to the back room add whatever and your done-- depending on the store they may or may not charge for adding. or for a addition sample but thanks

[jeff53]

 I'm almost afraid to ask--- But here goes---- simple question again--- set -up--- I haven't used them yet--- but I have several rattle cans of Rustoleum brand Primer Sealer and Primer Filler and Sandable Primer- all 3 from Rustoleum---- My car as you've seen has "Epoxy" on it--- the next step doesn't have to be but " should be" putting on the  "Filler"... 

   Can you put Rustoleum FILLER OR SEALER on top of/ as the next step  and have it adhere okay/properly????

        If you need to know--- the base color coat I plan on using is Omni urethane base......

   Please I'm not  looking for other suggestion- just yet... I just want to use up the  rustoleum filler and sealer- and this seems to be the perfect spot or time--- but only if they are compatible... I can always change the Urethane base finish color---- but the  Mar-Hyde AND MP170 epoxy  are already on and sanded.--- or I could donate them if they are NOT  compatible ....

     Oh, by the way- for those that don't like Rustoleum- I don't either - but I will use them- Here's another photo when I used the Rustoleum brand Farm Implement line- back then I  had it stripped down again - and wanted to keep it from rusting---- I was amazed-- and I choose Implement paint because it has to be tough and stand up to UV and all kinds of weather--- farmers leave their tractors sit out  in all kinds of weather- without fear of rusting-- This photo was in 2003 and it lasted- no additional surface rust until  I went over it with the blue and gray- in 2016--- the next year is when I thought it should have a  "professional paint job"--- stupid me-  I almost got rid of the car because of the "professionals"

[Bloo]

No

[jeff53]

1 hour ago, Bloo said:

No

 Thanks, to the point- exactly what I wanted- but not what I wanted to read- just hoping to use up the RustO somehow- since I no longer have the receipts-

      Question- is it because of the end paint being Urethane based? If so,  can it still be used but I would need to change to a different type - Like finish with acrylic/enamel- or just because it just won't adhere to the epoxy... Cause I'm not tied into the Urethane ....

 

[Chris Bamford]

Jeff:

 

IMO, your best course of action is to take those cans of Rustoleum outdoors and empty them into the wind (or to whatever facility in your area accepts unwanted paint for disposal).

 

You keep asking if they should be used. People much smarter than me keep saying no.

 

Listen up!      Getting those damned cans out of your life TODAY will help you to plan ahead with a clearer mind.

 

— — — — — — — — — — —

 

It sounds like this project has been occupying your space, time and worry for 20 years. Time to move ahead — with big steps — while you still can.

 

You have compromised breathing/lungs.  Forget about painting it yourself. Forget even about any significant amount of sanding. As we age, most of us regret some things we did earlier that are now affecting our health. That, inevitably, is part of growing up. Doing things now that further compromise our health is just plain stupid.

 

If you're still reading, think about this...

 

You've had two bad experiences with painters. Clearly they were poor choices for this project. Their failure to do a satisfactory job properly is largely on them — but also on you. You chose them in the first place, and you chose to leave the car in their custody when clearly nothing was being accomplished.

 

Recognize your mistakes here and learn from them. You chose two crummy shops shops in a row... chances are good that if you ask locally for referrals and check references that shop #3 will be OK. Google says there are currently 132,000 body shops in the US. I think you can find one to do this job.

 

Obviously I don't know anything about that 80-mile MAACO shop, but it sounds like something you want to look into.  After you drop the Rustoleum off at the recycle centre, drive the 80 miles and meet with them.  Make it a fun trip, bring your sweetie and have a nice lunch nearby. Take photos of your car.  Say very little about your previous bad experiences — no reputable shop wants a serial complainer as a customer for fear that will happen to them.

 

Harold above suggested you pay them to come look at the car first. Great idea. It shows you are serious, and not afraid to invest a little more to choose the right shop.

 

About the money — consider this lump has been in your life for some 20 years, many thousands of dollars and much fretting and frustration. Spend what you have to to get it done, and soon, to an acceptable standard. If you can't afford it, OK. Sell the damned thing. If you do have the money and won't spend it, that's your choice... but five or ten years from now when it still hasn't turned a wheel, it's not because of two crummy painters, it's because of you.

 

Soapbox out.

[jeff53]

59 minutes ago, Chris Bamford said:

Jeff:

 

IMO, your best course of action is to take those cans of Rustoleum outdoors and empty them into the wind (or to whatever facility in your area accepts unwanted paint for disposal).

 

You keep asking if they should be used. People much smarter than me keep saying no.

 

Listen up!      Getting those damned cans out of your life TODAY will help you to plan ahead with a clearer mind.

 

— — — — — — — — — — —

 

It sounds like this project has been occupying your space, time and worry for 20 years. Time to move ahead — with big steps — while you still can.

 

You have compromised breathing/lungs.  Forget about painting it yourself. Forget even about any significant amount of sanding. As we age, most of us regret some things we did earlier that are now affecting our health. That, inevitably, is part of growing up. Doing things now that further compromise our health is just plain stupid.

 

If you're still reading, think about this...

 

You've had two bad experiences with painters. Clearly they were poor choices for this project. Their failure to do a satisfactory job properly is largely on them — but also on you. You chose them in the first place, and you chose to leave the car in their custody when clearly nothing was being accomplished.

 

Recognize your mistakes here and learn from them. You chose two crummy shops shops in a row... chances are good that if you ask locally for referrals and check references that shop #3 will be OK. Google says there are currently 132,000 body shops in the US. I think you can find one to do this job.

 

Obviously I don't know anything about that 80-mile MAACO shop, but it sounds like something you want to look into.  After you drop the Rustoleum off at the recycle centre, drive the 80 miles and meet with them.  Make it a fun trip, bring your sweetie and have a nice lunch nearby. Take photos of your car.  Say very little about your previous bad experiences — no reputable shop wants a serial complainer as a customer for fear that will happen to them.

 

Harold above suggested you pay them to come look at the car first. Great idea. It shows you are serious, and not afraid to invest a little more to choose the right shop.

 

About the money — consider this lump has been in your life for some 20 years, many thousands of dollars and much fretting and frustration. Spend what you have to to get it done, and soon, to an acceptable standard. If you can't afford it, OK. Sell the damned thing. If you do have the money and won't spend it, that's your choice... but five or ten years from now when it still hasn't turned a wheel, it's not because of two crummy painters, it's because of you.

 

Soapbox out.

Oh I take some blame- because I choose them--- but I didn't know their character before hand- One Pro had done work for me years ago years and the other actually owned his own paint and body shop and I met him while I was a locksmith--- choosing to leave my  car really seems to be standard for all auto shops whether here or there- kinda like leaving you car to having an engine overhauled. and the 2nd pro--- my car is here   since I got my car back in pieces from the first "pro", the plan was to finish taking doors and trunk and hood off- give them to him- he would do the priming ,I would then bring the pieces home and we would put the car together- I would drive it to his place- and there he would finish it. Only reason for me taking it down to the metal and taking parts to him was to save him time and because he was pressed for room ( no I didn't expect to save money by sanding it to the metal- just figured that would be a lot of the labor, plus give him time to make an opening for my car... As they say no good deed goes unpunished--- but all behind and lessoned learned " the  art of good business ethics are gone- I know I sound like a serial complainer and I would believe it myself- if I hadn't paid money upfront- if I was complaining about actual craftsmanship- If  this car had been actually painted let's just say  late 2018- or early 2019 or early 2020--- but I can't even complain about the work- coz money moved hands upon their request- "We need a deposit before we start" which is quite common practice in this area....  My major mistake- was not becoming an A-hole, and taking them both at their word  not not saying "" It's been xxx number of months or years- and with no problem I gave you your asking for amount of deposit- didn't even argue to try and get the amount down- or maybe I should have demanded my money back and said" You should've have asked for a deposit upfront if you didn't have time to do the job.... 

 You sound like one of those bad business people that own your own shop--- I was spending the money and had no problem with there Prof. fees ---- because I did know I wasn't capable of doing the job right- and knew the fumes were bad for me- no way in hell did I wanna get stuck with asking these question, I never have to ask again  or did I want to start buying equipment I may never use.

      And sell the Damn car--- guess what- last year I did put a sign on it and ---- problem is---- no one wants a car in pieces... I even ask the 2nd pro painter " With the way the car sits today- what do you think it's worth???? His reply- in pieces like it is now without completely being painted--- maybe---$4500-5000. In short no even the amount of deposit I gave him----- Now get this--- but you don't want to sell it like that- I can for sure get to it in Dec 2019- April 2020- really it's next he says---- So serial complainer tight with money not a friggin chance- $1500 at Maaco- plus the tow- hell that's less than what I would owe the pro..... and that I have put back to give the pro ( his asking price with no haggling)--- but it's hard to keep an eye on it 80 miles away- and they like I said and someone already suggested- and I agreed are an option---- and spend the time I have left getting the cat done-- please go back over the threads- that is exactly what I've been doing- and have been trying to seek out proper info from you guys - on what products work or are compatible with Mar-Hyde Epoxy Primer Surfacer and Omni MP170 --- because even as a locksmith- I know some lock brands are interchangeable with other lock brands and some are not... which is where you guys come in--- auto store didn't tell I was putting on " for professional use only" stuff- I just happen to spot it...  Let me ask you this- If you have let's say 3 $25. dollar locks sitting around and you're not sure if they would work on you basement doors- would you try and find out 1st or just automatically toss them out and go buy the others from the hardware store--- after all hardware stores sell good ones but very seldom sell commercial grade or higher end for homes and cheap 25 dollar ones  may fit.and they aren't going on an main entrance. I'd be willing to bet you would try and see if your $25. ones worked first instead of going to a locksmith- or buying more expensives.--- You're not being "cheap" your just being smart before you run to the local hardware store spend $ 240- when want you have will do the job... That is ALL I need to find out - Is what I have on hand would work with what was done and is ALREADY on my car- put there by a professional--- and would work with what professional sold me....   I was looking for an alternative not a "CHEAPER" way of doing sh*t because... 1. Because of the fumes and my breathing problems and 2. because I have some crap on hand already- so why NOT use it if it's compatible and you guys say you've had no trouble....  It would be kind of stupid to throw it away and THEN ask.... But you guys say you've had trouble- so I'm not going to use it -it's that- simple- I'm assuming you guys have no reason to lie- you're not selling me anything  and I've never mentioned who the pros were.

       I even knew there would be fumes- but not worse than the epoxy--- So I took to you guys to Find that "alternative". I found 2 and whether I like the choices or not I'll have to choose one--- neither seems to be a great alternative.  But Macco seems to be the better choice and cost about the same.

         But serial complainer- really??? with only trying to get it painted twice since 2017 and even the courts found in my favor and I wasn't the one that filed the small claims case-- matter of fact when the judge asked me what I was asking for-,instead of asking for it all- I said well since they claim to do some of the mechanical work--- they should be paid something- Just $ xxxx.xx dollars... again my bad because I didn't know they didn't have to turn over the paper work as proof they even did the work--- so I am getting stuck with having to pay a mechanic $ 90. an hour just to check to see if the work was done------ doesn't sound much like a serial whiner too me---- Okay let's end this thread-- good bye you guys

   

[cahartley]

If you are using MAACO (and I hope you will) it might not hurt to tell them, up front, you aren't looking to save money, you are seeking a good paint job.

Sometimes a few extra bucks can buy a lot.......  

[jeff53]

I know, and have already sent them photos so they know exactly what they are getting into.... and have asked them if they want me to assemble it before  or if they would rather me leave it as it is and they assemble it and as an ex service person- I let them  know- to make sure they add for that extra work- I hated it when I would go out on a job and a person would ask me to fix an extra lock and then be surprised at the additional cost..... All I expect of any person or business is " just do what you said you would do for whatever they want to charge--and I can either accept it or go elsewhere--- If I can for a price for just painting my car, then that's all I expect- If they need to add some extra work in order to " just paint the car" I expect them to add it and tell..--- and my mistake has been one of being to lenient, and say Listen I have the car 46 years and it's a little late to be in a hurry--- But once they take the money- I expect to get the job done in a reasonable amount of time. 1 pro shop took 5 months to just scuff up the paint- not strip it to the metal and I took everything ohh- lights inside trim- removed all but 1 screw- grill and bumpers and all bright work- essentially all that was left was- pull it into the garage scuff it up and give it a maaco type paint job- said he  could replace the windows- okay- he removed them and couldn't 2ns pro- 3 years ago right after the 1st said he could do it, I knew him and knew he used to have an auto body and paint shop.. Okay but he needed $ xxxx.xx up front for deposit--- that was going on 3 years ago--- Even with my breathing crap- I'm not that slow and I can't think of any place that is.. and I can't find anyone that thinks that's a reasonable amount of time- just to primer 4 doors and trunk and hood- and paint the inside trim and dash...  I can walk into a large hospital walk thru every floor and put together the complete master key system and install the correct locks making sure the maintenance guy can't get into the CEO office  without him being there..... But I'm not an auto painter have no desire to learn- that's why I paid places " their asking price"  and that's the reason for all the questions-- because I'm green at this and it's been dropped into my hands or I could just over look the 3 years and hope he would get around to priming the shell next year- and want more because there would be more work in removing the accumulated 3 years of surface rust.

    But to everyone-  thank you for your advice- no I'm not a serial complainer- just want the work done after the shops take my money--- and I have contacted Maaco and he was upfront said it would take 3 days and he would get back to me with a guesstimate

[erichill]

Be sure to post some photos when its complete.

[jeff53]

14 hours ago, erichill said:

Be sure to post some photos when its complete.

I will  but it might be awhile now- since I also have to start all over with the budget, used everything I had set aside for the painting and now it was either ask everyone for their advice and try and do it myself or dip into the upholstery budget--  The Maaco that's about has quoted me an (estimated only) about $4000.-5000. But so far they have only seen the photos-- so I won't hold them to the  quote- I used to be a service person -so it wouldn't be fair and after all they would be taking over after a pro and a greenhorn (me)had it.

     1 question-- 1st --- In short automotive store said after I finish putting the MP170 epoxy on the rest of the car- scuff it up- then put Filler on- the car  to fill in sanding scratches-- which makes sense. Found A friend that will come here use my amteture equipment to do that... What I don't know- is should I scuff up the Mar Hyde Epoxy Surfacer- that the pro put on.... All those panels have been sitting with that Mar-Hyde  Epoxy on for over a year---- Everything I read,indicates------I should scuff it up and have him also put filler  on those panels---- Oh this might help with you answer-- I have looked all the panels over and there are NO sanding marks--- but they are not glass smooth- more like smooth very mild orange peel- like you see on new cars today

 

[TAKerry]

Im no expert but I would scuff the epoxy before anything gets sprayed on top. When I did mine, I scuffed the epoxy with 320gr. then sprayed the filler/primer. By scuffing, it will give it some 'toothing' for the primer to grab.