Timing issue on 1931 Model A

[Leemag]

I have set the points and located TDC with the timing pin and no luck with timing my Model A engine. I checked to make sure # one cylinder was at TDC with a rod in the spark plug hole and it was as it should be. The rotor was at the proper 5 o'clock position. I doubled checked the points to make sure everything was correct at .020. I used the NU-REX wrench and followed all directions three times to make sure. When the lever is in full retard the car starts fine. If you try to move the lever to advance the car stalls every time. The travel on the distributor plate seems to be correct. It has a new modern upper plate in the distributor and points/condenser are new. I just purchased this car and that is all I know at this time. If anyone has any ideas what the problem may be I would appreciate your input. 

Thanks, 

Gary

[MCHinson]

Welcome to the AACA Discussion Forum. From what you have described it sounds like the timing is probably set correctly. Usually, when adjusting the advance causes stalling, you will find a bad spot of insulation on a wire somewhere shorting out causing the problem. If not a wiring problem, I would change to a known good condensor. I have seen more new defective condensors than I can recall. 

 

Where are you located? Perhaps an experienced Model A guy might live nearby and could help you with it. 

[vermontboy]

Matt's advice is probably correct if memory serves. It's been 50 years since I used a Model "A" as my only car and drove it back and forth from Utica to Rochester almost every weekend. Lots of repairs along the road but never on a tow hook.

 

I  assume it is making the beloved tic-a-tic-a-tic-a sound at idle when idling with the spark retard. I am attaching a how to list from Model :"A" Miseries and Cures.  Find a copy.

Key points where trouble usually occurs are

"a:" - fully retard the spark lever prior to setting the point gap.

"h" and "i".

 

 

 

 

 

[Leemag]

Thanks very much for the advise gentlemen. I will inspect the wiring and get a new condenser first thing. I live in Butler, Ohio. 

(Update) I tried a new condenser and checked the internal parts of the distributor everything looked fine. It has the modern bottom plate and upper plate. Looked for bare wires and found none. The person who owned this car before me changed it to a 12 volt system. Makes me wonder if something is wired wrong. 

 

Regards, 

Gary

[Pete O]

To see if your trouble is due to a short in the distributor, do this:   Start it and advance it to where it stalls.  Do not move the spark lever.  Remove the dist cap and body and without moving the upper plate stick a piece of paper between the points if they are closed.  If open not necessary.  Then using a multi meter, check for continuity between the point arm and the body of the distributor.  There should be zero continuity.  When opened the movable points arm is isolated from ground. If you have continuity it means that something in the primary circuit is grounding/shorting out.

 

Those modern upper and lower plates, with the springy power connection and shoe from the points to pick up the power are finicky sometimes,  make sure that shoe and the screw that holds it does not touch the dist body as you rotate the upper plate.   I had this set up, and tossed it in favor of the original "pigtail" wire that connects the lower plate to the points.  Fewer parts to go wrong.

Edited June 19, 2019 by Pete O (see edit history)

[mercer09]

sounds like the plate in the distributor is shorting.........

 

as Pete says

[JFranklin]

On 6/2/2019 at 12:58 PM, Leemag said:

I have set the points and located TDC with the timing pin and no luck with timing my Model A engine. I checked to make sure # one cylinder was at TDC with a rod in the spark plug hole and it was as it should be. The rotor was at the proper 5 o'clock position. I doubled checked the points to make sure everything was correct at .020. I used the NU-REX wrench and followed all directions three times to make sure. When the lever is in full retard the car starts fine. If you try to move the lever to advance the car stalls every time. The travel on the distributor plate seems to be correct. It has a new modern upper plate in the distributor and points/condenser are new. I just purchased this car and that is all I know at this time. If anyone has any ideas what the problem may be I would appreciate your input. 

Thanks, 

Gary

 

What symptoms does your engine have that you think it isn't timed properly? Did you use the actual timing pin to time at TDC?

Edited June 22, 2019 by JFranklin (see edit history)

[Guest]

Are you sure that the 5 o'clock position is where the rotor is pointing with # 1 at TDC.  Perhaps some one has installed the the distributor in a different position?

The rotor has to point to # 1 cylinder no mater where that wire is.

 

Edited June 22, 2019 by Guest (see edit history)

[JFranklin]

The distributor can only be installed in 1 position, the point cam can be rotated to #1 when the #1 is on TDC compression stroke and the spark retarded.