Hello

[Guest ChrisSummers]

I run a free, public registry of surviving Duesenberg J cars (kept online through the kindness of Randy Glover at Automotive History Online).

If you have any interesting Duesenberg stories--working on them, looking at them, driving them--I'd love to hear them, and I'm sure the rest of us would, too! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

[Ivan Saxton]

Why not be comprehensive, Chris? There were more A's made than J's, they were a real driver's car, and in their period they were possibly the most advanced car anywhere. Again, the cars made with proprietry Rochester Duesenberg engines are an important part of Duesenberg history. And I can assure you that the performance of those 4 cyl long stroke, high torque, high-geared fours is quite spectacular. And the air flow and combustion chamber characteristics of the horizontal valve layout was very clever for its time.

Ivan Saxton

[Guest ChrisSummers]

I have nothing against Model As at all--I agree, they were the most technologically advanced cars of the period, probably more so than the J since they came first and set the standard for what followed. And I drooled over the Duesy-engined ReVere that RM auctioned off a couple of years ago.

But like some people love all Fords but prefer the '49s or all Chevys but prefer the '57s, I'm a J guy. Can't help it. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

[Ivan Saxton]

Sorry I misunderstood your objectives, Chris. Model J was Ray Wolff's favourite car too, but he also hd very much broader interests. Actually, Ray persuaded me to buy my A from a friend of his in Mexico, and expedited the deal. If your do indeed restrict your site to just the J your will exclude most of the history of Duesenbergs; and will give the internet community little understanding of their engineering creativity. Some of the best stories predate the J. ALan Powell bought his car from the factory in 1923 when he was 23, and Fred drove him round the Speedway in it before delivery. He drove it to Molsheim where Bugatti personally conducted him on a tour of the estate while mechanics and draftsmen attempted to copy features that interested them. Mr Powell's phone number was still listed in the Melbourne directory till he was nearly 100, surely the longest surviving original Duesenberg owner.

I am disappointed that you do not intend to cover the whole Dueseenberg topic. The shame is that people will be less interested and make far fewer contributions; which will mean that the value of whaat you do will be rather more modest than otherwise. Regards, Ivan Saxton

[Guest ChrisSummers]

If you're so interested, Ivan, than by all means start your own list. :-) I've found it to be a very interesting and entertaining experience, and I've met a lot of wonderful new car buddies through it. And you'll help quite a few people who want to know what happened to the car they saw at so-and-so's museum when they were younger.

And you're right, there's nobody out there--other than Randy Ema, I assume-keeping track of early cars.

P.S. I do think I'll talk to Randy Glover (who puts the list online for me) about changing the name to the "Duesenberg Model J Registry," since it does tend to be misleading...

[West Peterson]

How about a link?

[Guest ChrisSummers]

http://www.automotivehistoryonline.com/DuesyRegistry.htm

Being created by an amateur historian learning as he goes along, there are some errors--I am no Randy Ema and I don't pretend to be. I am working on Version 2.0 which is vastly improved and expanded and will hopefully be posted before summer. (Please ignore the number built column. It's GONE on the next version.)

[West Peterson]

Thanks, Chris

While the design for the Modal A Duesenberg was conceived in 1919, the reason you can't find a 1920 Duesenberg photograph is because the first Duesenberg passenger car was a 1921. The photos of the "1919" Duesenberg you have, according to Randy Ema they are actually of a 1921, but has been incorrectly identified as a 1919 by its original owner (the car is still owned by the original owner's family, and continues to be misidentified).

[Guest ChrisSummers]

The Duesenberg Registry is mine. The rest of the Duesenberg pages on Automotive History Online are run by Randy Glover, who, like me, is an amateur historian(and a lot braver than I for tackling a project the size of AHO). But thanks for pointing that out, West. :-).

[jeff_a]

Dear Chris,

I just finished looking at the Duesenberg Registry and enjoyed seeing your work. I have a question: are there any museums that have both an Auburn, a Cord, and a Duesenberg AND a Packard, a Peerless, and a Pierce-Arrow that you know of? How about private collections? I can't think of any, but wouldn't be surprised if there were.

I have only seen one Duesenberg: J214 at the Reynolds-Alberta Museum. I saw this Phaeton Royale in Wetaskiwin, Alberta this March while attending an antique car restoration workshop. The current location isn't noted on your database, but you did say that you were updating it. The R-A-M is just south of Edmonton, Alberta and was built in 1992. It's a Provincial transportation museum with one large and two very large buildings housing aircraft; ag machinery; and cars & trucks. Total of the latter is about 370, ranging from "as-found" to restored. The Duesenberg is restored, has been there several years now, and is one of their key exhibits.

I don't own one, but I'm a member of the Peerless Motor Car Club. I spend a lot of time doing online research on the Peerless Company. We just got our own Forum on the AACA website, in case you hadn't seen it.

---Jeff

[Guest ChrisSummers]

Thanks, I enjoy putting it together! J-214 is still in the Museum.

The Nethercutt Collection fits the bill--two Cords, several Duesenbergs, an Auburn Twelve, multiple Packards and Pierce-Arrows, and two or three Peerlesses, plus, as one of my friends says, "everything else worth being caught dead in." I'm sure the LeMay Collection, in all its massiveness, has at least one of all of those too.

The ACD Museum has everything but the Peerless, and one would be a nice addition to their collection. I'd like to see the V-16 prototype on loan there for a while, since it shares several features with some Murphy Duesenbergs.

[jeff_a]

Thank you for pointing out that the Nethercutt Collection has what I call the two triple crowns of American car collecting: Packard-Peerless-Pierce Arrow & Auburn-Cord-Duesenberg. Since my last post, I have read that one other museum may have all six as well: the Northeast Classic Car Museum in Norwich, NY.

I guess that wouldn't be a bad addition to have a Peerless in the ACD Museum. I would reccommend a 1929 "8-125" Sedan like the one advertised on antiquecar.com until a few months ago. ---Jeff

[Guest ChrisSummers]

I'd like to see the Crawford loan the ACD Museum the V-16 prototype for a few months. Frank Hershey used the same "cut-in" doors on two Duesenbergs (surviving) and a Cord L-29 (gone).

[jeff_a]

Have you ever read any of the conflicting reports on the 1931 Peerless prototype cars? One version says there was just the one car. Another suggests one V-12 and one V-16. Then there's version "3.0", with one V-16 and two V-12's. There's even a variation that has FOUR chassis'; some aluminum, some steel, some V-12, some V-16 driving Cleveland-Pasadena for testing purposes and to get bodies installed!!!! One of the four versions says that a second V-16 car was finished, with an aluminum blind-rear-quarters sedan body installed.

Can you imagine finding one of these other Peerlesses...if they ever existed, that is? Pret' near impossible, as they say in Tuscaroras County...but no more unlikely than Jay Leno walking around in old N.Y. City parking garages asking "You got any old cars?" and finding a Duesenberg Town Car. ---Jeff

[Guest ChrisSummers]

I usually hear that three were built, with the Crawford car being the only survivor.

Jay Leno didn't stumble upon that town car. Its location was known for years, it was just that the owner would not sell. (I guess his star power finally swayed them.) Fred Roe photographed the car in the garage for his book.

[jeff_a]

Gee, I was a bit mistaken about the Duesenberg. I spend more time than I should trying to locate Peerless autos...and was hoping that Mr. Leno had found an easier way than the usual L.R.P.* I did read about the many years he politely asked an owner about a Duesenberg he had a lead on before he even got to go near it.**

Sometimes, even things as rare as as Duesenbergs, 4 1/2 Liter Bentleys, and Peerlesses get found. A year ago -- I didn't know where any Peerless cars & trucks were and had never seen one in person. Then I saw a magazine article which pegged the number of remaining Peerlesses at about three dozen. That interested me in sleuthing-around a bit, and I have now located over 250. Some are "leads", some are the real deal, and I've even seen three in person. ---Jeff

[jeff_a]

* Long Relentless Pursuit

** a 1927 Model X, I believe

[Guest ChrisSummers]

It's fun, ain't it?

Every J owner I've ever directly contacted has responded (even if one did give me the wrong engine number for his car...).

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Hi Chris, nice work, love those histories of ownership - its just interesting. I sent you a PM as I wanted to provide you an update on a couple of local cars here in CT.

[Durant Mike]

Hello Dusenenberg lovers!

The Durant Motors Automobile Club just had their National meet last week in Auburn, Indiana. The highlight of the week there was our banquet at the ACD Musuem. Every member who had not been there before was extremely impressed to say the least. The cars were fantastic, and the restored showroom in the art deco style was breath taking. For those of you who have never made it there, you have to put it on your list of "must do's". Also if any car club is looking to have a meeting place and banquet, the ACD museum is very accomidating and great to deal with.

[Guest ChrisSummers]

I think the building is better than the cars...and I LIVE for the cars.

[llopdoro]

As Gullwing Motor Cars in NY is offering a JN Rollston Convertible Sedan said of 1934 but I believe it is of 1935, I was looking an old issue I have in my archives about a 1935 J Rollston Torpedo Victoria offered by Bill Patton of Pacific Newport Classics. Your Registry does not give the same information as what he was giving, J409 in your registry is Hillegas Speedster and Chassis #2597 is not existing. Where is the truth?

Here is the text I was annexing to the pictures I have: Four Convertible Torpedo Victorias were designed by Gordon Buehrig and produced by Rollston for Duesenberg clients. This is one of only two designed with the stylish scoop fenders, front and rear. It was delivered to its first owner, Curtis King of the famous Texas King Ranch, on July 22, 1935. This Model Rollston Convertible Torpedo Victoria body (Number 2597) was transferred to the present chassis with Engine No. J-409 which was originally an SJ supercharged chassis and would be correct returning it to that designation. An original Duesenberg-bodied Rollston Torpedo Victoria body on an original Model J Duesenberg chassis. This is a fully recognized Classic having received both Auburn-Cord-Duesenberg Club & Classic Car Club of America Certified Category No. 1 Full Classic status. Restoration was undertaken by internationally recognized Duesenberg authority and historian, Randy Ema in Orange, California. Awarded Best In Class at the Pebble Beach Concours d' Elegance and also presented the Pebble Beach Concours d' Elegance Design Excellence Award. The paint is miles deep burgundy color with tan top and saddle leather interior. The chassis is as perfectly restored as the exterior body finish and the mechanics are as new. Although started regularly and driven around the block, this point show car has logged very few miles since completion. J-409 was invited back to the August 20, 2006 Pebble Beach Concours d’ Elegance and we decided to paint it again (2006) for this prestigious event. A great time was had by all as we participated in the Tour d’ Elegance, a fifty mile drive through Monterey and Carmel. Although a high point contender, having already won Best In Class we decided to enter it for display only and allow others to receive their first time awards. A late 1940s photograph appears on Page 220 of Fred Roe's book "Duesenberg, the Pursuit of Perfection" identified as J-573.

[llopdoro]

You are saying in your registry you can't have access to PACIFIC NEWPORT CLASSICS, then try http://pacificnewportclassics.com/ , it works!there are some pictures of this car , but no pictures of J-303 Rollston Convertible Berline with chassis #2320

Edited April 16, 2013 by llopdoro (see edit history)

[Guest Tawom]

Does anyone know if there is another link to the online Duesenberg Registry, since automotivehistoryonline.com does not seem to work any more?

 

Thanks.

[alsancle]

Get Elbert's Duesenberg book.  It has all the chassis numbers with original bodies listed in the back.

[Guest Tawom]

Thanks alsancle.

 

I'm on the hunt for a copy of that book already!

 

I wondered about the online registry as it was a downloadable, which I previously had a copy but some how accidentally deleted it.

I was updating the info as I came across more and more available on the net, and cataloging photos as well.

 

I will keep looking.