Guest DeSoto Frank Posted May 4, 2004 Share Posted May 4, 2004 Here's a question that should generate some interesting responses...I am considering the purchase of a friend's 1981 Cadillac Sedan de Ville, with the V-8/6/4 engine.The car has been well-maintained, and all the engine control gizmoes are still fully functional...Is this car likely to develop any collector value on account of its unusual engine?(I know this is bit like asking if a '74 Pinto or a Yugo will ever become "collectible"...or even perhaps "valuable")I plan on using the car as a Sunday driver / long-trip car...What thoughts do you folks out there have on this dinosaur ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 4, 2004 Share Posted May 4, 2004 i've never heard of anyone running that 8-6-4, they all unplug that function. Still, unless it was a v12, i would not hold your breath. The engine like most of the '80's cars, are still all in the $3,500 price range.But, i would enjoy it... A friend has an '84 eldo, with 28k, and all it dose is run the battery down with the auto-leveler motors. It's a big paper weight, if you don't use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted May 4, 2004 Share Posted May 4, 2004 Frank, I'd look around first to see if those engine controls are still available. I'd hate to think about any of that complex system quitting hundreds of miles away from home, with the likelihood of finding a mechanic who actually knew anything about it near zero. If it quit with all 8 cylinders would be one thing, but if it quit and left you on 4, well, you get the idea.It was an interesting and advanced concept and could probably be made to work with today's electronics. Surprising no carmaker has revived it.The reason it didn't catch on was because it was prone to failure, and Cadillac owners weren't keen on their new Caddy spending more time in the shop than on the road.I'd say yes, it will have some collector value just because of its engine management sytem and the fact one still exists and is functioning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6219_Rules Posted May 4, 2004 Share Posted May 4, 2004 Frank, the 8-6-4 was a good experiment, and one that worked until something in the computer got out of sync. I know of several people who run it and have very good performance out of it. But it is true, the computer system is unreliable. Additionally, as with the HT4100, the experiments were palmed off on the public in an effort to eek out 25+ mph. I am not absolutely certain but I think it is an aluminium block with cast iron sleeves which has been problematic.I know that is true with the HT4100. Most importantly, if the car has been kept well, the oil changed religiously and the coolant kept up, and all maintenance done properly, then it is a good buy. The controls are available if you know where to look but they are getting harder to find, but I suspect that with the new Chrysler 300, a third party manufacturer will turn up that makes or repairs them. There are specialty chapters in the CLC that handle the HT4100. Perhaps there is one for the 8-6-4. You can always check there and for more information, check the Cadillac database at The CLC Cadillac Database If I can be of any more help, let me know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andynator Posted May 4, 2004 Share Posted May 4, 2004 ...snip... It was an interesting and advanced concept and could probably be made to work with today's electronics. Surprising no carmaker has revived it...I was just reading in C & D that the new Dodge Magnum sedan will disable an entire cylinder bank, but it's a hydraulic control via a dedicated oil line that holds the intake and exhaust valves closed until oil pressure is increased (ie you "step on it") and the valves re-open. Neat, and no electronic wizardry.Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R W Burgess Posted May 4, 2004 Share Posted May 4, 2004 Wonder what happens to all of that compression, when the pistons come up with nary a valve open to release the pressure? I guess without an explosion that wouldn't be a problem?? <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DeSoto Frank Posted May 4, 2004 Share Posted May 4, 2004 Probably does the same thing as a Stirling cycle hot air engine... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48LCCOUPE Posted May 5, 2004 Share Posted May 5, 2004 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...snip... It was an interesting and advanced concept and could probably be made to work with today's electronics. Surprising no carmaker has revived it...I was just reading in C & D that the new Dodge Magnum sedan will disable an entire cylinder bank, but it's a hydraulic control via a dedicated oil line that holds the intake and exhaust valves closed until oil pressure is increased (ie you "step on it") and the valves re-open. Neat, and no electronic wizardry.Andy </div></div>Caddy is touting the introduction of their 16 cyl 1,000 HP engine when they can find a nose to stick it under. Also claiming a computer model 21+ mpg highway. It will do that by dropping all the way down to 4 cyl on highway cruise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest imported_Joe Kieliszek Posted May 5, 2004 Share Posted May 5, 2004 Hello,I believe both Chevrolet and GMC are reviving the V-8-6-4concept as it was demonstrated earlier this year at theCleveland & Detroit auto shows. It will be an optional enginein the full size pickups either next year or 2006.Joe Kieliszek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave@Moon Posted May 5, 2004 Share Posted May 5, 2004 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Is this car likely to develop any collector value on account of its unusual engine? </div></div> My best guess is that this engine is the equivalent of late-50's air-ride suspensions. It was an over-reaching of engineering that can only really be seen in retrospect as a huge mistake. The main problem with that comparison is that air suspensions were installed in otherwise interesting cars of a very short (and therefore comparatively low) production. A 1981 Sedan de Ville is nearly identical to a 1990 Calais sedan, and precious little different from a 1977 Sedan de Ville. Cars just didn't carry the same panache during this period, and I've yet to meet someone who seriously collects them. When 1957 Chevys were 20 years old, they were already an icon in the collecting market. Major originality guides had been published on Camaros and Mustangs within 8 or 9 years of their release. It's 20 years on now, and I for one am still waiting for even the slightest sign of interest in 80's cars. I think we'll be waiting a long time for <span style="font-style: italic">Consumer Guides' <span style="font-weight: bold">Cars of the 80's</span></span>. And when it does come out I doubt they'll be a whole lot of four-door sedans featured.Even worse, collector interest in luxury cars pretty much dies after 1964, at least for domestic makes. I doubt there's a Caddy in <span style="font-style: italic">any</span> year after '64 worth more money than 5 or 6 Chevys from the same year (with the possible exception of the last 70's Eldo ragtops). Therefore, while an operating air suspension system of a '58 Buick adds interest to an interesting car, the '81 V-8/6/4 just adds complication to unloved era's remnant. In one case for a collector who's not going to drive the car much it could add some value, for the other it's a matter of limiting the car's appeal to a trailer-queen crowd that isn't interested.I think the car may be a nice low-cost ride for a while, but as a future collectible you've got a longer wait for that than anyone'd reasonably put up with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 5, 2004 Share Posted May 5, 2004 dave,you are right, but I do slow down to check out an old AMC Gremlin,or Anbassador, Pinto,or Mavrick from time to time when I see them at a show.I'm shock when I see a nice car like he is taking about, and say to myself.... what would I do with it.there are even nice 1998, low mile cars around without good homes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48LCCOUPE Posted May 6, 2004 Share Posted May 6, 2004 DETROIT, Jan. 6--Last night at the Detroit Opera House, Cadillac unveiled two stunning concepts. The first was the XV16 concept engine--a 1000-hp 1000-ft.-lb. 13.6-liter (830-cu.-in.) 16-cylinder monster. <span style="font-weight: bold">The 32-valve V16 features Displacement On Demand and can run on a mere four cylinders under light load, eight under moderate load or all 16 for maximum thrust</span>. GM says it can deliver 22 mpg using this technology. Cadillac was the first manufacturer to produce a V16 in the Thirties and the beautifully crafted XV16 is a fitting tribute to that heritage. Also paying tribute to that heritage and providing a home for the XV16 is the Cadillac Sixteen concept car. Built by hand to emulate the handcrafted cars of Cadillac's glory years, the Sixteen is arguably the star of this show so far.http://popularmechanics.com/automotive/auto_technology/2003/4/cadillac_sixteen/print.phtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amphicar BUYER Posted May 6, 2004 Share Posted May 6, 2004 I was a wrench at McCaddon's Cadillac/Olds (Boulder, Co) when those cars came out. They and the diesel Oldsmobiles kept us busy with warranty work. None the less, they need a caretaker just like any other dying breed. They were are hard to drive in town with only 4 cylinders hitting!If you are getting it at a reasonable price and you like the car... why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DeSoto Frank Posted May 6, 2004 Share Posted May 6, 2004 "If you are getting it at a reasonable price and you like the car... why not? "The price is "whatever I want to pay for it", and the seller (a friend) wants me to take it home and test drive it for a week or so (tough to do w/o tipping(ticking?)-off the wife!), before making a final decision...My friend has been using this beast as a daily driver since he inherited it from an Aunt (original owner) about 2 years ago...I'll at least do the test drive; I wanted to see if I could get a feel from folks who may have owned one as to what sort of grief I may be inviting upon myself...Perhaps I've been spoiled only having to do the gas & oil thing with the '41 De Soto.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6219_Rules Posted May 6, 2004 Share Posted May 6, 2004 Frank, this is just my opinion and is not meant to reflect those of the AACA or other members at large......if I were you, I would stick to the '40s , 50s or 60s and forget anything after 1977. I love my '77 Eldorado ( I just got it back from the shop and it is soooo sweet) but honestly, the '47 is such an easy car to own and drive. Since the '77 is meant to be a daily driver, I can afford to work on the '47 until I feel it is reliable enough to sell the '77. I will miss the A/C a bit but other than that I really would rather not have the headaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48LCCOUPE Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 If it's newer than 1972, it still has that darn new car smell, and is almost still covered under warranty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DeSoto Frank Posted May 7, 2004 Share Posted May 7, 2004 Someone should market "Old Car Smell"...One of my fondest memories is of the smell of my Grandad's '54 Chevy pick-up...A combination of old dry horsehair seat stuffing, tinged with a hint of old grease, and faint touch of gasoline fumes...When I see a fifty-plus year-old survivor car at a summer show, if the windows are rolled down, I carefully stick my head in and take a deep whiff...(Mind you, rodent excrement, dead critter carcasses, & mold from leaky car are NOT part of the desired olfactory ingredients in my "Old Car Smell")We could even have different "flavors" to reflect different makes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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