Steve Moskowitz Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Don't want this to end up in the rants section but I just opened my July issue of Hemmings and was rather astounded about some recent auction results. I seriously would like some discussion on where the hobby is today in light of the economy and predications of doom and gloom that I have heard. Check the results of the recent collection auction in Pennsylvannia...prices were very strong. I am not sure I agree with their average selling prices but the auction figures on 20's and 30's cars were higher than I have seen in awhile. The same results were seen at the Dick Kughn auction...I wonder if the large collections just bring a premium. The topper was an ad for a 1972 Olds 4-4-2 convertible W-30 4-speed that the owner was asking $128,500!!! Can't figure out why he just didn't make it 129K! It is only about 78k more than I personally know any car of this vintage has ever sold for before.....I really do wonder though, what is happening in the market. I have tried to sell one of my two Curved Dashes at almost half the price of two that went thru auctions. I guess the auction way may be the best, but maybe I should keep holding on to cars for the next 20 years and sell my collection! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ex98thdrill Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 It's funny you mention that. When I first came home from the Middle East, my wife and I went to Las Vegas for a very needed vacation. When I was out there, I went into a few museums where I saw some cars priced high enough to give you a nose bleed, and the quality of the cars weren't any better (or as good) as what you see at your local cruise nights, let alone at an AACA meet. I went to one Museum where a guy had two '59? Ford Starliners with the retractible tops that weren't junk, but they weren't perfect. The owner claimed they were both worth in the $100,000.00+ range. I guess one of them was the very first one built and the other one was the very last, but for $100,000 I didn't feel the car was that nice, nor were they something that I would need that bad for that price. I don't know if it's the heat, or the intense lifestyles of the highrollers, but from what I saw, prices on classic and antique cars in Las Vegas is insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 We should all keep the concept of "value" or "worth" in perspective. Anything is valued or worth what some fool is willing to pay for it. There are rational buyers and sellers and irrational buyers and sellers. Any combination of them can lead to a very different transaction for the same item.Big Auctions seem to lend themselves to spur of the moment hype and emotion which brings out the irrational side of the equation. Not to speak of that they bring out the buyers that don't have to ask "how much?"Goin' out to buy some lottery tickets! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DizzyDale Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Dear ex98thdrill,I believe people go to Las Vegas to get away from the REAL world for a while and apparently some dealers have settled there to take advantage of that mind set.diz <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Stoneberg Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 I went to an event put on by RMAuctions this past week and I thought the prices were depreseed over what I had seen before.The same 1959 Syliner with the retractable roof sold for just a little over 20K and it was in good shape.Some of the more expensive cars (Packard Dual Cowl Phaeton, Supercharged Auburn, and Chrysler 300) didn't get anywhere near there reserve.Sure they sold some cars, but not for what I have seen them go for previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTW Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Agreed! I worked with a company who ran a sports memorabilia auction where bidders got a catalog in the mail & would bid by phone. I saw some items sell for the craziest prices - much higher than the piece was worth. and sometimes we had 2 of those items & it couldn't bring that price in a retail setting. Some of the bidders only bought items from us in the auction setting - they admitted they like the thrill of the auction. Go figure :::shrugging shoulders::<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There are rational buyers and sellers and irrational buyers and sellers. Any combination of them can lead to a very different transaction for the same item.Big Auctions seem to lend themselves to spur of the moment hype and emotion which brings out the irrational side of the equation. Not to speak of that they bring out the buyers that don't have to ask "how much?"</div></div> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveBerg Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 Being in the collectibles business all of my life I follow many markets very closely. While Cars are my love they are not my business, however, i do watch the collector car market with great interest. Right now in virtually all fields of collectibles what I am seeing are numerous collectors that are momentarilly "cash rich". What has happened is that these people were either smart enough or lucky enough to get out of the stock market in time. However only to find that the money was worth nothing in the bank. Sooooooo ! Given this somewhat enviable situation they find themselves with an unsusal surplus of money. What to do ?? They buy themselves a toy! Be it a car or whatever. It seems in all the various collectible fields this is happening. Naturally causing a visible increase in prices of the "right" things. Whether this situation will continue or whether prices will level back remains of course to be seen. Markets are funny things often changing on a whim or thought. Anyway this is my perception of what is happening at the moment. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB-ed Posted May 23, 2003 Share Posted May 23, 2003 In the realm of modest cars of the 20s and 30s sold the usual way, person to person, we in the Dodge Brothers Club are finding that prices are indeed hedging up gradually, year-by-year, after everything crashed eight years ago or so when those who were manipulating the market dropped out. A $5,000 to $8000 #3 car two years ago is now selling in the $9000-12,000 range. This is based on actual sales, not hopeful prices in advertisements, as we are seeing in our club. Personally, I am not convinced that this is good. The hobby was fun again a few years ago and may return to the greed and deceitfulness of a decade ago as prices go up again. Fortunately, this time the increase may be a true market increase and not an artificial manipulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ex98thdrill Posted May 24, 2003 Share Posted May 24, 2003 Yeah Diz, you're right. The only reason that I went to Vegas was to go to the car museums, visit the race track, enjoy the warm weather, and see a few shows. I didn't want to sit on a beach, or take a cruise. As for the gambling, I didn't. After spending 8 months gambling in the middle east, I thought I'd avoid gambling in Vegas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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