Nitnoid screw question 1st gen seat trim

[Deanoko]

'64 here, but probably the same for other years:

There are little sheet metal screws that hold the plastic trims on the bottoms of the bucket seats, hiding the 4 way electric track hardware.  I have 1 original(?) screw that threads readily into the metal frame of the seat.  It looks like a typical pan head phillips #6 sheet metal screw, BUT the thread pitch is less than what I've found at the hardware store.  Those don't work and #8s are too big.  Am I crazy, or is this actually a machine screw hole that the one sheet metal screw I have just happens to also thread into?  TIA! 

[1965rivgs]

  The plastic trim was originally secured with plastic push pins. There is no such animal as an original screw...but trim screws are frequently used as a substitute.

Tom Mooney

Edited May 23, 2023 by 1965rivgs (see edit history)

[Riviera63]

25 minutes ago, Deanoko said:

'64 here, but probably the same for other years:

There are little sheet metal screws that hold the plastic trims on the bottoms of the bucket seats, hiding the 4 way electric track hardware.  I have 1 original(?) screw that threads readily into the metal frame of the seat.  It looks like a typical pan head phillips #6 sheet metal screw, BUT the thread pitch is less than what I've found at the hardware store.  Those don't work and #8s are too big.  Am I crazy, or is this actually a machine screw hole that the one sheet metal screw I have just happens to also thread into?  TIA! 

As Tom said they are held in place by plastic push pins. They are used on all of the trim pieces except one on the right side of the driver's seat. That one is held in by a screw. I have attached some pictures showing these on my seats. You can find these push pins at various parts stores. Used on a lot of cars for interior pieces. Do not get them too long, at least for the ones on the outer trim piece. If they are too long they will catch/rub on the inner trim piece. Ask me how I know. See first picture.

 

Bill

 

 

[Deanoko]

Thanks to both of you guys!  Clears up this mystery.  The seat in the photos has a lot higher base mounting than mine do.  What are they in?

I see the joystick here is on the seat.  Mine is on the deluxe trim door panel.  I am missing the "uppers" .  Probably broken off long ago. I can see the fastener holes but didn't know what went there. 

[RivNut]

The seats in the picture are from a car equipped with the standard interior; the joy stick on the door’s armrest would be on a car with the custom interior option.

[Riviera63]

16 minutes ago, Deanoko said:

Thanks to both of you guys!  Clears up this mystery.  The seat in the photos has a lot higher base mounting than mine do.  What are they in?

I see the joystick here is on the seat.  Mine is on the deluxe trim door panel.  I am missing the "uppers" .  Probably broken off long ago. I can see the fastener holes but didn't know what went there. 

 

Mine is a 63. The base should be the same as yours. The pictures were taken with the seat in different raised positions. The last 2 pictures are of the trim on the passenger seat. Attached is a picture of the seat all the way down. In that position you can only see the left outer trim piece. The outer trim piece is held on by separate brackets than the inner piece. 

 

Bill

 

 

[Deanoko]

My mounts are different.  The outboard only has a single bolt on either side and the supports don't appear to be as tall.  This shit is with the seat all the way up. I guess I am missing lowers not uppers. 

Edited May 23, 2023 by Deanoko (see edit history)

[Riviera63]

There are 2 brackets that hold the outer trim piece in place. Those 2 brackets mount between the bottom of the seat and the top of the seat rails. They are 2 separate pieces and not part of the seat itself. They were often discarded if the trim broke and/or the seat was taken apart. The bracket you have pictured holds the inner trim piece in place and is part of the seat rail. There is another bracket toward the front on the left which is part of the seat rail that also holds the front of this inner trim piece. The trim piece that you have pictured appears to me to be the outer left trim piece which would be held in place by those 2 brackets that mount between the seat bottom and top of the seat rails. There are 6 total trim pieces that go on these seats. 2 for the passenger seat. Four on the driver's seat, 2 on the left side and 2 on the right side. I can't do it right now but, I have pictures of all the pieces, brackets and where they go.

 

Bill

Edited May 24, 2023 by Riviera63 (see edit history)

[Deanoko]

I have 5 of the 6 trims.  My "feet"  are nowhere near as tall as the ones pictured in white. *(See below) In the photos there are 4 bolts holes on the outboard rear.  My seat only has 2.  The car is a 1 owner original prior to my ownership.  I have had the seat out recently to facilitate work under the dash. *The other possible explanation is that the standard interior seat travels up higher than my optional one, but that seems unlikely. I have a photo somewhere of the seat out and upside down, as I was rebuilding the transmission.  I will try to provide it. 

[RivNut]

Seat frames are the same for standard and custom interiors.

[Deanoko]

11 minutes ago, RivNut said:

Seat frames are the same for standard and custom interiors.

Then how about the mounts?  I repeat that my outboard rear does not match that pictured.  I have not located my tranny rebuild upside down photo yet.  I'm looking.  

[Riviera63]

5 minutes ago, Deanoko said:

Then how about the mounts?  I repeat that my outboard rear does not match that pictured.  I have not located my tranny rebuild upside down photo yet.  I'm looking.  

Mounts are the same also. My seat mounts  appear higher in the photos because it is out of the car and sitting on a flat card table. When in the car it appears the same as yours. If you only have 2 bolt holes in the rear the top bracket in the rear that goes between the seat bottom and the top of the seat track is gone. There are 7 attaching points on the left side. 4 in the rear, 1 about 2/3 of the way towards the front of the seat and 2 at the front. 4 of the 7 are up high so to speak to hold the outer trim piece and 3 of them are low so to speak to hold the inner left trim piece. The picture you posted shows the rear lower bracket which holds the left, inner piece. The inner trim piece does not move. The outer trim piece moves up and down with the seat. I do not have access to the computer right now that has pictures of all of the brackets, trim pieces and their location. Will dig them out tomorrow. 

[Deanoko]

I was talking about the # of bolts holding the seat to the floor pan, not the # of trim attachment points.   However, now that I see this photo, it looks to be the same except for the height of the rear anchors.  To me they still look a lot shorter.

Edited May 24, 2023 by Deanoko (see edit history)

[Chasander]

My seat appears to be more like Deanoko s. Bill what month was your car built? I’d like to do some comparing in K zoo. 

[Riviera63]

41 minutes ago, Chasander said:

My seat appears to be more like Deanoko s. Bill what month was your car built? I’d like to do some comparing in K zoo. 

 

8 hours ago, Deanoko said:

I was talking about the # of bolts holding the seat to the floor pan, not the # of trim attachment points.   However, now that I see this photo, it looks to be the same except for the height of the rear anchors.  To me they still look a lot shorter.

My car was built in May of 1963. Here is a shot of the bottom of my seat. No reason my seat would be any different than any of the 1963-1965 power seats. The mounting bases are the same. They appear taller when out of the car as they are not in the valley of the floor pan and bolted down into the carpet. The 3rd and 4th pictures I posted earlier are of the passenger seat. Looks the same to me. 

 

Bill

 

 

[1965rivgs]

9 hours ago, Deanoko said:

I was talking about the # of bolts holding the seat to the floor pan, not the # of trim attachment points.   However, now that I see this photo, it looks to be the same except for the height of the rear anchors.  To me they still look a lot shorter.

Dean,

  The trim piece which Bill pointed out is installed with a screw is on the lower left of the pic you posted. It appears to be gray in color and is broken. It is very likely yours may be in tact as the rate of survival is much greater on this piece as compared to the others. The head of the screw which retains this piece is visible at the lower left....but is not visible when the seat is installed.  There is also a molded in tab on the trim piece which indexes into a slot in the seat rail which can also be seen in your pic. In the pic of Bill`s seat posted after you posted this pic, the piece is in tact/whole but Bill has installed the screw from the top so the part of the screw opposite the head is visible. 

  The seat pedestals are the same height on the `63-`65 power units, but because of camera angle, Bill`s pedestals look taller...it`s an optical illusion.

Tom

[Riviera63]

Here is the piece Tom is talking about.

 

Bill

 

 

[Deanoko]

I have this piece and had it in place with the seat out of the car, but took all the outer trims off before reinstalling the sest for fear of breaking  them in the process.  Then I couldn't remember where it went.  I see now that the manual passenger seat mounts are less incumbered and therefore look longer. 

[XframeFX]

A little off topic but related to the Driver's Seat.

Upholsterer says my seat has been re-repaired and ready for pickup again. Before re-reinstalling on my 3rd front carpets, I'd like to address the seat transmission. With all the re- redo's, I am now only interested in quick & dirty fixes. There are 2 security screws in non blind threaded holes in the transmission case. Thinking "Fluid Film" lubricant injected into those screw holes will soften the 60 year old lubricant inside?

Will try this short-cut tomorrow if I can find my security bit.

[Deanoko]

It's not hard to pull the unit apart and clean it.  99% sure the grease has hardened and bound things up.  I don't think squirting lubricant inside will free up anything. 

[Chasander]

The number of mounting holes is different, unless you drilled extra holes to get more leg room. (As I did)

[Riviera63]

On 5/25/2023 at 4:51 AM, Chasander said:

The number of mounting holes is different, unless you drilled extra holes to get more leg room. (As I did)

 

4 mounting holes on the left and 2 on the right is all I have ever seen on the driver's seat. That does not mean there aren't other configurations out there. Dean's mounting brackets appear to be the same as mine. I reversed the U brackets on the front of the driver's seat to move the seat further back to get more leg room. I did not have to drill any holes on either side as the extra holes lined up perfectly. I did have to enlarge the extra hole slightly on the right side so the bolt would go through.

 

Bill

[XframeFX]

On 5/26/2023 at 7:04 AM, Riviera63 said:

I reversed the U brackets on the front of the driver's seat to move the seat further back to get more leg room. I did not have to drill any holes on either side as the extra holes lined up perfectly. I did have to enlarge the extra hole slightly on the right side so the bolt would go through.

Exactly what I did. This only relocates the seat 1" rearward. But no extra holes in the floor and every little bit helps.

 

Update: About to re-install my seats after cleaning and re-Lubing the power seat transmission. Left the cables attached. No need to test because seized plunger was obvious. Actually, I enjoy this kind of work, Fix it once and it's done and nothing major like heater core, engine tear-down etc. Last two images are fitting a 4th set of carpets. Colour is a bit off but eyes will be through the windshield if I can get it on the road soon enough.

Experience has me installing sill plates after the seats are in!