Interchangeability Pierce Arrow

[Bruce Skinner]

Can someone advise if there is a hydraulic lifter available,  that will interchange with those on a 1933 Pierce Arrow 836.

[edinmass]

There are four different generation lifters that can be used. There not all direct fit. There is only one guy that I know of that tests them in a jig...............often, if you have a ticking, you need to find another lifter, sometimes people attempt to rebuild them, most with limited success. Call John Cislak up in Massachusetts, he sells lots of new reproduction engine parts, and also has used stuff. 1-413-543-9017

 

1933 was the first style, and nothing directly interchanges. 

Edited May 29, 2020 by edinmass (see edit history)

[Bruce Skinner]

Which are the four generation lifters that can be used ?

[edinmass]

Call John he keeps up with all of it. They evolved over the years, and then later on you can swap out the lower units with a 40's Cadillac but it requires machine work. You can convert to solid lifters..........not a bad idea, as hydraulic lifters fail over time. I installed all NOS lifters in my car thirty years ago, and have had two go bad........If I were doing it over again, I would use solid lifters..........there is the danger of burning valves it not installed correctly......the lifters and not like modern drop in and go units. As you cut the valve seats the valve ten must be accomadated, or you will hang the valves open. 

[Rusty_OToole]

Have heard of replacing hydraulic lifters with solids especially on fifties hop ups of OHV engines. The problem is hydraulic cams don't have clearance ramps, you need to adjust with very small clearance and check and adjust frequently  and overall it was a poor idea. Do Pierce Arrows have a different cam design that allows the use of solid lifters?

[edinmass]

Pierce Arrow invented hydraulic lifters, patented them, and that devision of Pierce Arrow is still owned by GM. The early system was complicated, very difficult to produce due to very tight tolerances, and dirty oil raised hell with them. They were fine......if you properly serviced your car. When the car became old and of little value, that when the problems started. One last note.........if you use form a gasket or silicone sealer in a Pierce with hydraulic lifters...........you will wish you had never seen the stuff. Word to the wise......don't even try it.

[JACK M]

6 hours ago, Rusty_OToole said:

Have heard of replacing hydraulic lifters with solids especially on fifties hop ups of OHV engines

 

Hmm, I always thought that solid lifters needed a different cam profile than hydraulics.

Of coarse all those hopped up engines I build the lifters come with the camshaft.

Whether hydraulic or solid. (radical or more radical)

(seems like I might have even tried it once a long time ago)(might have been by accident)

[Rusty_OToole]

6 hours ago, JACK M said:

 

Hmm, I always thought that solid lifters needed a different cam profile than hydraulics.

Of coarse all those hopped up engines I build the lifters come with the camshaft.

Whether hydraulic or solid. (radical or more radical)

(seems like I might have even tried it once a long time ago)(might have been by accident)

That was my question. I know some guys put solid lifters into early fifties V8s with the stock camshaft because the OEM lifters pumped up at 4500 RPM. But it was not a good idea because hydraulic lifters have no clearance ramps. This meant they had to adjust the valves to .003 clearance hot and the clearance had to be checked and adjusted every week or two. If you gave them normal clearance they would clatter and you would lose lift.

 

Now Edinmass says you can put solid lifters in a Pierce Arrow that came with hydraulics. So my question is how does that work? Did they have the same cam profile as a solid lifter engine or do you have to change the camshaft or what?

[edinmass]

On the Pierce set up, you don’t need to change cams........on others, I have no idea. The foot of the lifter needs to be center less ground when you rebuild or replace the lifter hydraulic section.

[frededwarrds]

About the different cam profiles. I don’t think valve lift was that critical back in the old days. Down here in Aussie, most or all USA cars had solid lifters fitted. Certainly Packard and Chrysler poly heads, side valve and slant sixes and many other makers all had solids. The reason at a guess was the harsh conditions and scarcity of service; too much trouble. 

[Bloo]

Most, and probably all Chrysler poly v8 and slant sixes used solid lifters in the USA, too.

Edited May 30, 2020 by Bloo (see edit history)

[JACK M]

9 hours ago, Bloo said:

Most, and probably all Chrysler poly v8 and slant sixes used solid lifters in the USA, too.

And will run for hundreds of thousands of miles with no adjustments.

We had a slant six in the family that ran 300,000 in a Dart. Sold that car for more than we paid new.

[Bruce Skinner]

Thanks everybody, really appreciate your responses.