LAGONDA RAPIER.

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

2 hours ago, Rapier said:

Having confessed to being over 85 years old I cannot help wondering how many of the people reading this admit to being this old or perhaps even older?

 

Bj.

Oh yes, not only over 85 but still crawling around underneath their Vintage/Classic car?

Well, Bernie, not to steel your thunder, but I have you beat by a year, I think.    1/13/37.   Still working on the BUICK!  Intend to drive it 4000+ miles next month.   Lets go!

 

  Ben

[Rapier]

No Problem Ben,

I am actually 9-11-1936.  I just tend to "round-down" the years. I am still two years younger than the Lagonda it is 1934. I am not sure of its month. The only thing is that it had a full restoration and a NEW Body when I rebuilt it immediately after buying it.

 

Bernie j.

[Rapier]

My current task is to ensure that the Rapier (KG) will now be reliable enough to take to the UK and Europe with us next year.

 

Bj.

Edited June 21, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Many (most) of the people who look in at this thread from time to time will have seen similar photographs of the Lagonda Rapier before. The third photograph shows the engine with the air filters and the "distributor" removed. This has now been checked by "Performance Ignition" and has had the electronic "points" replaced. All that remains to be done is to "fine tune' the ignition timing. This involves carefully rotating the distributor (very slightly) until the idling is at it's "smoothest", ticking over at about 750 rpm and picking up smoothly without any hesitation when the throttle is slightly opened.

Looking at these photographs it is hard to believe just how many miles the car has been driven since it was rebuilt, in the 1970s.

[Rapier]

 Unfortunately the speedo only reads to 99,999 miles and there is no way of knowing the actual number of miles travelled in total.  It is more relevant as an aid to avoiding speeding fines. The two marks showing the equivelent to the permitted speeds in kilometres per hour. One (gold) for "built up areas" the other (black) maximum permitted.

Australia changed from Imperial (miles) to Metric (Kilometres) some years ago.

[Rapier]

Looking at the photograph of the cam-cover with the name Lagonda cast into it, I am reminded about the origin of that name. This takes us back to the 1890's when Wilbur Gunn founded the company. Like so many other pioneers of the motor industry he started building motor cycles and progressed to motorised bugys. When searching for a name for his company he was taken back to his birthplace in Ohio, America.  It was here that his parents had a farm on the banks of the Lagonda Creek. This in turn went back to the (Red)Indian's name for this stream. 

It all started there.

Edited June 24, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Further to the above, Wilbur Gunn was a young American who had gone to England to further his studies at Oxford.

[Rapier]

Changing the subject ever so slightly, I have on my desk the badge seen above. It dates from our 2010 visit to the USA to take part in the AACA's Diamond Jubilee. We had sold the Dixie Flyer back to the Kentucky Trailer Co, previously the Kentucky Wagon  Co, makers of the Dixie Flyer so we decided to deliver the car to them personally. As the AACA's celebrations were to be centred on Louisville this all fitted in precisely. This was our first and probably will be our only visit to the USA.

Below are three photographs, two show the Dixie Flyer standing in the original Kentucky Wagon Company's original factory, this was scheduled to be demolished shortly after our visit. The third photo is of an original Dixie Flyer screw-on hub cap from a original wood spoke wheel car. Durung my restoration I replaced the wood spoke wheels for wire spoke wheels as seen here.

The design for the roadster body was based on early photographs, the copy of these was sent to me by an AACA member.

The then Editor of the AACA Magazine arranged for the photographs of the car to be taken in and around the soon to be demolished original Wagon Co's factory.  

[DrData]

While we are changing subjects…has your son made any progress with the Morris?

[Rapier]

Not completely changing subjects, they are all important parts of my life with old motorcars. Steve lives about two hours drive away so I have not been to see how he is going. He also needs to work for a living. I know that he is working away on the Morris too but I am letting him work at his own pace.

I am having a mini clear out of my garage shelves, 50 years accumulated "stuff".

 

Bj

Edited June 26, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

We have just returned from visiting our son Steve, He currently has the Morris Raworth Replica in his garage, He is about to remove the partially dismantled engine so he can set about rebuilding it.

 

[Rapier]

Meanwhile I have now replaced the Rapier's rebuilt generator onto the motor, the Distributor drive is taken from the rear of this so I have just retimed the distributor and have the motor running again.

As you can see here there is not a great deal of room to work in.  AND I have not been polishing the brass bits, the concours people will be disappointed!

Actually the Rapier motor is (relatively) oil tight and is easy to keep clean.

It should be remembered, the Rapier (engine) sump has a capacity of TWO GALLONS so there is plenty to "splash about"!

Edited June 30, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

And now just a moment, I realise that almost every day I add  something very often about my car, the Lagonda Rapier, and yet I wonder how many of you if any really understand what it is about an eighty seven year old motor car that is so important to me?

I have just taken four photographs, two of the engine, one from each side and one of the front of the car and one of the interior (dash-board). The first two do not need very much explanation except perhaps the gear-change seen in the second photo. This shows the gear lever just where the drivers left hand falls directly from the steering wheel to it.  The dash carries a full set of instruments. Starting from left to right, these are the 0 to 100 mph speedo, the amp meter and with the combined ignition (key) switch. Next is the contents of the fuel (petrol) tank with a (8 day) clock beneath it. The second latge gauge is the rev-counter reading up to 6,000 rpm. Finally the other small (2 inch ) double gauge shows the radiator temperature and the oil pressure. Just about everything a driver needs to know.

 

The third photo is of the right  hand side of the engine.

This is worth some careful attention, Not only does it show the two 1.5 inch Su Carburettors with the basic air filters. You can just see the distributor nestled in between the carbs. It is driven from the rear of the "generator" or you may prefer Dynamo. This is driven from the front of these, is the water- pump.   Above this is the oil pump. This draws the engine oil from the sump vis the large capacity hose and is delivered to the (engine oil) distribution point on the left hand side of the motor. The electric petrol pump is mounted on the bulkhead above the rear carburettor.

The water pipe taking cooling water from the top of the cylinder hear to the radiator can also be  seen.

Finally the ignition distributor can be seen tucked in below the carburettors. The ignition leads go to the spark plugs, our of sight between the two aluminium cam-boxes. On the bulkhead just under the petrol pump and slightly to the right is the two way petrol supply tap, one side feeding from the main tank, the other gives access to the petrol reserve.

The steering box can also be seen mounted on the chassis rail, beneath the rear carburettor.

In the fourth photograph taken from the left hand side of the motor, starting from the front is the Electric cooling fan mounted directly  onto the radiator. Next is the oil pump mounted directly onto the front of the cylinder head. you can follow the hose from this down to where it feeds the full-flow oil filter mounted directly on the side of the cylinder block. Next to this is the (red painted) oil-level dip stick and the oil-filler cap.

This is tucked in below the four branch exhaust system.

Mounted to the rear of this is the (geared) starter motor. None the less everything about the motor and its associated parts are  readily seen and are fully accessible. This also applies to items such as the ignition coil and the electrical control box. Also mounted on the bulkhead and readily available is the electric starter solenoid switch.

Returning to the photograph of the front of the car. This is all very straight forward. Starting from the top of the photograph is the quick release radiator filler cap with the winged Lagonda Badge directly below it.

Mounted on the (stone) mesh grille is a Vintage Sports Car Club of Victoria (Australia).

On the cross bar also supporting the headlamps is the Vintage Sports Car Club (UK) and the Rapier Register (Club) badges. In the centre is the (Electric) horn. Beneath this and mounted on the (louvered) dumb-iron cover is a Brooklands Society badge. The main Lucas headlamps have metal mesh stone guards to protect the headlamp glasses. Mounted on the front of the dumb iron cover are two Lucas fog lamps.

 

Edited June 30, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Some of you may wonder what it is about Lagonda Rapiers that fascinates me. Just for a simple example, look at this connecting rod from a standard 1934 1100cc four cylinder engine and you may start to understand.

For example just look at the "big-end". Yes it is huge when you consider that it comes from production engine. Now try to imagine the crankshaft that this runs on.Look at the drawing showing a cross  section through the engine. Note the massive counter balanced crankshaft. Anyone with just the minimum of mechanical knowledge cannot fail to be impressed.

That there were under 500 of these engines/cars built over a four or five year period is perhaps understandable. My engine no longer has the oil pump in the sump driven by that long shaft  but has a modern pump driven from the front of the intermediate timing gear. Designed to run at engine speeds up to 6,000 rpm, it is virtually unburstable.

 

Bj.

Edited July 1, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Right now we are watching the bicycle Tour de France on our TV, enjoying revisiting some of the places we have driven through in the Rapier on earlier visits. Just two little Aussies in a little old car.

Our big question now is, Will we be able to do it again next year?

Bj.

Edited July 4, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Returning to the Rapier, rather than risk failure  of one of the original connecting rods, now very nearly 90 years old, I have used as a substitute those supplied as original equipment in the 2.5 and 3.5 Litre, Jaguar engines. While to some degree  these could be said to be "overkill" there is no record of one failing in a Rapier engine. KG has been fitted with these con-rods for some years now.

Apart from anything else the copper-lead based "Big-end shell bearings" are easily replaced with spares available "over the counter".

Bernie j.

[Rapier]

What really "gets up my nose" is the almost total lack of response to 99% of my posts.

Is it confusion, ignorance or a total lack of interest?

Is it really worth my while even opening up my computer to look at this forum?

I suspect the answer to this question is absolute silence.

If this is the case I should be spending my time elsewhere.

I am probably far better off polishing the Lagonda Rapier, There are some (two) copper petrol pipes underneath the car. The run from the tank at the rear of the car to the engine at the front.

In the past I have never bothered polishing these. 

I can almost hear someone asking, Why two pipes? Can anyone, as a parting gesture, suggest an answer?

Good---

Edited July 12, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

At the left-hand side of the above photograph you can just see one of these pipes entering a tap-thing. What on earth was I thinking of when I installed this. Incidentally this tap-thing could do with a good polish too! 

Going back and looking at this photograph again, I really am ashamed, there is so much of this engine that really needs a good clean and polish. Will it really matter is I never start this engine again.

If I am not going to start the engine this surely means that  I am never going to drive it again.

This being so I would be much better off to lift the car up onto four jack-stands. It would be much easier to get underneath it so that I can polish the underside of the car.  If I jack it (the car) up on an angle it would save me having to climb underneath it. Any other suggestions would be welcome--------

It is such a good investment, I really should never take it out of the garage again. 

I am sure that many, most, of you would agree.

Bj.

[old car fan]

I think it looks great.Drive the wheels off of it.Polishing will not make it run any better. 

[Frank Tate]

5 hours ago, Rapier said:

What really "gets up my nose" is the almost total lack of response to 99% of my posts.

Is it confusion, ignorance or a total lack of interest?

Is it really worth my while even opening up my computer to look at this forum?

I suspect the answer to this question is absolute silence.

If this is the case I should be spending my time elsewhere.

I am probably far better off polishing the Lagonda Rapier, There are some (two) copper petrol pipes underneath the car. The run from the tank at the rear of the car to the engine at the front.

In the past I have never bothered polishing these. 

I can almost hear someone asking, Why two pipes? Can anyone, as a parting gesture, suggest an answer?

Good---

I don't think it is any of those things Bernie.  More likely, it is the fact that your posts are in a section of the forum that doesn't get much exposure.  Maybe you could ask the mods to move this to the cars and restoration section.  Lots of eyes on that one.

 

I have no clue about the two copper pipes, other than maybe one is supply and the other return?

[Rapier]

Thank you Frank and OCF.

At least someone actually looks in here. I did think about shifting once before but I felt that "Btitish Cars" was more relevant to my interests. 

I am probably being unfair in my criticism. Re; Those two copper pipes, one is for the main supply the other for the reserve. 
The reserve is actually the bottom gallon or two of the same (main) petrol tank. You can just see the "two way" tap at the left hand edge of the photograph.

 

Bj.

Edited July 12, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Todays photographs show the fitting where the two pipes exit the top of the petrol tank and a clearer shot of the two way tap.

The photograph of this fitting on the top of the petrol tank is a "shocker" I will try to take something better tomorrow or over the weekend.

Bj.

Edited July 13, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[old car fan]

I always make it to your post,learn something, and see what you are up to.Follower for  years. Thanks.

[Rapier]

What can I say but thank you for your on going interest and support. 

Bj.

Edited July 13, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Further to my reference to the arrangement of the petrol pipes leaving the rear mounted tank.

The photographs herewith may go some way to explain the Rapier's system.Firstv a general view of the rear of the car and the fuel tank in particular.  From left to right the three items across the top of the tank are, 1. Petrol gauge sender unit.

2. The quick releast fuel filler cap.

3. The fuel outlet pipes (2). 

4. A close-up of the fuel delivery outlet.

This has two pipes attached to the underside. one, reserve, reaching down to the bottom of the tank.

The other the main delivery pipe is terminated about   three or four inches from the bottom of the tank.

The two pipes are taken among the right side of the car. There are two filters, one in each pipe under the rear of the car. There is also a back-up electric fuel pump inserted into the reserve pipe part way along the side of the car. This is designed to enhance the delivery of fuel in an emergency. i.e. A temporary blockage in the "main" pipe. This has a seperate switch in the driver's side of the dashboard.

The two pipes are taken along the drivers side to terminate at the two way tap mounted adjacent to the main electric fuel pump on the engine side of the bulkhead. Normally the one pipe is used unless the reserve (Bottom 2 or 3 inches) in the main tank is required. The one weakness in this system is that it relies on the driver to switch back to the "Main" supply when the fuel tank is replenished.

 

Bj.

Edited July 14, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[demco32]

i see you have a lagonda. nice car.

jaguar's too?

 

[Rapier]

Thank you demco32, It is a long time since I owned a Jaguar. I have had this Lagonda, the last in a long line, since the 1970s. I cannot see myself changing again although I do also try to have a project car.

My last project is a Morris this is out at my son Steve's place so he and his son Otto can do some work on it. 

The Morris is interesting as it is a (replica) of a Raworth Special. Cecil Kimber built six of these while he was still working for Morris prior to starting the MG division for Morris. Below is "our version" of a Raworth Special.

[Rapier]

To appreciate all this you must first know that I live in East Doncaster, a suburb of Melbourne. Melbourne is the capital city of the state of Victoria in Australia.

The Yarra River is the principle river flowing through Melbourne. The Yarra Valley extends out through the nearby "Hill-country". Our son Steven lives in Yarra Junction a small township about two hours drive from where we live.

 

Now for something different. This afternoon we have watched (on TV) yesterdays stage of the Tour de France, Helen has her map-book of France open so we can see how much of this years "Tour" we have "driven" in our previous visits to France in "KG" our Lagonda Rapier....... How lucky I am to have such an adventurous wife ready and able to "Navigate" on these wonderful drives is our car.

This photograph from the 2018 Australian Mille.

Looking back you may be interested to note, we are all 1930s models, the Rapier 1934, I am 1936 and Helen 1938!  

Edited July 15, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

To appreciate all this you must first know that I live in East Doncaster, a suburb of Melbourne. Melbourne is the capital city of the state of Victoria in Australia.

The Yarra River is the principle river flowing through Melbourne. The Yarra Valley extends out through the nearby "Hill-country". Our son Steven lives in Yarra Junction a small township about two hours drive from where we live.

 

Now for something different. This afternoon we have watched (on TV) yesterdays stage of the Tour de France, Helen has her map-book of France open so we can see how much of this years "Tour" we have "driven" in our previous visits of France in "KG" our Lagonda Rapier....... How lucky I am to have such an adventurous wife ready and able to "Navigate" on these wonderful drives in our car.

This photograph from the 2018 Australian Mille.

Edited July 15, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Now you will have to forgive me if I am boring you all.

Todays photographs show that the Rapier has barely aged in all the time since it CAME OUT all those years ago.   There is no question it will be ready to go should we manage to make that one last visit to the UK and France next year. The one big question is, will both Helen and I be ready and able to accompany it?

Above, this photo taken during our 2009 visit. Our earliest "rally plates" date back to 1994, the "Diamond Jubilee" of the VSCC (UK)..........

Edited July 15, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Now tomorrow we have our first VSCC Road event for some time.

I have just given KG a quick check over and all should be OK.

I have left the battery on (trickle) charge so it should start first press of the button.

It is about 3/4 full of petrol which should get to us to the start without any problem.

 

Bj.

[Frank Tate]

Very cool!   Post some pics!!

 

[Rapier]

Hello Frank

I will have to see if Helen has any photographs from today.

It was mainly a driving event that took up most of today. I am not sure of the actual distance driven but we did use the equivalent to a full tank of petrol. The Lagonda Rapier went extremely well for the full day's motoring.

Much of this being highway driving sitting on the legal limit, a steady 60 to 65 MPH.  (100kph).

 

Bernie j.

[DrData]

Bernie,

 

sounds like a great outing in the Lagonda. Glad to hear it is back out there, terrorizing the locals. 
 

last weekend, we attended a concours d’elegance at Keeneland racetrack in Lexington, KY, USA. Best of show was a 1935 SS Airline coupe…stunning in silver. Best story was a 275 GTB Ferrari, which the owner drove 4.5 hours to get to the show. Got a chance to chat with him…great, down-to-earth guy. Several stunning MG T series and an M-type…all benefitted from expensive paint jobs and arrived on trailers. Not near as much fun as driving them.

 

Cheers!

[Rapier]

Hello DrD.

I never cease to be amazed how people pay out huge sums on paint and trim on their cars only to cart them around in a trailer. I find it a shame that they have so little confidence in both the work they pay someone else to have all the fun doing any necessary work and then be afraid of driving their car in case something broke. Finally they have the gall to tell you what great enthusiasts (polishers) they are. Thinking about all this, they probably even pay someone else to polish their cars for them.

 

Bj.

Edited July 21, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

I really should save some of my praise for my faithful Peugeot. It is a 1997 405 Sri. a four cylinder, fuel injected, overhead valve. It has a five speed manual gearbox, front disc brakes and independant suspension. It also has the factory cloth interior with lamb-skin covers on the front seats. I only ever open the bonnet (engine covering) to check the radiator water level, it has a slight leak, and very occasionally the engine oil level. It always starts "on the button". my only complaint is that despite how many times I adjust the throttle opening it is reluctant to "idle". This can be annoying in traffic. It has the factory fitted rear (boot lid)

"Spoiler" and front and rear aerodynamic bumpers. It has a generous sized rear luggage compartment and provision to carry longer objects via a fold down central rear seat "arm-rest". It also has a sliding glass "sun-roof" and a rear tow-bar (trailer hitch). It also has five spoke "Mag-alloy" wheels.

It has no (visible) rust. It is a very comfortable and reliable "friend". Like so many "friends" it tends to be "taken for granted" and never  complains. It does get an occassional wash but I cannot remember when it was last polished. At the front it has rhe twin headlamps protected by clear plastic stone guards while there is an additional pair of (fog) lamps mounted low under the bumper. The turn indicator lights are incorporated in with the side (parking) lights.

As seen in the rear photograph, the rear seat passengers are provided with padded head rests.

We bought the then four month old car as a "Dealer's own "Executive" driven company car. At first Helen used it to drive to her office job with the Victorian Police. It was then passed to our eldest son Paul whe drove it for another year or two. Among his many adventures in the Peug. he drove it on a "Bird-watching" holiday into Central Australia. He managed to get it stuck in the sand while negotiating a "creek crossing". It took him a complete day to walk out to the nearest telephone where he could seek assistance and another day for a rescue vehicle could reach him. Once towed out he could then drive the car back "home". Finally it is now my personal every-day transport, seldom  leaving our local area.  It's one regular outing is to take me the half-dozen miles to my regular "Monday morning" game of "Petanque". At my present rate of usage it should last me for the rest of my (driving) life.

Seen through the rear window is the 2 inch square enamel "badge". This is from the Fougeres Rally an event that Helen and I have taken part in two or three times in the Lagonda Rapier. It is a "Gentle" touring event based on this pleasant part if France. I feel that it is more appropriate to the Peug. Somehow I think that it would is some way out of place on the Rapier.....

Edited July 22, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

I am perfectly happy to keep driving the Peugeot "dents & all". It takes me to all the places that I need to visit in complete comfort. From the drivers seat I do not even see or think about all those little dents.

If I need a change I can always drive Helen's VW or get the Rapier out of the garage.

Helen's VW is a 2006 "Jetta" saloon. It is a Two Litre "Turbo-diesel"  It is a little more than just  a Golf with a boot. It too is a manual, this time a SIX Speed with an overdrive top gear. It is effortless to drive and relatively economical. Helen bought it new when she stoped working for the Police Department. A job that she really enjoyed. It is a deep red with a dark grey cloth interior.

 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

Now back to the reason for this thread. My 1934 Lagonda Rapier "Eagle" two-seater.

All cleaned up and ready to go it has to be be best and most rewarding "pre-war' car that I have ever owned.

For the benefit of those who do not know it.

It was, as I have already mentioned, made in 1934. In fact Lagonda only built the Rapier from July 1934 until July 1935. After that date it continued to be made by a small "break-away" group of ex-Lagonda Company staff, using the name, "Rapier Cars". The only change was a new radiator badge with the name:- Rapier, the name Lagonda was removed from the two aluminium valve (Cam) covers.  The Lagonda wording was cut off the car's ID Plate attached to the bulkhead under the "bonnet". Those people who look in here on a regular basis will be familiar with all this but I will repeat if for the benefit of any newcomers,

The "Car Number" is slightly misleading as this does not refer to the number of Rapier (model) built but a number that only the Lagonda Company staff of the day would know its relevance precisely.

My "Rapier" has a much modified engine with the "Capacity" increased to a nominal 1500cc. It also has larger than standard "1.5" inch SU carburettors and modified cam profiles. This along with a higher rear axle ratio make the car infinitely more pleasant to drive.

 

 

Prior  to my purchase the car was fitted with a "less than beautiful" two seater racing body. It has in fact been in its present "Sports" two seater from for the greater part of its life.

This corresponds with the period of my owning the car.

It was fitted with 17" wheels when I bought it and these remain. All wheels including the spare are fitted with Michelin "Super Confort" low pressure tyres. These have a distinctive "chevron" tread pattern. They are run at a maximum pressure of 20 lbs.........

The (incorrect) spelling of the word Comfort. i.e. "Confort" is as used on the tire..

[Rapier]

Actually this is the correct "French" spelling of confort!

The tyres being Michelin are of French manufacture.

In case you missed it last time here is "that" photograph of the Lagonda again.

Bj.

Edited July 30, 2023 by Rapier (see edit history)

[Rapier]

And it is still the best "Light Car" of it's period!