What plugs are you running ?

[FLYER15015]

Well, I tried a search in the Chrysler, Airflow and technical, forums first and came up with nothing.

 

So, here goes. What spark plugs are you running in your flat head 8, or 6 ?

 

Mine is a '31 Imperial, but I'll bet a dollar to a donut she has a '34-'35 motor in her, as the dist sticks out the driver side of the block and there is no provision for a vacuum advance.

Maybe that's why Wayne C. looked at her and said no. Not an easy flip.

 

I checked in my Chrysler Instruction book and it gives me the plug and point gap settings, but not the plug type.

Right now she has Autolite 85's in her.

 

And of course, the kid at the local NAPA store says his book does not go back to the '30's, though we did find a cap and rotor for the dist. that also fits my '40 Buick.

 

I don't think talking plugs is the same as talking oil so we should be able to keep it civil.

 

Let the discussion begin............

 

Mike in Colorado

 

PS; yes I know the H2O pump is missing. Currently at the "Flying Dutchman" for a rebuild. Will report on that later.

 

 

 

Edited March 25, 2019 by FLYER15015 (see edit history)

[wldavis]

Well, that's odd, as I just went to the NAPA on-line store and it listed 10 spark plugs that were an "exact fit" for your car.

 

Among those listed were the Autolite 295's that I think are in my Plymouth now.  You may need to make another visit 

to this store.

[FLYER15015]

Yup, I have been on the "web" and it seems like A.C.Delco 45's and NGK B-4's are a match too.

 

Is that a '51 Plymouth in your picture ?

My 1st car was a '52 Belvedere.

We dropped a '55 Dodge red ram in it and scared the crap out of all the chevy guys.

But that was back in '59.

 

Mike

Edited March 25, 2019 by FLYER15015 (see edit history)

[Guest]

The NKG's are by far the better plug.

[FLYER15015]

9 hours ago, Tinindian said:

The NKG's are by far the better plug.

Yup I know, but I would like to stay "old school" and I don't care for Champion, so I would really prefer A.C. "green rings".

 

But I refer back to my original question, What plug and heat range are you running and why ?

 

Mike in Colorado

Edited March 25, 2019 by FLYER15015 (see edit history)

[Guest]

As I drive a 1930 Pontiac I was not suggesting a specific plug only that with 400,000+ plus miles in 59 years I have found NKG's to be far superior to all others.  With the original type AC's, Champion's or Autolite's they needed cleaning at 5000 miles and replacement at 10,000.  NKG's did not need cleaning and usually lasted 25,000 miles.  Just to answer your exact question I have run NKG AB-6 plugs for over 40 years.

None of this will apply to you as you are probably not using your car as a daily driver year round. When driving nearly 1000 miles a month every little bit helped.

By the way Champions are not really bad plugs, it is their conversion chart that is poor.  Unless you are conversant with a specific companies heat ranges and are able to read your old plugs original equipment is the way to go realizing of course that the automobile companies were mostly interested in their shareholders so their recommendations should be taken with a grain of salt.

I hope you enjoy your Chrysler.  If the rest of the car looks like the engine compartment it must be beautiful.

Happy hobbying.

[Gunsmoke]

Your engine looks like a 1931 284CI Deluxe CD8 engine, similar to the engine also used in later non-Imperial 8cyl Chryslers (note extra ribs/webs in lower crankcase, diagonal distributor/oil pump etc). It may have an Imperial thermostat control on top of head, and the 3" shroud at radiator may suggest retro-fitted with a shorter engine. Your exhaust manifold setup is different than CD8's. The head on my '31 CD8 engine measures 30.5" long for comparison. A '31 Imperial engine head would measure at least 33"-34". Your pistons may be 3.25" and not the 3.5" pistons" used in the 384CI Imperials in 1931. Lower CI may mean a different plug would be correct for a smaller engine. My engine came with old AC84 plugs and I am using NOS Autolite 376 plugs. BTW, find a distributor cap/rotor?

[c49er]

The big 384ci. Imperial and CW Airflow engines also have a stamped steel water jacket cover that's full length on the drivers side of the engine. 

[Spinneyhill]

Yes, it looks a lot like my Dodge 8. Here is a 1931 Imperial (for sale). It is a tourer at a dealer in Orange, CT.

 

This one is for sale for a mere $189,500.

This one purports to be a 1933 Imperial, but it's not is it?

Edited March 26, 2019 by Spinneyhill (see edit history)

[Gunsmoke]

Spinneyhill's 3rd pic is similar to my '31 Chrysler CD8 engine. However it has a gooseneck rad connection instead of the shutter operating thermostatic type, suggesting another model or a modified connection. The front motor mount appears to be the "floating power" type, suggesting 1932 or later Chrysler or Dodge.

[FLYER15015]

Yup, mine looks a LOT like Spinny's 3rd picture .

The head is 30.5" long, and there is no provision for the grille shudder rod in the fan shroud or the radiator itself.

Plus the head is dead flat where the thermostat bolts up.

The tag on the firewall says "body # 69".

I did find this number on the block back under the starter (642529-1). And a bit forward of that  DP 

                                                                                                                                                                         CD

Good gosh , did they throw a "Dodge" in her ? Or is it actually a (CD8) engine instead of a CG ?

 

Per the broker, Specialty Sales in Benecia, Calif. the restoration was done in 1980 by who knows (?) and the intake was changed and a home made adapter, which was quite well done, was made for the Carter carb

The carby (for Spinny) has 6-1887 cast on the float bowl lid and 0-1926 cast on the side of the throat. It actually works quite well.

They actually used a lamp base, brazed to a tube to adapt the carb to the air cleaner. Pretty good thinking back then.

 

Gunsmoke, yes I did find a dist cap, and rotor, and it is the same as my '40 Buick. Also fits a couple years of Pontiac 8's.

Found out someone had put the old one on crooked and she was stumbling on a couple of cylinders.

I did throw a set of A.C. Delco R-45's in her for now, as I had them on hand. She came with Autolite 85's.

These plugs are pretty much the same in terms of heat range.

I run A.C. Delco C-49's in the Buick as they are a bit hotter and readily available. Used quite often in generators.

 

Well, I sent out the wave and I'll wait for the backsplash.

Thanks to all for your help...........

 

Mike in Colorado

Edited March 26, 2019 by FLYER15015 (see edit history)

[Spinneyhill]

That DP over CD cast on the block is the give-away. Your engine is a CD engine. My DC does not have it, but my later spare has DC over CF cast into it at that location. CF was the De Soto 8. My head is 775 mm long = 30.5".

 

I believe the DC crankcase was strengthened to increase the bore to over 3" for the DK and CD engine. Mine only has two core plugs on the side, the one above has four so is probably longer. The 1931 DG-8 was a 3" bore, which I believe is about the limit for the block without strengthening.

 

Here is a 1932 DK-8, which had a 3.25" bore:

 

Notice the extra strengthening gussets above that lower ledge. This one also has a flat water outlet mounting and "floating power" engine mounts. This one still has two core plugs in the side.

Edited March 26, 2019 by Spinneyhill (see edit history)

[Gunsmoke]

Interesting concoction, likely a 284CI Mopar 8 circa 1932-34, with floating power and an added shroud to improve cooling. I have not seen one with the exhaust manifold above the intake as shown. I enclose a photo of that side for my engine, a first series CD8, 240CI. Note the fuel filter was an integral part of the factory fuel pump assembly, and in addition to what is shown, there was a heat shield above it to protect it from the hot manifold (I have made one for my car). You should re-locate the fuel filter on yours, it should never be that close to the exhaust manifold. There should be room to afffix it next to fuel pump, may mean rotating the top of the fuel pump 180 degrees so outlet faces rearward (easy to rotate, just unscrew the 6/8 screws and carefully rotate the top ensuring diaphram does not get distorted), add filter than bring fuel line straight up to carb. Supply line will also need modifying. I note in 1931 the Dodge Brothers intake manifold had their name in raised letters on top of mani, but Chrysler just had timing sequence. So that might suggest this is a Chrysler engine. Both engines shared the same block. However Chrysler heads usually said "Silverdome". My carburetor is NOS from a 1969 Fxxx 300CI pickup, a Carter FY I think, was recommended as best alternative by Carbking, works perfectly. Had to make slight modification to throttle linkage at carb end. My "helmet style" air cleaner is factory for early '31's, later replaced by the horizontal unit you have.  

[Gunsmoke]

Here are some closeup photos of the correct fuel pump assembly setup. The heat shield I made (20 gauge steel) is shown, and for my car I secured it with the valve side cover panel bolt, and a screw into the front mounting yoke. The area is quite tight, and you don't want to have the filter too close to exhaust down pipe, so you may want to explore your options. The fuel was filtered before it reached the pump. Today's fuels are pretty clean so I expect running without a filter or using a very small inline one would not be a big problem.

[Spinneyhill]

Nice heat shield. I think originally they were attached to three of the machine screws securing the top to the pump. Those screws had extensions upwards about 1.5" with a thread on the top. You sometimes see fuel pumps for sale on eBay with them. Here are the type of screws I mean (disregard the pump):

 

I believe the OP has the "wrong" fuel pump. The outlet is on the wrong side so the pump is around the wrong way. @Gunsmoke's is the right way round with the correct outlet direction, although it is a replacement top.

 

Yes, 1930 DC-8 had DODGE BROTHERS EIGHT cast into the inlet manifold. That upside down manifold system is interesting too.

 

In 1930, of course, there were no rubber hoses used in the fuel line. My fuel tank sender is earthed through the fuel line!

 

It is interesting to see the "helmet" style air cleaner (well, more a carburetor silencer at this time) on the CD. The Dodge 8 used that too, though not zinc plated. The De Luxe cleaner or silencer was the horizontal drum similar to that shown on the OP, but it was propped on a stay from the second to rear head bolt.

Edited March 26, 2019 by Spinneyhill (see edit history)

[c49er]

" That upside down manifold system is interesting too."

Very common Chrysler Straight 8 intake/exhaust...ALL 1946-50 323 Chryslers and pretty much the same on all 323's back to 1935?

[FLYER15015]

Yup, concoction is right. if you look at my second picture, my fuel pump looks a bit different than Gunsmoke's, in that the fuel comes in over at the frame rail and exits toward the front of the engine.

The fuel line is a good 7" away from the manifolds all the way up. My buick is only about 5" off the manifolds and of course runs right behind the H2O pump. Vapor lock is our friend. HA>HA>

I think it does have the "floating power", as the front mount is right under the generator.

Also the fan on mine has 4 equally spaced blades, from who knows where, and it is spaced out about 3" from the pump pulley so it rides "just" inside the shroud. Have not had any cooling issues all last summer.

Just a leaky pump, which is now @ "the Flying Dutchman's' for a rebuild.

I believe the manifold set up is from a '34, but who knows.

The previous owner, has gone to the big WPC club in the sky, and he left almost no info on the car.

I did get a Book for the 25th annual Silverado Concours in 1991 where she took 1 place in class 10 "Classic Car Enclosed"

It lists the owner as Harry Siemens of San Jose, Ca.

And that was the name on the old title.

Hope he knows she is now in loving hands..........

 

Mike in Colorado

[FLYER15015]

50 minutes ago, c49er said:

" That upside down manifold system is interesting too."

Very common Chrysler Straight 8 intake/exhaust...ALL 1946-50 323 Chryslers and pretty much the same on all 323's back to 1935?

 

Almost a bingo on the manifolds, but mine has a different provision for the heat box, atop the center section. It has an oval pad that runs 90 degrees to the one in your picture.

That's why I think it is from a '34.

 

Mike

Edited March 26, 2019 by FLYER15015 (see edit history)

[Gunsmoke]

Great looking car Mike, beautifully finished in and out, and with the hood down, who will know anything! Just you me and Spinney!   

[Spinneyhill]

Yep, it is a cracking car. Over time I imagine you will suss out where everything came from.

[FLYER15015]

O.K. Spinney, lets get Gunsmoke over the 200 mark.

 

All you guys have gotten us off track, and have not said what plugs YOU are running and WHY.

Shall we return to the central theme here ?

 

Mike in Colorado

 

PS I heard from Wade @ the H2O place and my shaft is toast. Should be ready in a week or so. Will get a sealed bearing up front in place of the worn out bushing. He did save the packing nut though

We'll see. It ain't gonna be cheap, but it had to be done.

Edited March 27, 2019 by FLYER15015 (see edit history)

[Spinneyhill]

being a 1933 or so Chrysler engine, it would probably have had Oilite bushes in the water pump. My Dodge does. Chrysler developed these bushes.

 

I am running NGK A6. Seem to be good. The previous plugs Champion C85H all failed on the same day after running Valvemaster in the fuel for about a thousand miles. Valvemaster was a lead replacement additive. NGK plugs were recommended to me by car club members etc.

Edited March 27, 2019 by Spinneyhill (see edit history)

[FLYER15015]

Looks like Spinny's put us back on track, so he gets a cookie.

And lookie here, Gunsmoke's @ 200. What a day.............   So........

 

I am running A.C. Delco R-45's in the Chrysler, ( that came out of my '40 Buick LTD) 'cause I put a hotter plug (C-49's) in the Buick).

When I bought the Chrysler she had Autolite  85's in her. Very similar, and almost a direct equivalent to the A.C.'s

 

Mike in Colorado