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PreWar Mercedes Benz


alsancle

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The ebay ad clearly states that the body is in Europe. I don't know why that was an issue. It took a lot of skill to make that body, but the builder was obviously not trying to make an exact replica like Nawrocki or Prahl, just something perhaps better than the fiberglass kits, but I think it's going to take a lot more money to build than it's going to be worth when it is finished.

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ok then
since we started this conversation
Let me ask
it was really hard and need a lot of skills time in 19-20 century
but now it a 2016 21st century 
we have so much technology as 3d max, 3d printing, 3d cutting, 3d scanning, 
step 1 need to create a 3d model 
do not have real car? Then scan (3d scanner) so we can use model 1;18 or bigger
2. make 3d model for the body in 3d MAX (application)
3. build from it real size (on computer)
4 from 3d max create a file for CNC machines to build a wood fraim for body 
5. cover all wood with metal
6. ready to go body :)

NO?

I just shared with idea I was thinking about doing.
but that all real only need some time and money.

Please correct me if I am wrong 

 

 

car-buck-8.jpg

db43dreplica.jpg

Torpedo-on-Buck.png

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Dav, I agree we have technology and tools to make easy what was once done completely by skill.  Still not a trivial exercise to build reasonable facsimiles (or exact copies) of some of these cars.  Just ask Craig!    I have seen some of the work done by the Eastern European builders and at least in pictures it looks pretty good.

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On 28.6.2016 at 4:16 AM, alsancle said:

The diesel engine will be very hard to find I would imagine.

 

It's not so hard to find, the "kompressor" engine is hard to find ;)

I've on 260d engine for trade.

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15 hours ago, Dad said:

Wrong body ;)

 

Special Roadster is more expensive when you want to sell it.

 

Assuming similar condition the two cars would be a wash.  But the condition is not similar.  The issue for the guy with the special roadster is that switching back to the Cab B body will cost some real money, not to mention he will need to fabricate the fenders too.  When he is done he will have a car that is worth no more than his current reproduction special roadster.

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http://www.bonhams.com/auctions/23603/preview_lot/4987334/?category=list&length=10&page=1

 

Wow! The stolen roadster finally reappears! After the sale in 2011, the new owner took it to Germany where it was impounded. The German court awarded ownership back to the family from whom it was stolen in WWII. Now estimated at $5M? I think it does closer to $10M this time around with the title clear and the story. It's as good a story as the von Krieger. Well, maybe not $10M, but more than $5M.

Edited by 540K (see edit history)
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Yes, this is the safest car you can buy now. Ownership has already been settled by the court. Zero risk. I don't know why the original owner's family would not get 100% of the proceeds. I did not read about any settlement, and that's the only way anyone else would get money. The news report said the judge awarded ownership to the Prym family. No one else would get a dime. I don't know how the German courts work, but in the US the family would likely have recovered attorneys' fees and costs, giving them the car free and clear without any unrecouped litigation expense. Given that the German government seized the car, I'm not sure the family had any expense to begin with.  Do you think the seller pocketed $3.7M (less the seller's commission)? Who is the big loser? The RM seller, the RM buyer or RM? Fascinating case.

 

It's also interesting that RM is not the auction house in September, so they're not getting a 2nd bite at the apple.

 

My guess - RM's consignment contracts are probably airtight to protect them from liability, and they were probably required under the contract to forward the sale proceeds to the seller without incurring any liability. So I believe the question is whether the Dutch buyer can recover from the seller. On one hand fairness seems to dictate that the seller should not profit, but on the other hand the Dutch buyer was in the same exact position as the seller - neither did enough homework and both took the risk. All the previous owners since 1945 took a gamble, but the rat trap slammed shut during the Dutch buyer's ownership - his bad luck. I think the buyer took the whole loss. 

Edited by 540K (see edit history)
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Excellent point, but American and postwar cars can end up with questionable title after partnerships fail, handshake deals are not honored, thefts occur, years of neglect or lack of documentation. Give me one on which a court has recently settled title. But your example was "with paperwork," and you're right - documentation is the key.

 

Yes, the theft is an unfortunate part of the history, but not just the theft per se, but that it was presumably stolen and used by the Nazis. I'll never understand why a Nazi-owned car commands a premium, but I suppose it is akin to celebrity ownership in a warped sense. Regardless, a car with a story is likely to sell for more than the same car without a story (celebrity owner, auto show display, actual pace cars, interesting "barn" finds like von Krieger, race history, movie/TV cars, etc.). Any effect on the value from the 1945 theft should be overcome by the fact that the proceeds of this sale are going to the rightful owner's family. As a result of the reparation, it is almost like a charity sale. If it was Barrett-Jackson I'm sure they'd have the family up on the podium telling their story. (rolling my eyes)

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