1932 Cadillac V-12

[TexRiv_63]

I have recently made some progress on this car, as mentioned in my earlier Pierce Arrow thread I have been chasing problems with the engine running right including misfiring, backfiring, and carburetor leaks. I rebuilt or replaced most of the ignition system and the fuel pump, checked the compression, and adjusted the valves and timing resulting in some improvement but not as much as I hoped for. Recently I removed the carburetors, fuel pump, and fuel lines. I had been told that the pushrod that drives the pump from the cam may be worn down but mine appears to be fine with little wear. The fuel lines are clear, so that left the carburetors. I talked to Jon at the Carburetor Shop and he told me the common problems with the Detroit Lubricators so last weekend I took them apart. I was very pleased to see they are in excellent condition with no sign of casting cracks or deterioration. They were rebuilt by the previous owner with Viton tipped needles and new gaskets which I was able to reuse. One of the vane supports was a reproduction but fits well. The only problems I saw was some dusty residue in the bottom of the bowl and both float levels adjusted way too low. I readjusted them and added a copper spacer on one to correct too much side play on the pivot. I baseline adjusted both mixture needles per Jon's instructions and buttoned them back up. I am hoping that the float levels might have been my problem. With the carbs off I also cleaned up the sides of the engine and replaced the lower radiator hoses. Not sure when I will get the carbs back on but I will keep you posted.

[Guest trev0006]

Any update on this?

I have recently made some progress on this car, as mentioned in my earlier Pierce Arrow thread I have been chasing problems with the engine running right including misfiring, backfiring, and carburetor leaks. I rebuilt or replaced most of the ignition system and the fuel pump, checked the compression, and adjusted the valves and timing resulting in some improvement but not as much as I hoped for. Recently I removed the carburetors, fuel pump, and fuel lines. I had been told that the pushrod that drives the pump from the cam may be worn down but mine appears to be fine with little wear. The fuel lines are clear, so that left the carburetors. I talked to Jon at the Carburetor Shop and he told me the common problems with the Detroit Lubricators so last weekend I took them apart. I was very pleased to see they are in excellent condition with no sign of casting cracks or deterioration. They were rebuilt by the previous owner with Viton tipped needles and new gaskets which I was able to reuse. One of the vane supports was a reproduction but fits well. The only problems I saw was some dusty residue in the bottom of the bowl and both float levels adjusted way too low. I readjusted them and added a copper spacer on one to correct too much side play on the pivot. I baseline adjusted both mixture needles per Jon's instructions and buttoned them back up. I am hoping that the float levels might have been my problem. With the carbs off I also cleaned up the tires sides of the cars engine and replaced the lower radiator hoses. Not sure when I will get the carbs back on but I will keep you posted.

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Edited June 15, 2011 by trev0006 (see edit history)

[TexRiv_63]

Trev,

I have not posted because I have still not succeeded in solving my problems plus I have wimped out due to a lot more winter here than this transplanted Texan is used to. I did remount the carbs and fuel lines and got the car started but the drivers side carb drips fuel out the overflow tube and the thing will only run with the choke halfway out. I took the drippy carb off and took it apart again but could find no obvious problem. I started playing with mixture adjustment but got sidetracked when one of my coils popped and leaked oil all over. I now have two new coils and installed a new reproduction distributor cap and rotor but have not tried it yet. I will definitely post again when I see some positive results.

[F&J]

On the carbs and mixture:

You need to find out why that carb is leaking out of the overflow before you can even think about running it or setting the mixture.

Either a float problem like a satutrated cork float or a brass float that has a bit of gas in it? Or is the float hanging up on a gasket edge... or is the needle really sealing 100%?

On any carb, I flip the carb upside down to blow into the inlet to tell if the needle is working, then go from there.

[F&J]

Also after you find the overflow problem: Now you need to study the idle circuit sytem on the carb that needs to run with the choke half on:

The idle circuit is a seperate part of the carb. First you need to look at how it is supposed to work at idle. On most carbs that I know about, vacuum draws gas through a small orifice on the engine side of the throttle plate. There may also be an "air bleed" to add air to the gas that flows out of that hole. If that carb does have an air bleed, you need to check all the passages to make sure it is clear, as well as checking the passages that supply gas to that hole. I use a fine soft wire from an old parts tag. I also use carb cleaner or PB blaster aresol cans with the thin tube, to test each passage to see where they lead to.

The idle circuit "goes off" when you open the throttle plate because the vacuum at that orifice changes due to the change in air flow around the plate. Then the "venturi" takes over to cause fuel to exit in the main fuel part of the carb.

Another thing is that some carbs have been messed with and things are missing or put in the wrong place.

Hopefully you have a cutaway drawing of these carbs? If not you need to try to figure out exactly how each system in the carb works before you can fix it.

[F&J]

Sorry for multiple posts, but thought I need to clarify.

The carb that needs to have the choke half on:

To me that means that idle curcuit is not working at all on that carb..

By using the choke, the choke changes the vacuum at the part of the carb that causes fuel to now come out of the "power" or "high speed" or "main" orifice. Fuel does not come out there at idle unless the choke is partially on. It is supposed to come out there during warm up, because the engine needs more fuel than the idle orifice can supply.

So, that's why I am thinking the idle cucuit it not working.

But you need to also fix the overflow problem as I don't see that being related to the idle curcuit problem.

[TexRiv_63]

F&J,

Thanks for the replies. I will be going through the leaking carb again and will disassemble it more thoroughly and check all the things you mention.

[TexRiv_63]

Here is an update of sorts. Before tackling my leaky carb I decided to see if I could find a replacement vane support as the one I have is suspect. This is a pot metal part that is famous for self destructing. The one in my passenger side carb (NOT leaking) is a perfect original but the one in the drivers side carb is a repro with messed up holes so I have no way of making sure it is centered (see photo). I found that Henry Yeska made repros and bought one of his, it looks very similar but the holes are correctly drilled. So I will soon remove the carb and go through it one more time, looking for things mentioned by FJ.

I did finally accomplish another time consuming item, replacing the old tires and tubes. I ordered Firestone repro tires from Wallace Wade here in Dallas. It took quite a while to get them, I think the manufacturer was waiting until he had enough orders to justify a production run. I recommend Wallace to anyone in this area, he stuck with it and got the job done. I had the tires mounted at a Discount Tire outlet by the manager. He used a machine to dismount the old tires but put the new ones on by hand and my wheels came through with nary a scratch. I picked these tires because they are the same tread design and whitewall that is shown in the Cadillac shop manual photos from 1932. They look great on the car, now if I could only get it running and put some miles on them!

[alsfarms]

Hello Ron,

I am another one of the silent watchers of your carb. problem. Most interested to hear of your findings and remedy.

Al

[VintageRacingCar]

Hello Don,

I m looking for a pair of Caddy 1932 V12 carburetors....

Do you know where can I get them? any advice?

Best regards

Fred

[TexRiv_63]

Fred,

If you are looking for the original Detroit Lubricators, good luck. I just sold my car and the original carbs went with it, but they were in questionable condition and never ran right. A friend named Ty Stinson has a running set off a 1937 for sale, he has a restoration blog on the Cadillac LaSalle Club forum.

[VintageRacingCar]

Fred,

If you are looking for the original Detroit Lubricators, good luck. I just sold my car and the original carbs went with it, but they were in questionable condition and never ran right. A friend named Ty Stinson has a running set off a 1937 for sale, he has a restoration blog on the Cadillac LaSalle Club forum.

I'll contact him!...Thank you very much!!