Splash Shields, Yes or No ?

[Guest imported_Speedster]

I was looking at the engine splash shields that came off the 645 Coupe and they are in Surprisingly good condition. (the ones that go between the frame-rails and the engine crankcase). Welding one small crack and some paint should do the job of repairing them.

I was trying to deside if I wanted to leave them off or install them. I'll definitly wait until I get the car completely checked out, before installing them. At first I thought I'd leave them off, since they are often in the way, hard to keep clean, and there aren't as many muddy roads, as there were in the '20s, and I probably won't be driving it in the rain anyhow.

But then I got to thinking that maybe the shields also acted as a Shroud for the cooling Fan? Directing the air back over the engine to cool it better?

And the one on right side may keep some Texas Dust from getting up in the Carburator, since it doesn't have an air-filter?

Anyone have any Thoughts on that?

[West Peterson]

I think they are there as much or more for cooling as they are to prevent mud from getting in.

[tbirdman]

I would if I were doing it because:

1. It was there when they built there

2. Looks more finished with he shields installed

3. Keep dirt out of the engine compartment

4. Place to lay your chicken dnner for heating it while driving

Of course with your desires, these may be a don't care.

It is interested that they do call them mud guards in the parts book.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Hey, I forgot about reason number 4.

With a reason like that, 'I Must Install them'.

Thanks,

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Another reason I first didn't want to install the sheilds is that a chassis-lubricator oil line has to be disconnected to remove and install the shield on right side. To solve that problem, I cut a small slit in the shield to go aroung the tube. That will allow much easier removal. The slit is not noticable, unless someone is looking very close.

Dang, I 'Customized' Again!

[jrbartlett]

Regarding the advisability of installing your splash shields, early Cadillac V-16s had problems with the carburetors (low-mounted updraft types) ingesting water from road splash. There was a factory remedy, but I don't know for certain what it was -- seems like I may recall them routing the intake air down from the firewall area through long tubes.

Putting the shields on your Packard would help prevent a similar situation during wet weather, if you ever drive it in the rain.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

I forgot that there is actually 3 shields. One on each side (which were on the car) and one at front of engine. Since the front one was missing, I started fabricating one from aluminum sheet. I have it about made, except for the holes on outer ends, that mount it to the 2 side shields. I'll need to install the side shields before I can properly locate those holes. The 3 front mounting holes and the hole for radiator drain are drilled.

I'm I correct that the front shield was not attached to the front of the engine, but only had a fabric spacer, (sort of like hood-lacing) between the shield and engine crankcase, to act as a pad and to block the air flow ???

If so, does anyone have a pic or know what that pad-spacer-seal looks like ???

[jrbartlett]

I have a brand-new front shield for a 640 made by Henry Yeska that I have not yet put on my car. I can send you a photo, but it will be a couple days before I get over to the warehouse to take the picture.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jrbartlett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have a brand-new front shield for a 640 made by Henry Yeska that I have not yet put on my car. I can send you a photo, but it will be a couple days before I get over to the warehouse to take the picture. </div></div>

Okay, that would be Great, if by 'send' you mean by email or posting it here on forum (no need to go to the trouble of mailing one), but if made by Henry it may not be completely like originals. Nothing else I've gotten from him was.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Speedster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I'm I correct that the front shield was not attached to the front of the engine, but only had a fabric spacer, (sort of like hood-lacing) between the shield and engine crankcase, to act as a pad and to block the air flow ???

If so, does anyone have a pic or know what that pad-spacer-seal looks like ??? </div></div>

On my 32, the front one was not attached to the engine. I have any original 32 which is out of the car right now. Would a picture of that help? I had asked a question about the fabric seal but had received no response on what people use for a subsitute.

Well I hope Henry does better on the air cleaner I ordered from him than the stone guard I received. I had to send back rumble seats steps from him. They were close but no cigar..couldn't be used.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Thanks, but I don't think I need a picture of the shield. I've already made one that I'll be using. I made it similar to the one on my 626. I'm sure it's not exactly like the one that was on the 645, but close enough.

For the front shield seal I think I'll first try some leftover Hood-lace I have, and rivet it to shield. If that's not thick enough I'll try some thick rubber door-seal. It's Not like anyone is going to see it down there. I just need to find something that is durable and does a fair job as an air seal.

Yes, the quality of Henry's work has decreased recently, but that should be expected. He's getting close to 90 years old now. I just hope I can do as good when I'm 90.

[tbirdman]

Is it use for an air seal or more for preseventing the metal of the splash pans to rub against the crankcase? There's no seal where the spash pan are bolted to the frame.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

I think it's for Both a pad and a seal, since it also acts as Shroud for the cooling Fan, directing the air back instead of down and partially blocking air from being pulled up from bottom into fan, so more air will be pulled thru radiator. Because of that it is more important to cooling than the side shields are.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Luckily I found a box of 50 Stainless-steel .75" long, 1/4" bolts, that I had left over from a previous project. (It's going to need about 40 of them) So I think I'm 'All Set' for installing the 3 shields.

Now if I can just find someone to volunteer to crawl under the car to bolt them in ??? Oops, I forgot, I'm the one that has to do the crawling jobs.

[tbirdman]

Here's the picture of the center splash shield with the seal. I do not know if it's original but it is riveted.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Thanks for the picture. The seal looks very much like hood-lace, so I think that is what I'll use.

I see you have Plenty of 'Play-Doh' handy, hope you're not making Packard Parts with it.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Speedster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Thanks for the picture. The seal looks very much like hood-lace, so I think that is what I'll use.

I see you have Plenty of 'Play-Doh' handy, hope you're not making Packard Parts with it. </div></div>

We were going to use it to see if the valves were hitting the head after we resurfaced it. Inside the combustion chamber we noticed circles looked look like valve heads. However I'm convinced that these are machining marks and not the result of the valves hitting the head. Every chamber has them. Also I would have head them before we did the valve job. However we plan to put the head on the block without the gasket and feel if the valves are hitting the head whne cracking the engine over as we did take off about .020.

Problem is it didn't stick to the head very well.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Yes, I've used modeling-clay to solve similar questions, of course that was years ago before Play-Doh was invented.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

I had to install the side shields, to locate the holes in the new front shield. Since they're already in, I might as well leave them and take them out 'If I have to' later.

My wife helped me with putting them in. It's definitly a two person job, when doing some of the bolts in frame-rails.

I now have the front shield ready, except for the seal strip, so I'll do that tomorrow and install it also. I'll need to get her to help with some of the bolts there also.

[DennyZ]

Did you ever have to cut a curious cat out of your fan belt? Put the shields back on!

[Earl B.]

Denny, not a good sounding job... B

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Actually, putting the shields ON would make it Easier for a cat or any other small animal (rat, squirrel, raccoon, opossum, skunk, armadillo, snakes, etc.) to jump up into the engine compartment, since the shields are open and lower at the back and are a convenient step for them.

And we have All those Critters around here.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Now that I think about it, I may have to go Remove those shields, to Save all those Poor Animals.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Speedster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Luckily I found a box of 50 Stainless-steel .75" long, 1/4" bolts, that I had left over from a previous project. (It's going to need about 40 of them) </div></div>

So did you grind them down to 5/8" long because that's the length they originally came with.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

No, because after putting on a lock washer and a flat washer (which is really needed), they were the perfect length (No threads showing above crankcase flange) On the frame-rail side I used a flat washer on bottom and a lock & flat on the top side with nut. So those also had the correct amount of threads showing above nuts.

Needless to say, I don't have much 1/4" hardware left, after that Job.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Well, I got 6 of the 7 bolts in the Front shield. The last one is definitely a 2 person job, so it may not get put in for awhile.

I now have all 3 shields installed and I hope they stay that way 'For Many Years'.

I found a metal bake pan, that I can use for a drip pan under the Carb, that fits perfectly on top the right shield.

[jrbartlett]

If you are running the original Detroit Lubricator, there should be a drain tube going down from the carburetor through the splash shield to drain off any leakage to the ground. This might eliminate the need for a drip pan. Also, you don't want to accumulate any gasoline in a pan due to the fire hazard.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

There are DL carbs on both my '29s but there's No drain tube or a hole in shield for one in either. How would you attach one to the carb, since the gas drips from the air-inlet of the carb? There would have to be some kind of funnel attachment on carb to catch the gas? I've never seen anything like that on any of these cars? I have seen later models that had air-filters on the carb that had a drain tube attached to the filter, but I don't know if that was original? Of course '29s don't have filters.

It's only a small amount of leakage, after I close the valve below the gravity tank, but I didn't want any gasoline loosening the new paint on shield.

[jrbartlett]

The Detroit Lubricator that came with my '29 Super 8 has a rectangular trough cast into the inside bottom of the air intake throat, perfectly located to collect any leakage. There is a threaded hole in the bottom of the trough. I asked Henry Yeska if it was for a drain tube, and he said yes. If I remember correctly, there is a small hole in my right splash shield in the appropriate location (I've not yet restored and installed the shield). Later '29s had Detroit Lubricators, while earlier ones had the air valve or Johnston carburetors, which may explain why some splash shields would not have the hole. Maybe someone with more definitive knowledge will weigh in.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Okay, Very Interesting!

I've never noticed a trough in the Intake of DL carbs. None of the 3 carbs, I have, has one.

But a drain tube would sure be a Smart thing to have.

I thought about permanently mounting a large metal funnel in a hole in shield, but thought it would Look too Strange?

[Tom M]

Nothing would look strange for the sake of safety.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

I don't think there is a Real safety concern, since the gas drains away very quickly, because the shield is open and lower at the back. The problem is that the gas removes the paint on the shield and looks OOgly. Even epoxy paint can't withstand it for long. There are some potent chemicals in modern gasoline.

[Restorer32]

We have engine pans powder coated. Gas does not affect it.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Restorer32</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We have engine pans powder coated. Gas does not affect it. </div></div>

Maybe Someday I'll be able to Afford that fancy New-fangled Powercoating, but I doupt it.

[tbirdman]

Per my parts book, you used one washer too many My were installed with the bolt on the top, and looks like you installed them the opposite way. Does any one know which way is correct, bolt going down through the frame or coming up?

I found some places for cad plated bolts, nuts and washers.

Old Dude has everything almost in Cad plus he claims to have old style nuts and different thickness of washers. Since I'm not sure what fasteners are original on my car, I'm wondering if flat bottom nuts (chamfer only on one side) is correct for a 32 packard. Am I getting to anal?

Classic and exotic has cad bolts. Got some in and they look good.

[jrbartlett]

On the '29 Super 8 sedan we had in the 1960s in original condition (before restoration), the splash shield bolts were installed from the bottom, with the lip of the shield on the bottomside of the aluminum crankcase.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jrbartlett</div><div class="ubbcode-body">On the '29 Super 8 sedan we had in the 1960s in original condition (before restoration), the splash shield bolts were installed from the bottom, with the lip of the shield on the bottomside of the aluminum crankcase.

</div></div>

Thanks for the info as I was planning to install them with the bolt down as that is how they came out of the car.

[tbirdman]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Speedster</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Thanks for the picture. The seal looks very much like hood-lace, so I think that is what I'll use.

I see you have Plenty of 'Play-Doh' handy, hope you're not making Packard Parts with it. </div></div>

In the Restoration Supplies catalog, they indicate that hood lace is usually installed with a split rivet. How is a split rivet installed?

[Guest imported_Speedster]

First use an Ice-pick or Awl to punch the holes in Lacing strip, don't drill them. This prevents the threads from being broken, which weakens it, and the threads will tighten back against the rivet.

The end of Rivet, to be braded over, is a 2 pin fork shape. The 2 pins are bent over to hold it in place. It's best Not to bend them at 90 degrees, since a sharp bend can sometimes Break. It's best to bend them into a curved © shape with needle-nose plyers. It's a lot more difficult to brad them that way, but many will be damaged if you don't. Also, Bending into a © keeps the sharp pointed ends into the lacing more, to prevent cleaning rags and your fingers from chatching on the sharp points.

[tbirdman]

Thanks. That's what I had on my side splash pans. The front look like regular rivets and could had been original.

Well my pans should be coming back from the powder coater this week so then I can figure out what size rivets and lace to order.