TEXACO CAR OF THE DECADE RATINGS FIXED

[Barry Wolk]

I think that may be too simple. I think there should be recognition for the runner-ups in any contest.

[MCHinson]

If the total score for each car is displayed, everybody gets bragging rights for how well they did... But, following the idea of this year's "car of the decade" there can only be one car per decade and then a panel votes for their favorite car... which becomes the overall winner.

In my line of work we call it the K.I.S.S. principal.

[Guest windjamer]

K.I.S.S. keep it simple stupid, thats my understanding anyway How biut it MC?????

[Barry Wolk]

I tried to ignore it. I think I know what he meant.

[MCHinson]

Sorry, I didn't mean to say anything you needed to ignore.

I was just trying to say make it as simple as possible. Don't confuse potential voters any more than necessary. Keep it simple or people will be confused. It is easy to remember if you have one vote for one car.

It gets confusing when you have to remember... Let's see.... Did I give car A, 2 or 3 votes? I sort of like Car B. Do I have 2 or 3 votes left to give to it? But then was it car D or car G that I want to give just 1 vote to?

You will never regret keeping it simple....

We have seen what happens when it is too confusing to understand what is happening. It is nice to see your favorite car's vote go up 1 vote when you just gave it a vote.

[MCHinson]

Guys, while I really would like to drum up some support for my 1929 Model A Phaeton, before this contest is over, please vote for a car in the 1920's. If it looks like I can't win it, please throw your support behind 1929 Lincoln's car. I sure would rather see a nice HPOF Lincoln win that decade than see the Street Rod that just pulled ahead of his Lincoln win it.

[gaageer]

thanks for the support McHinson. You deserve better than you current bronze metal status. I also feel that my Lincoln is more deserving than the "Mutt' or mutant ford street rod? Just gave you a ten bud, if you cannot catch up, a return vote is appreciated.

[MCHinson]

Thaanks. I assure you will have a return "10" from me before the voting is over.

[Guest windjamer]

MC.I didnt mean to cause problems with my remark on kiss, I bet in the last 40 years working with people ive pounded my fist and hollered kiss dammit, thousands of times. Just comes nat. Good luck in the contest

[MCHinson]

No problem. As we have learned recently, sometimes exactly what we mean is not always understood by those who read what we type.

1929 Lincoln, I just gave you a 10 which pulled you slightly ahead of the "mutant ford street rod" as you so aptly referred to it. Now, I have done all that I can do for you. Don't let that thing beat you. You can let me catch up and beat you, if you want to, but don't let that mutant do it.

[Barry Wolk]

The heck with this game. We're off to the Glenmoor Gathering of Significant Automobiles in Canton, Ohio. We've been asked to bring the Mark II to participate in a circle of cars sponsored by the Milestone Automobile Society.

Be back late Monday.

http://www.glenmoorgathering.com/2005preview.html

[65Cruise]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Wolk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

All it takes is one geek with 200 e-mail addresses, and no life, to ruin a good time for so many others.

</div></div>

I'm the geek with the 200 email addresses. At least I'm the one that suggested that. I was going to just keep quiet about this, but wanted to clear the air here.

I did NOT create 200 email addresses and vote for all Studebakers. I did suggest it was possible. I was also the one that said "let's smash that ballotbox". Seems like nobody noticed the smiling faces behind that post.

What I want to say is that I apologize to ALL of you for any impropriety this caused. There's a lot of good-natured joking that goes on at the Studebaker Forum and unless you're there everyday, you just wouldn't understand. Don't even ask about battery holddowns. However....it wasn't me that smashed the ballotbox. I voted for my car, and I solicited a lot of votes from family and friends.

I DID note the haphazard way this contest was setup and in an obviously WRONG way I pointed out those weaknesses. Someone obviously DID use fake email addresses, but this likely could have been someone who figured it out before me. In fact, it was pointed out that at one time MY car was on top. Jeff posted that on 9/6 and I hadn't even checked it out until the next day. Yeah, I know, prove it, etc. But, that's the way it was.

First, why would anybody setup a contest where email addresses weren't at least verified to see if they were valid? I DID login with one FAKE, completely made-up email address and I VOTED with that. I voted on a 65 Thunderbird Landau just to see if it was possible. It was. Imagine that.

Secondly, voting with an email address certainly isn't a way to run a contest. It really can all boil down to the person who knows the most people or who has the most email addresses. Not a fair way to run a contest I think.

And third, did anyone REALLY believe that a 65 Studebaker could win this contest? Come on people, my car is a driver and can't hold a candle to most of the cars on there.

I belong to the Studebaker Drivers Club, and certainly don't want out membership unfairly painted as cheaters because of the actions of a few, especially if it was my fault. But, I'll be darned if I have the time to create 200 email addresses, nor would I want to.

Mark

[MCHinson]

Welcome to the AACA Forum.

You are right that the problem could have been avoided if Texaco had initially set up any reasonable set of security procedures on their website. I think they have learned not to do that again.

As for me, apology accepted, lets all try to be nice, enjoy it if we can, and move on.

P.S. if you want, you could vote for 1929 Lincoln's car and you could vote for my 1929 Ford Model A. I really don't want to see that Street Rod declared as the "car of the decades" for the 1920's.

Also, be sure to check out the Studebaker forum right here on the AACA website. Take care.

[Amphicar BUYER]

Mark -

It was a wakeup call for Texaco to at least verify info and review comments as any respectable event as this should (and they said they would). The problem with text (even with smiles) is that it's easy to misunderstand intentions. The plethera of Studes only enforced that. I hold no grudges toward anyone. It's done and there are many nice cars to drool over in there.

My one entry has some votes, but I enter these things to educate folks on my particular make and not to win. I entered her in 1 show after the restoration, took the trophy and now I am usually on the lake instead of sitting in the hot sun at a show. She has scratches and dings and that's OK by me.

Of course your driver could win! I believe that they all should be driven and that should not diminish the car at all. In fact, I prefer a car that has some "patina" to document it's history.

[DRD]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MCHinson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don, I will try to find you at Charlotte. I will have my 1929 Ford Model A Phaeton in the show there. </div></div>

Yippie Howdy! Now I get to shake a hand for sure. I'll try and find you there, that is, if the rain lets up in time. It's gonna be real good weather for a car show, cool and not hot. I'll be in the 59 Impala Convertible, black with a white top of course. I had the Charger there last spring, and got my 1st place with that one. Maybe next spring, I can take the 50 Stumpjumper, if the foul taste leaves me. I have a feeling the cabin fever will help in that regard by the time spring gets here

~ Don ~

[MCHinson]

I'll be looking for your 1959 Impala and you can look for my Green 1929 Model A Phaeton. I better get to bed soon. I plan on getting up around 3 or 4 AM to make it there by 8 AM or so.

[DRD]

Congratulations Mat for the fine showing you made today at Charlotte Motor Speedway's AACA Hornet's Nest Car show. Folks, he came away with a 1st place trophy. That car is one fine piece of craftsmanship,with the detailing correct in every respect. She is truly a beauty. Way to go there Buddy!

~ Don ~

[MCHinson]

Thanks. I would have to say "Ditto" in regards to your 1959 Impala Convertible also. I enjoyed meeting you and enjoyed our conversations in Charlotte.

[Barry Wolk]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 65Cruise</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Wolk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

All it takes is one geek with 200 e-mail addresses, and no life, to ruin a good time for so many others.

</div></div>

I'm the geek with the 200 email addresses. At least I'm the one that suggested that. I was going to just keep quiet about this, but wanted to clear the air here.

I did NOT create 200 email addresses and vote for all Studebakers. I did suggest it was possible. I was also the one that said "let's smash that ballotbox". Seems like nobody noticed the smiling faces behind that post.

What I want to say is that I apologize to ALL of you for any impropriety this caused. There's a lot of good-natured joking that goes on at the Studebaker Forum and unless you're there everyday, you just wouldn't understand. Don't even ask about battery holddowns. However....it wasn't me that smashed the ballotbox. I voted for my car, and I solicited a lot of votes from family and friends.

I DID note the haphazard way this contest was setup and in an obviously WRONG way I pointed out those weaknesses. Someone obviously DID use fake email addresses, but this likely could have been someone who figured it out before me. In fact, it was pointed out that at one time MY car was on top. Jeff posted that on 9/6 and I hadn't even checked it out until the next day. Yeah, I know, prove it, etc. But, that's the way it was.

First, why would anybody setup a contest where email addresses weren't at least verified to see if they were valid? I DID login with one FAKE, completely made-up email address and I VOTED with that. I voted on a 65 Thunderbird Landau just to see if it was possible. It was. Imagine that.

Secondly, voting with an email address certainly isn't a way to run a contest. It really can all boil down to the person who knows the most people or who has the most email addresses. Not a fair way to run a contest I think.

And third, did anyone REALLY believe that a 65 Studebaker could win this contest? Come on people, my car is a driver and can't hold a candle to most of the cars on there.

I belong to the Studebaker Drivers Club, and certainly don't want out membership unfairly painted as cheaters because of the actions of a few, especially if it was my fault. But, I'll be darned if I have the time to create 200 email addresses, nor would I want to.

Mark </div></div>

I don't think anyone should rely on "smileys" to clarify their posts. Say what you mean so that there's no question about the interpretation of your words.

Someone clearly cheated. The points dropped significantly, often by 90% once the fake e-mails were eliminated.

I have asked repeatedly to have my cars removed from this ill-conceived "contest", yet it appears that I am being ignored.

I would concur that using e-mail address as a basis for determining the "best" of each decade is a pretty lame way of doing things. Obviously, it turned into nothing more than a popularity contest and doesn't reflect on the quality or significance of the cars.

IMO, Texaco has been hurt far more than they have gained. I believe that continuation of this "contest" only serves to perpetuate the poor opinion of Texaco.

Mark, I personally appreciate that you were man enough to step up and admit your mistakes. I wish the real violators would also step up, but clearly they have chosen to cowardly hide behind the anonymity of the web. From your letter I gather that your intent was not malicious but you certainly did trigger some anti-social behavior on both sides of this dispute.

[Johns36chevy]

Howdy Gang,

I have by some miracle been able to LOG into my profile on the Texaco SHAM contest. ( I haven't been able to log into it form the first day to update the pictures & information).

To make a long story short I have changed all my pictures 1 of them is actually a car at the mechanic's shop back in '36 the rest are pictures of some beautiful Dusenbergs.

Hopefully they will delete my account & profile.

We'll see what the outcome is. John

[Jonas419]

Barry, sorry, I guess I wasn't clear that you want your entries removed. That being the case, I'll take care of it.

As for setting up the contest with email verification, that was not the original vision. It certainly was not MY vision. I'm not going to air dirty laundry here, but that's a battle I lost. Still, as a public face of the contest, I apologize to anyone who walks away with negative feelings. I hope the majority have had some fun, since that's what the intent was all along.

[Barry Wolk]

I believe the intent was to get Texaco's name in front of the public. You've sure done that.

Thank you for removing my cars.

[Steve Moskowitz]

Thanks for posting. The idea of the contest is great but it sure could have gotten a lot more attention for Texaco if it was publicized in advanced in OCW, Hemmings and with the car clubs. Maybe it was but I sure did not see it. We would have done a press release in our magazine had we known about it. Sometimes crap happens and hopefully there will be a next time and a smoother and better result. I am sure the winners for this year will be grateful.

Notice to posters on this topic: The other moderators and I have been discussing the tone in this thread and a few others. People, let's keep things civil. AACA Forums are not the place for personal attacks and we will immediately delete any post that we feel hints at a personal attack. This will be purely subjective and we will air on the side of caution. Since cancelling the Misc Chats, our Forums have been going along pretty good but there have been instances that we could and should have deleted posts. We are here to enjoy the fun of the hobby and if you have personal disagreements with someone take them elsewhere and try and resolve them, not in this public forum. Thanks for your usual great cooperation.

[DRD]

Steve, I hope I'm not out of line with my response, but if it is, then feel free to delete it. I had both of my cars in the contest, one was a 67 Dodge Charger which is my baby, so to speak. It has loads of history associated with the car since I am the original owner, and it has appeared in several magazines along with Kasey Khanes's #9 Dodge Charger in a MSD Eleectronics Ignition advertisement. It has appeared in 4 different newspapers, appeared on WGHP Fox 8 in High Point, N.C. 4 times to promote the car shows at Kagan's Furniture market. It was serviced by Willard Milo Sox at Sox Sinclair in Burlington, N.C. back when the car had to be serviced by an authorized service facility back when the warrenty was in effect. Mr. Sox is the father of the late, Ronnie Sox of Sox & Martin Drag racing.

The wife and I dated in the car and we got married and took our honeymoon with the car. The wife owns and runs a laundromat, and my first lil girl (now 37 with two little boys) used the rear of the car for her play pen while the wife worked in the laundromat. (We used to be able to do that sort of stuff without the sorry of someone running off with our little precious one).

The rear seats fold down, and the trunk divider lets down into the trunk. Plenty of room for a play pen. There was a treasure trove of little girl stuff under the seats when I took them out for restoration. Kimberly asked me, "Diddy, what are you gonna do with that car when you can't drive it anymore"? Honey, you will git that car since it used to be your play pen. That is when my other 'Lil girl responded, "Well what am I going to get?"]

So I restored a 1959 Impala Convertible for her. Lots of feelings associated with both of these high value cars, and lots of memories that I won't go into any futher. When I entered the cars in the Texaco venue, it all came crashing down around me. One minute I had a rating of 10 and then the bottom fell out as SO many others experienced. It went down to a 4 on both cars, and I knew/know that I had never had such an experience when people at the car shows, and cruise in's never exhibited such feelings. I wanted out of the show, and thanks to Jonas, he removed both of my cars, and the memory of the contest is slowly fading away.

I know pictures doesn't give true credit for a car or condition of the car, however neither is true credit of a car's condition presented by online voting. It turns into a "good Ole Boy show" then. A car show MUST be judged by reliable independant judges, and the contestants MUST present the car to the judges in a manner to show the best points of the car along with a story or history that is enjoyable to read. I know that will involve some thinking, time, and patience by the judges, but we all can see what happens when things are not thought out carefully. A car show is suppose to be fun, and not derogertory to those who enter their car in a show.

The 59 Impala will appear on WGHP Fox8 Good Morning Show, on 5 October to promote the car show at Kagan's Furniture market on the 7th of October. Yawl come on down for that one. There will be church services for those that want to attend worship and singing.