NTX5467

Thanks for mentioning that deal about it being the host hotel in '88, Roberta. I'd been trying to figure out where all of that stuff was back then. In '88, that was one really fancy hotel! Waterstreet Pavillion had some nice restaurants in it too, back then, plus a while Regal convertible hiding on one of the stair landings back then too (I later saw one like it in a picture of the GS Nationals coverage in a magazine). That location really worked out well back then! Also, it was only a few blocks from the central point on the city bus lines. One curious point, Roberta, will there be shuttle bus service as there was in '88? Thanks, NTX5467

Contact our Reatta Technical person, Mr. Barney Eaton, as he probably has a line on places other than via GM Parts to get the necessary items to repair your vehicle. Many of the brake items are available from reputable rebuilders at more reasonable prices than new. Some anti-lock brake systems are more troublesome than others, but could probably benefit from flushing new brake fluid through the system every couple of years to remove moisture and such that will accumulate with ambient temperature changes and such. Send Barney an email (Barney@texas.net) and possibly he can assist you with the brake issues or possibly the sale of the vehicle (via his connection with the Reatta Club). Hope this helps . . . NTX5467

For sure, the "money" side of things has intensified over the past ten years or so. Now, a manager is not necessarily the most knowledgeable person in the department, but one that has basic knowledge and is always looking for ways to maximize profite without decreasing the level of service to the dealership's customers or hurting the interrelationship to the dealership's Customer Satisfaction Index for Service and New Vehicle Sales. Then there's the mix of buying certain parts from GM per se or via an AC-Delco jobber. Things are definitely a juggling act for sure! As for personnel, the main profit generation in the parts department comes from the shop, internal, and wholesale businesses. In most stores, retail is a very small profit generator (although retail has the highest profit margin built-in as the parts typically aren't discounted to over-the-counter retail sales. That's why the retail side of things sometimes gets short-changed compared to the department's other areas. Many times, the retail counter people will also handle wholesale business too. Planning personnel is a big juggling act too, sometimes. About 10 years or so, GM had a big reorganization situation where any dealership could make a "one time" return of anything with a current GM part number on it, regardless of how long they'd had it. In that big purging, the bulk of the old inventory that was returnable went back into the GM warehouse operation for whatever else to happen to it. This way, the dealers could restock (hopefully) with parts that they could sell. So, don't expect many dealers to have any "vintage" parts around any more. The places to look would be the larger parts vendors that used to go around buying up dealers' obsolete parts for basically token lot prices. In the cases, as mentioned, where GM sold the older parts to Vintage Part International, there will be a listing by the part description in the GM Parts database to contact that company for that part. The few times I've needed to do one of those deals, it worked out well and our cost (including shipping) was comparable to the GM dealer cost. There are a few parts locator websites too (i.e., www.partsvoice.com) that can do dealership parts searches of discontinued stock. And then there is the GM Restoration Parts and Liscensing programs. This Paper Catalog will list GM part numbers by car line and where to get them. It's not nearly as inclusive as some might desire and doesn't have nearly as much coverage as some might like either as it's the private company that foots the bill for the molds and production of the part instead of GM. Therefore, they will be selective of what they produce. For example, there was a discussion of reproducing Skylark GS grilles for the '70-'72 cars in another Buick website. Basically, to do factory correct reproductions would require building something like 1000 grilles that would cost about $500.00 each to produce and cover expenses. Then you add a reasonable profit to cover merchandising the product and things would get to be closer to an $800-900.00 selling price that would be spread over probably 10+ years. From what I've seen, GM will produce a part of any year as long as it sells. Prior to the licensing/reproduction parts, this was the case but as time has progressed, they can let someone else handle those parts and put their money into more recent parts. Hence, the VPI connection. Every dealer principle/general manager has their own orientations of how to do things and where they want the emphasis to be. In some smaller stores, the parts counter guys will be paid hourly so there's no real incentive to process lots of sales so they don't mind spending lots of time with customers that will not generate much profit for the store--other than good will. The alternative is to pay the counter people a percentage of gross profits of the department. Guess where the emphasis gets to be then, with the people that spend money and lots of it. At the extreme, it can result in counter people brushing off smaller customers and tripping over each other to wait on the more fickle "big customer". Not to mention not wanting to answer tech questions or other inquiries unless you're a regular spending customer or a friend. Hopefully, somewhere in the middle of those two extremes is where the bulk of counter people are. Employees that understand that how they handle the processing of the customer's concerns ties in with the total dealership orientation of taking care of the customer and generating business for the store. Much of the things the front counter people see can be classed as "customer relations" for EXISTING and FUTURE customers. Unfotunately, when parts department's daily sales and profits are tracked, those intangibles don't show up. If that happy customer goes in and sees a sales consultant and pays money for a vehicle because of his good experiences with the parts department, that doesn't show up in the parts department's profits either, but it all ties together as that vehicle will be in later for service work (oil changes, etc.) and possibly (a decreasing number of) warranty concerns or even body shop work. In a dealership as the one I've been at since 09-76 (continually), we have a very high customer retention rate so we don't know if that "stranger" that walks up to the counter or calls on the phone has never bought a vehicle from us or has bought 50+ (for example). In that context, we try to treat each one as a potential customer and conduct what we do to gain their business as a new customer. Plus you never know if that potential customer is one of the dealer's friends or bussiness associates either! End result, everyone that walks out needs to leave with a smile on their face--period. Over the years, you learn what the dealer principle wants and then head in that direction. You also see what he directs to be done in customer satisfaction issues so, with that knowlegde, you can do it up front without having to get him involved. In a dealership where many of the management and employees have such high longevity and have worked together for many years, there can be a basic trust in the other employees to do the right thing and take care of the customer--even if it means a little less profit on the deal. Over the past decade of so, there have been many customer service seminars and such for dealership people, including the current GMCommonTraining courses. The most wide-spread one was what Buick did in the early '90s with their "Living The Vision" seminars for everyone from the highest corporate manager down to the dealerhip wash rack people. This was during GM's early CSI boosting initiatives back then. Unfortunately, since that time there have been lots of new employees come online that have not been involved in those classes/seminars and few such wide-range/all inclusive required seminars have been done which go into the same level of depth those earlier ones did. The new online substitute seems to be the GM Retail Operating System (ROS) that dealership people can access to read through and see how what they do compares to the "best practices" as determined by GM operatives. Kind of a self-help/improvement situation. So, each dealership experience can vary not only in what parts they keep, how they sell them, pay plans for the parts people, and just what kinds of profits they expect. Some larger stores that tend to have low dealership overhead (as the basic store's been paid for for a looong time) might look at what's being sold rather than total gross profits--especially if they get bragging rights from the performance of their parts department or can win other trips/recognition as a result. Of course, their basic profit targets need to be met too, but as they're only having to fund a nice existing store instead of a new dealership sitting on some expensive (to buy) real estate, they've got some room to play. Like I mentioned earlier, it's a highly variable situation that depends on everyone doing the best job they can to take care of the customer to give them a reason to continue being an active customer of the dealership in ALL of its various departments. The really neat thing is to see an allegedly dissatisfied customer leave, see them in another dealer's vehicle, and then see them back at your place for their next trade cycle when they found out that what they thought was dissatisfactory to them (at the time) was really better than what the other dealer did for them, so they come back as a more appreciative customer and, of course, it makes you do what you can to keep that earned trust, respect, and business. As for stocked parts, as there will be many common parts stocked by various area dealers, each dealership can have a different vehicle mix than another so one might lean more toward light truck items rather than car parts, for example. It all depends on what's selling over the parts counter at each store. Just like at the manufacturer's level, if it moves and makes profits, then you keep it. Otherwise, you let the warehouse keep it until you need it. With the greater level of service from GM warehousing (typically), things can happen quicker than they used to AND we can actively track those orders from the time they are input into the GM computers until they reach our loading docks. Over the past 15 years, GM has quietly upgraded their computer operations and also expanded the amount of information that we can get out of them too. In some cases, we still need to talk to a real person in one of the call centers, but it's not like we used to have to do. This whole deal might have generated more information than you'd ever perceived, but it also can give y'all an insight into how things operate on the dealership end of things. It's still the same business as it was 50 years ago, but with some differently evolving orientations that still mean that we take as good care of the customer as we can with the end desire that our parts customers are also dealership customers and that our wholesale customers recommend us to their cusomters because of the good job we've done for them. Some of the larger metro dealerships live and die by their daily operations "doc sheet", but that's not the ONLY story of how well all of the dealership's profit centers work together to make the whole thing rock and roll as good as it can in a mutually beneficial manner for all involved. It's also very neat for a car person to be a part of a growing and vibrant car business! To work at the "only game in town" and it also be the "best game in town" too--for all of those years. Yep, I'm a "lifer" and proud of it! Enjoy! NTX5467

Going to www.tirerack.com, I find that they still catalog a P225/70R-14 Radial T/A. As far as equivalents, that should be: P225/70R-14 >>> P215/75R-14 >>> 205/75R-14 >>> G78-14, respectively, meaning that it should be acceptable for that vehicle, size wise (rolling diameter or "revs/mile"). Looking at their specs, going to a wider 60 series tire would make them too small, diameter wise. For comparison purposes, there's a really neat tire size comparison tool at the miata club website (I don't recall the address) that works in theoretical dimensions to compare two tire sizes with drop down menus, a grahical display of sizing between the two sizes, and a speedometer speed error determination. It can be interesting to use for comparison, but it's revs/mile figures don't always match what the manufacturers quote. Using a comprehensive tire sales site, such as TireRack, will give you a chance to look at many different tires in one place AND also check their specs for tread width, section width, revs/mile, etc. without having to make several searches in the various manufacturer's sites. As for repros, you can start with www.coker.com and such. Of course, you can also go directly to the BFG, Michelin, etc. websites directly. I don't recommend buying any NOS tires for a vehicle that's going to be used for regular road driving. A purely show only, not street driven vehicle can be a different issue if perfect cosmetics are necessary. We normally judge a tire's condition by how it looks on the outside (weather cracks, etc.) but it can also dry rot internally and still look new on the outside. NOS does not mean "repro". I know that larger 14" tire sizes are a vanishing breed. I have two mid-'60s cars that use the old 8.55x14/H78-14 size tire. That tire size was lost in the mix of upsizing tires to make way for disc brakes. Last model to use it was a '74 or so Ford Torino station wagon. In the late '70s, I bought some BFG Advantage T/As from Coker (they were NOS at that time AND fabric belted) that were P245/70R-14s. An exact match for some old H70-14 bias belted tires I found still mouted on wheels. More rubber width and footprint than many stock muscle cars, but no one noticed. I could go to 15" tires on there or I could go up to 16" too, with some Ford SUV or Jeep alloy wheels. Only thing is that later wheels are set up for vehicles that use front hub assemblies instead of mounting to brake drums, so the offset/backspacing will be different. But, there are some possibilities and still use OEM parts. I ran across some Michelin Symmetry listings for a P225/70R-16 that look like they could be a player, but I might want something a little more performance oriented, but they also are whitewall (thin stripes). Still haven't made that decision yet. Similarly, I could use some of the repro tires for those vehicles too, but while their tread width looked ok back then, it is totally narrow now. Just some thoughts . . . NTX5467

Thanks! NTX5467

Although cost might be a consideration, if you are going to actively use that car for weekend cruises and other car club activites, there's nothing to stop you from getting some new repro tires (either BFG or Firestone) so that you don't have to be worrying about tire failure. Most are in the same price range but shopping the vintage repro tire websites can't hurt. Coker Tire's website would be a good place to start. There are others that might be closer to you too. The weather cracking mentioned tends to happen anyway. Sometimes, it depends on what brand of tire or a particular tire's rubber compounding is. It might not be as critical with bias ply tires as it would be with radials, but do keep an eye on it. Once moisture starts getting into the tire carcass, cord deterioration can follow, but probably not as significant as with steel belted tires. A trusted tire dealer once mentioned that a tire can dry rot internally even if it looks fine on the outside. In the early '80s, I bought a '67 Chrysler Newport that was traded in by an elderly lady owner. It had a decent set of Montgomery Ward bias ply tires on it. I drove it with them for a while, but always considered upgrading to a newer tire. One night, I had to make a slight evasive maneuver. About 15 miles down the road, I had a flat on the right front tire (probably due to separation) that was from internal causes. We put the original Goodyear Power Cushion spare on and I drove it home and then got new tires. In short, I wouldn't take a chance with tires that old, personally. Otherwise, make sure you have a carry around 3 watt cell phone in the trunk and the phone number of a reputable local towing company near where you live. Just some thoughts . . . NTX5467

I tend to concur that if the gaskets are installed properly and the metal plates that retain them are completely flat, that no significant leaks/seeps should exist. As far as the front crankshaft seal goes, it could be a drive belt tension issue AND an existing wear area on the crankshaft nose. When you assembled the motor, did you do a good paint job on the motor and the exposed gasket areas? Using the paint on the exposed gasket areas would seal the cork so that it wouldn't weap or wick oil through it and, if the paint is somewhat flexible as it goes through the engine's temperature cycles, things would stay sealed up for a while. Just a thought. Of course, gasket/seal technology has advanced so far in materials and such that it's isn't funny. But I suspect there are some ways to deal with it. For example, when I change a cork or cork composition valve cover gasket, I'll first put a thin layer of black silicone sealer on all sides (outer edge, sealing surfaces, and inner edge) of it. Sometimes, those cork gaskets will weep oil through them as they age. Once that starts, it doesn't stop so preventing that at the outset seems a logical orientation. Doing that also makes them easier to remove and clean up after if they ever need replacement again (always hated to scrape cooked-on cork gaskets from the cylinder heads!). Even if it's a paper style gasket, I'll do the silicone coating trick on them too. All it takes is a thin layer that you can lay on with your fingers, then let it tack off before you use it. Another trick I have used on intake manifold gaskets (with embossed and raised sealing ribs) is to lay the gasket on a work bench, with the sealing ribs downward and the concave side of the rib upward. Then, I'll apply the black silicone to the groove and smooth it over with my fingers for a reasonably smooth surface. Then repeat that with the other side with the raised rib, using the fingers only to apply a thin coat of silicone sealer. Putting a thin coat on the interior of the port holes and water passage(s) for good measure is done also. What this does, in effect, is make it a "Print-O-Seal" style gasket. That style of gasket came out in the middle '80s and typically utilized a flat paper gasket with a thin bead of silicone applied to both of the sealing surfaces at the factory. It's more forgiving and conformable between the two clamping surfaces than the paper or composition gasket ever could be. So, my "doctored" intake gasket is not only sealed with a thin layer of silicone for easier cleanup should the manifold ever need to be removed/replaced, it's also got the added bead of silicone for added sealing integrity over the long haul too. Of course, hold down bolt torque on those gaskets can be critical too. Too much (for a better seal) can warp the metal cover stampings and require straightening with an appropriate hammer device before they'll be ok again. As for the front seal area, the drive belt for the water pump and generator and such exerts an "upward" force on the nose of the crankshaft. In extreme cases, when you disassemble the engine and remove the crankshaft, the front main will have a worn upper bearing half and an "unused" lower bearing half. Just one of the little things that an experienced engine builder will find when doing the "teardown autopsy" on an engine before rebuilding it. The wear grove mentioned will be on the harmonic balancer/front hub that's retained on the front of the crankshaft. There are some replacement aftermarket seals which move the actual seal from the OEM location so that it rides on a new area of the balancer/hub nose. The "jiffy sleeves" slide onto the existing balancer/hub to accomplish the same function. As mentioned, oil pan/block sealing can be a little tricky sometimes. To determine where the oil is coming from, check with a new car dealer's parts department shop counter and see if they have some of the flourescent oil dye (for engine oil; a similar product for transmissions too) that they use in their shop to trace oil leaks with (using a black light). GM has it under a particular part number in their Standard Parts catalog and others make it too. This additive will make the treated oil glow when the black light is turned on near it. In the mean time, you might get it ready to look for by using some Castrol SuperClean or, more selectively, some spray brake cleaner to get things cleaned off before you add the dye and use the black light. Hope this helps . . . NTX5467

On the earlier computer controlled vehicles, there were ways to get the Check Engine light to flash the code sequence. Sometimes, the first code flashed was to signify that it would be flashing codes and didn't mean anything. Back then, each manufacturer had their own codes and they could change with each model year, so having a code list for that particular year of Chrysler product can be necessary, otherwise you'll be chasing a code for something different than what you really need. As far as the fuel injection system goes, there should be a pressure tap on the injector rail setup to check the pressure during crank and run modes. Flow isn't enough as it takes a minimum pressure to let the injectors do their thing. Don't forget to check the fuel filter for restrictions. Be sure to check the operation of the fuel pump and engine oil pressure switches. If there is low or no oil pressure (sometimes or a signal of such to the computer) the fuel pump will think the engine is stopped and not turn on. The variability of the issue can make for a lengthy diagnosis situation, unfortunately, but just because it's a computer controlled fuel injected vehicle does not mean that the basic items should not be looked at before heading into the electronics. Using the stored computer codes can lead you in particular directions and ease things somewhat, but a thorough diagnosis by competent technicians will need to be done sooner or later. Hope this helps . . . NTX5467

I looked at strut mounts and bearings for a '95 Lumina today. It has the bearing as part of the lower spring mount, along with a rubber spring insulator on the bottom too. I suspect that GM W-car (Lumina-type cars) will be that way until the design change that came with the next generation of Grand Prix a few years after that. Haven't looked at later model Luminas, though. Enjoy! NTX5467

I can understand your frustration at having an "invisible" vehicle. As for the VIN, there is a new tool we have at GMDealerworld called "GMVIS" which will pull up some VINs that might not be in the latest updates in the GM Parts database (but not prior to the earlier production cut-off production year). Of late, we've had several "just off the transport" pickups that needed something and the VINs were too new, but it seems that as soon as GM produces a vehicle, that vehicle's data is in GMVIS. Next time you're near the dealership, go over to one of the service writers and get them to run GMVIS on your conversion vehicle's VIN. On the front page, it'll pull up the basic warranties and coverages and such. If you click on "Vehicle Build" (on the upper horizontal menu), it'll bring up a page with all of the option codes and such for the vehicle too. Get them to print you that page (they might want to see some picture ID and other ownership documentation) and maybe it'll help you with your dealership parts situations. It might help if you also explain why this information can be helpful to you. For a conversion vehicle, it might be helpful as there might not be a Service Parts ID Label like there is on non-conversion vehicles. Whatever numbers or ID that Centurion put on the vehicle would pertain to situations where you might need to replace some part that Centurion installed as part of the conversion and would typically have no significance with respect to the GM dealership situation. This Centurion number could be very significant to Centurion, though, in a parts/equipment replacement situation. In the auto supply business, even some of the chains like NAPA but moreso with the independents, there are several different supply chains they might pull from--but the number of chains or jobbers they can get into seems to be dwindling. For example, I recently saw a NAPA dealer from east TX. He related how they'd cut up his supply network so that he couldn't buy from AC-Delco jobbers in Dallas any more, but had to buy from a much smaller and less inventoried jobber in western Louisiana. He wasn't happy as it negatively affected how he did business and took care of his customers' needs. Our local NAPA store uses the NAPA regional warehouse in OKC and usually has overnight service for it (FYI, NAPA Exhaust parts appear to be retagged Walker Exhaust parts). The regional O'Reilly's warehouse in Duncanville, TX has become somewhat legendary for what they have down there (I recently ordered reman brake calipers, new brake lines and such for a '73 Mercedes 450SEL and they were in stock and we had them the next day), but the quality of the local "help" can be variable. Sometimes it takes a little time to find the best local/regional source for what it is you're looking for in carparts regardless of what kind of vehicle it is. Before I went to work at the dealership, I already had shopped for parts enough to know what to get from the dealer, what aftermarket brands were better than factory, where the most helpful parts people were, and where the best prices were. Once I found out about those things, it was much less stressful. Having been on the customer side of the counter and having had the door slammed in my face for "we can't get that" when I'd already done enough research to know that it was available from the vehicle manufacturer raised my sensitivity on those issues. For example, I have a '70 Dodge Monaco Brougham 4-dr hardtop. It came with an AM radio and rear speaker. I went to the local Chrysler store (in '77) and looked up all of the part numbers and then traced them for number changes and then for pricing. Everything except the front to rear harness for the speakers was still available. I went to a larger metro Dodge store where we were getting our Chrysler parts for our GM dealership. The old line parts guy didn't even look up or break pace from doing something to tell me that all of that stuff was not available anymore. I didn't challenge him, I just went back to the local Chrysler store and placed the order and let the parts guy determine how cheaply he could sell it to me (our family had done business there for many years and it was a smaller dealership). Inside of about a week, everything had filtered in from Detroit and other warehouses. He sold it all to me at less than retail, I paid out, and everyone was happy. Now, unless I know for sure, from experience, that something is discontinued from GM, I will look it up and verify it before telling the customer that is was discontinued on such and such date. If it's something that might be in restoration parts, I always like to be able to refer the customer to a restoration vendor(s) or website(s) as a possible source for what they need too. As is typical, when one door (from the OEM manufacturer) closes, others (for alternative sources) open and then their search has some direction and continued purpose. Enjoy! NTX5467

Most of the auto supply scan tools are probably designed to read codes which deal with emissions systems and such. If their scan tool won't communicate with the vehicle computer, there's a reason that GM designed it that way. It's called "safety related system" or something they didn't want just anybody messing with for liability reasons. That also means that the auto supply scan tools are not as sophisticated as the GM Tech2 scan tools at the dealerships or others on the market. You might be able to turn the light on and off with the defeat switch, but that doesn't really mean anything with the vehicle stopped. I suspect there's a problem with one of the wheel speed sensors for the anti-lock brake system, which also feed wheel speed information to the computer for traction control purposes. Most traction control systems use brake intervention to slow a spinning wheel and then also use the wheel speed sensor to determine when a wheel looses traction and the traction control system needs to activate. It could be a chafed or grounded or broken wire or similar. Many of those sensors are also built integral with the wheel bearing hubs too. As "Traction Control ON" is the default mode for those systems, if it automatically turns itself off I suspect there's some sort of data that's absent in the data stream to the computer. The main information source for that system is the wheel speed sensor at each wheel. Might also be a speedometer speed sensor in the mix too as a reference point signal. A physical inspection of the wheel speed sensors and such can be done by a competent technician. It could also be a degraded terminal in the wiring connector too. If nothing turns up with that inspection, then pulling the codes manually or with a full blown scan tool (that might communicate with the computer) would be the next step. Any competent repair shop will have their own high quality scan tool that might communicate with the vehicle computer and they will probably charge a check-out fee. Even if the auto supply scan tool had pulled the traction control codes, the repair shop will want to do their own diagnosis before anything is done. Hope this might give you an idea of where to look. Enjoy! NTX5467

Matt, Ford did build some V-8 Rangers in the '90s, but not for public consumption. A friend was in the parts department of a large Ford dealer in Dallas at that time. Ford had them shipped down and they were delivered to a local courier service for evaluation, complete with data recorders under the front seat. You can imagine the fun those guys had! After the 90 days or so, they went back to Ford. As for "conversion vehicles", many parts people are not aware they even exist, except for the more common van-type vehicles. Unfortunately, the mentality that "if it's not in the computer, it doesn't exist or was built by ______" exists. In such cases, all the customer has to say is "it's a conversion from a _______" and that should give them enough information to deal with--whether it's at the dealership level or the auto supply level. Same thing exists with the GM motorhome chassis vehicles. The owners call up and expect the dealership to have all of the parts for them, yet all GM supplies is a rolling chassis. Everything else is done by the motorhome manufacturer. Even if it's a GM chassis doesn't mean all of the components on them are GM. For many years, they used a particular a/c control from Chrysler vehicles of the middle '70s. To get a new one required a trip to a Chrysler dealer or a motorhome service facility even though it was a GM chassis vehicle. Before the extended cab GM trucks came out on the '88 C/K series (not to be confused with the more recent 3-door versions), there were some conversion companies that built some extended cab trucks on the '87 C/K body. If you looked closely, you could see where they did their paint work in acrylic lacquer instead of the factory acrylic enamel. They ordered in a long bed truck and then put a short bed on it and added the rear body cap and such. On the Dodge side of things, they stopped building crew cab trucks not long after they stopped having big block V-8s in them. There is/was a place in Cleburne, TX that did crew cab conversions on the newer Rams--with Chrysler's blessings and full warranty. There was also a place in CA that did Ram "Suburbans" several years ago too (using many GM body panels and such), not to mention the Mexico market's Ramcharger on the Ram chassis. So, unfortunately, those of us on the other side of the parts counter can only find the desired items if WE know what kind of vehicle we are dealing with, just like it's always been. We, unfortunately, can't read minds either, but we CAN ask questions about the vehicle in order to gain the information we feel we need to have to get to where we need to be in the part search. People call up all the time and say (for examaple) "I need a door handle for my Chevy truck, you have one?" "Yes, we probably do. What year of vehicle to you have?" and then it progresses from there until we have enough information to make a valid parts search--in the computer or in the earlier times of paper parts books either way. At one time several years ago, we devised questions about the trucks that the customers could answer as we had three different versions of full size trucks to deal with. Asking "new body style" or "old body style" didn't work anymore so I devised questions like "When you open the door, do you push a button and pull, pull upward on the handle, or grab the handle and just pull it toward you?" Luckily each one of the trucks had different style outside door handles and a/c controls! So, if you go into a dealership or parts store and they start asking a lot of questions, even if they seem irrelevant, please answer them as best you can and, at the dealership, having an insurance card with an accurate VIN can help expedite things for later model vehicles. It's one of those deals where you can't progress to the next step if the previous step's answer is not filled in. Even with the older paper books, we would have to ask the same questions anyway, just that they weren't scripted by a computer database's requirements. Having the VIN allows us to determine what options and other equipment your vehicle was produced with so having that can help eliminate some of the questions. If the vehicle's been converted from it's original form by an outside conversion vendor, that information can be helpful too. And then there were the deals with the beloved Buick Skylark changing body series from the Chevy Nova platform to front wheel drive. Looking at the build date or inspection sticker didn't work then--way back in the late '70s--so having a VIN was critical on that deal too. A sharp parts person (at the dealership or parts store) who'd been bit by that deal would know to ask for a valid year model (or if it was front wheel drive/sideways engine or rear wheel drive) for the car under repair lest they have an irate customer who ordered the wrong year model of part. The automotive business is constantly evolving. The vehicles have changed as much in the last 30 years as they did in the 30 years before that and the 30 years before that. It's not going to change either! Those of us in the dealership side of things have to stay up with it regardless of where our "sweet spot years or vehicles" are. Saying "I don't like those new cars so I'm only going to deal with the older ones I like" is NOT an option for us. Parts lookups have changed too and we have to adapt to those things too. There are times I enjoy getting back into the older paper parts books, but even then you sometimes had to read between the lines to determine what part goes to what application or how to decode the nomenclature for engines, options, and such. For example, back then Chevy's factory air was listed as "CAC" (car air conditioning) and the hang down a/c was "Cool Pak". "TurboFire" = small block V-8 and "TurboJet" = big block V-8. TurboFire 400 was a small block 2bbl yet TurboJet 400 was the 402 big block 4bbl. Then there was "HPE" (High Performance Engine, 350hp small block V-8), "SHPE" (Special High Performance Engine, 370 hp small block V-8 aka LT-1), "HD" (Heavy Duty 427 = L88), and "FI" (Fuel Injection 375 hp 327). "Chevy" meant "Chevy II", "Pass Car" meant BelAirs and Impalas and such. Compared to all of the Chevy build variations, dealing with the Buick "series" numbers can be much easier once you understand that deal too. As much as the parts database computers might be disliked, they are here to stay and are much easier to deal with on all sides with just a little adaptation or shifting gears. Nothing's really changed, just how it's done. Having accurate and correct vehicle information to give to the parts person is just as important as it ever was. Hopefully, my parts person associates will have questions about the vehicles that the customer can answer instead of asking questions they can't answer (as in the door handle example I mentioned). Sorry for the length, but there are some realities on the "other side" of the parts counter too. Cooperative customers are always appreciated. Enjoy! NTX5467

Thanks for that information, Mike and Nancy! I guess that now that this information is available, perhaps our chapter operatives might take some steps to increase their chapter's voter turnout in future elections--"legally", of course? But not to dictate who to vote for either. Thanks! NTX5467

Unfortunately, dealership experiences can have wide variations. I don't know about the other GM Parts databases, but the Bell+Howell one we have has an AC-Delco "All Makes" catalog in it that covers AC-Delco parts back to the middle '60s or so in many cases. Many dealership parts people don't know it's in there or how to use it, preferring to say they can't find a particular oil filter or whatever that is in AC-Delco and that alternative catalog, for example. There are some ins and outs to use some of the listings, but it's all just pointing and clicking just like in the regular parts database listings. Similarly, every paper catalog that GM used to print is now in the GM Parts database listings in the parts computers. Just have to look for them under "Alternative Catalogs". Parts stores with computers are similarly no better. They have a list of things to ask about the vehicle just as the dealership people do in order to even get to the part number listings. On the late models, it expedites things when you have a VIN for the vehicle too. Even GM's orientation is that a parts person request a VIN before they begin to look up a part for a late model vehicle. It seems that product knowledge of what goes where or what models are what is not important any more OR that parts people have any real mechanical knowledge as that used to come in extremely handy in the earlier decades. Oh well . . . It's always been a problem when the parts people are younger than your car is. One time I went in search of a "timing tape" so I could check total ignition timing above idle. The guy brought out a timing chain. Another time about 20 years later, I went in search of ignition point grease and was presented dielectric silicone. Lots of stories about those things out there, I suspect. In more modern times, service writers/consultants might not be from "around here" with respect to the dealership or have not been in the area long enough to have any real knowledge of what other shops in the area might be good shops. Unfortunately, many dealership people are not the true experts on particular vehicles just because they work at a dealeship that many custoemrs perceive or expect them to be. It's always been that way to varying degrees probably since the early days of automobiles. Sometimes, those of us with older vehicles tend to forget how "old" our vehicle is in relation to the current models or how much the automotive landscape has changed since that earlier vehicle was built/designed. The newest vehicle I have is a 1980 Chrysler Newport V-8. If I took that into a Chrysler store needing the Electronic Engine Computer diagnosed, they'd look puzzled seeing that lean burn computer hung on the side of the air cleaner. Much less know what the special computer tester that diagnosed it was! They'd probably want to know how the 360 V-8 was not a Magnum too. Getting the correct service manuals and learning some basic repair procedures does have its merits. Enjoy! NTX5467

The lower control arms on a typical strut-front-end car, such as your Cutlass, have pivot bushings just as they would on a rear wheel drive car, plus a lower ball joint where the "knuckle" attaches. The knuckle is what the front wheel bearing hub assembly bolts on and also where the lower part of the strut attaches with two bolts. At the upper end of the strut is where the strut bearing and mount assembly is. The front wheel bearing hub assembly takes the place of older style inner and outer wheel bearings. It's also what the brake rotor attaches to plus the front wheel drive axle comes through it. They are not greaseable so replacement is the only option if they get slack or start making a bearing noise. In many cases, they also house the wheel speed sensors for the anti-lock brakes (which may or may not come only with a new hub assembly as a unit. The hub attaches to the knuckle with four bolts once the drive axle attachments are removed. Not sure why you might need lower control arm pivot bushings unless they have deteriorated and will not allow the front end to hold proper alignment anymore. Might be possible that they called them by the incorrect name, which has been known to happen. As mentioned, clarification might be necessary. When replacing struts that have many miles on them, replacing the upper mounts/bearings is a good idea too as you'll be there when you remove the strut assembly anyway. The rubber can deteriorate and replacing them should put things back "as new" again, especially if they make a knocking noise on bumps. As the struts and such are part of the suspension architecture, doing anything that alters their relative position to the other suspension parts can require having a new front end alignment being done also. Hope this helps . . . NTX5467

While those of us that have grown up with the various vintages of vehicles might be quick to bemoan the observed lack of knowledge of them in the repair industry, unless it's someone who's our age and used to work on them "when they were new", the reality of the issue is that most dealerships technicians' expertise is more toward the more current model vehicles. Nowadays, getting a vehicle in with a carburetor that needs work can be a major issue--because most of the younger technicians grew up with fuel injection and electronic ignitons, for example. Similar situations can also exist at the parts department with parts consultants that have never used a paper parts book. In the early '80s, a customer brought a pretty nice early model Corvair in for something minor. A younger tech made a comment about how good they got that factory radio (with the Chevy bow tie on the dial) to fit in the instrument panel. The shop foreman replied that it came that way. The tech looked puzzled as he looked at the car. The shop foreman finally told him that Chevrolet actually made this car in the early to late '60s as the young tech thought it was something someone had "home built" or customized--he was born a few years after that particular car was produced and Nader had already done his deals before this young guy was in puberty. Even if the dealerships had accepted your car for an alignment job, would they have known all of the dynamics of setting the alignment angles as most of them have no experience on anything except strut front ends or later model light truck alignments at best. We have an older front end tech that hates anything with eccentric washers/cam bolts and such as they can allegedly move after the final adjustment is made--he only feels safe using solid alignment shims as they won't change unless something bends in the frame or suspension. From his perspective, he want's what he did to stay as it was after he did it. All of the fancy computerized alignment machines are just higher tech level meauring devices--period. They will dictate when for the technician to manually move the wheels from side to side and such as they make their computations. Probably more accurately than reading a bubble in a level, but the earlier vehicles probably don't need that higher degree of accuracy anyway. Still, valid alignment measurements can be made whether the vehicle's data is in the machine's database or not. I highly suspect that whatever specs there are for the earlier cars will be similar to the '70s full size cars. Won't matter if the machine says it's out of spec for the newer vehicle or not if the specs for the vehicle from the Buick shop manual are met. It's all in how you manipulate the machine and it's database after the alignment check and readjusting is done, no more no less. On the other side of things, from a realistic perspective, if you put a little positive caster (probably about 1-1.5 degrees) and set the camber to basically 0 degrees (or with a slight bias from side to side in caster or camber to compensate for road crown in the area) and the toe-in to about 3/8-1/2 inch (for bias ply tires), that should put things pretty close, I suspect. Many of the older vehicles with manual steering used negative caster to lower the effort it took to steer the car while power steering cars used some positive caster as steering effort was not an issue. Positive caster helps with directional stability, somewhat, but also increase steering effort. I have a friend that took over his dad's alignment shop when he eased out of things due to his advancing age. Randy grew up in the business and has a clip on bubble meter that he uses for caster and camber adjustments. Then there's an old drive-over toe-in checker at the entrance to the rack (been in use since the '40s I suspect!). Randy has seen most everything from exotic imports to mainstream domestic stuff and knows them all. As with other things, it's not the tools as such, but how the tools are used. If there are any computers in the place, they're probably in the newer cars in there--at least last time I was over there. Many dealers really don't desire to work on older vehicles due the "ojt" deal mentioned. At least with the more recent '80s vehicles, there should be some service manuals there and the vehicle architecture is similar enough to current stuff (which the techs have been trained on) that they can figure it out. Unfortunately, there have been some repair jobs on older vehicles that have turned very sour for the customer and everyone else involved at dealerships over the years. From that perspective, better to send that job to someone better able to handle it and concentrate on the newer vehicles where factory tech assistance can be available. Even though the computer's trouble codes might point to definite diagnostics, you still need to have an understanding of the dynamics involved to expedite the repair. Ojt might be good and interesting, but when it's sitting in a tech's stall, it's not making anyone any money until it is fixed, quality control checked, and is delivered to the customer (who pays the bill). Doesn't matter if it's a current year model or something more vintage. So, don't feel abandonded with the older vehicles in getting them worked on. There's usually someone around that does some work on street rods and such and will work on other older vehicles too. Some of the retired mechanics still do some work too, on the side, or part time for private shops. There's even some private shops that they still own too! It's all out there somewhere, with good people still in them, but you just have to look a little harder or use some network contacts to find them. Unfortunately, there are still some shysters in the mix too so shop and research carefully. As always, the good guys will be worth what they charge. Just some thoughts . . . NTX5467

I'd vote for semi-gloss satin black. Like the air cleaners and such were painted. GM Gloss Engine Black matches those things perfectly (from what I've seen and used of it) and is less expensive than chrome. I suspect that even if the top frame matched the top fabric color, the level of gloss should still be in the semi-gloss satin range instead of having a hard shine as the outer body panels would have. Just my gut reaction . . . from what I've seen GM and others do over the years at the factory level versus what some restorers do to "make it better". Of course, it all depends on what your goals for the vehicle are and how much funding is available. Wouldn't cost much more to chrome everything instead of just a few of the pieces that will show, though. Perhaps some solid documenation exists on this subject? Enjoy! NTX5467

Thanks for that information. I seem to recall that the cam specs I posted were for the small block and not the nailhead V-8. Still haven't found the book, but have found the later ones (post-nailhead). The SAE specs are supposed to be something like at .006" lobe lift on the intake and similar (maybe .008"?) on the exhaust. The .050" lift spec was something the aftermarket put together as an "agreed upon" measurement to kind of make some sense of the "advertised" and "actual" specs on cams as some manufacturers might quote larger numbers than others for almost exactly the same camshaft. Many OEMs don't quote the .050" spec, but for stock cams it's supposed to be about 80% of advertised duration and closer to 85% for factory performance cams so that might put things into the general ballpark for comparison purposes. By using the .050" spec, all of the "ramps" are not included so it's supposed to represent the "meat" of the lift curve. Chevy and some others tended to use "total duration" for their advertised cam specs back then, which made the numbers waaayyyy larger than anyone elses for duration. In one respect, using every bit of lift past the basecircle dimension would be accurate, but it would also allow all of the transition ramps to be included where there was basically zilch significant lift. This is where the .050" spec comes in handy. Thanks again for that information! NTX5467

Some of that information should be in the owner's manual (reprogramming). Not sure if the two years will be the same as some needed to be done ONLY with the Tech2 computerized diagnostics the dealers have and earlier years could be done in the car (which usually take just a few minutes to do). Not sure which way your vehicle fits into that year model break. When the preprogramming is done, ALL of the transmitters that you want to work NEED to be there and programmed at that time as the reprogramming process clears previous memory and build new memory of the transmitters the vehicle's supposed to recognize. In short, the $25.00 the dealer (not GM) wants to charge is pretty dang reasonable. The "one half day" deal would be so they can fit it into their work schedule (even if you make an appointment, it's like going to the doctor's office with an appointment, for example). Considering that if you have problems with a flaky set of reprogram instructions (hopefully not) or things don't "take" as they should, then you could spend quite a bit of time doing it yourself (plus frustration). For $25.00, I think I'd let them do it and enjoy some "off time" or something. Or you can buy the GM/Buick service manual set for about $100.00. Make sure that if you get any reprogram instructions, that they are for YOUR SPECIFIC VEHICLE--period. The cars might look the same as the remote transmitters might, but they can be different from year to year. If it takes the Tech2 to reprogram the system, not much choice there. Just some thoughts . . . NTX5467 NTX5467

Seems like I posted those specs several month ago, from a copy of Peterson's "Complete Book of Engines" series that they started in '65. Not sure about how the initial timing specs might differ unless there was a difference in standard transmission (usually retarded from what the automatics were) or emissions systems (if that was an issue back then). From what I've casually observed, using a "period" sevice manual (either GM/Buick or Motor or Chilton's) would be the best resource for that information instead of something published many years later where some of the settings might have been combined. Seems like the 1x4 and 2x4 cams were the same with the main difference being the extra carb and dual exhaust. The 2x4 engine probably came with a 3.42 rear axle ratio instead of the regular 1x4 ratio. The differences in how the manifolding works on the 2x4 manifolds versus the 1x4 manifold might make for a different idle characteristics and speeds even with the same cam. In the mean time, I'll try to find my book and repost the cam timing specs. Enjoy! NTX5467

Seems like I've seen some of that stuff in bulk stock in some upholstery supply catalogs? It's been a while . . . Maybe some of the vintage upholstery fabric/vinyl suppliers might have some leads on this? I don't know if they might have the particular deal you're looking for, but getting some built by a competent trim shop (or whoever) might be an option. Was the base "guts" of that welting solid or rubber? Just curious. Enjoy! NTX5467

Going to be lots of things to do and see up there for sure! Hopefully we can get them all squeezed in! Enjoy! NTX5467

The basic pressure output of the pump is governed by the relief valve spring in the pump itself. The spring tension governs high, low, or medium pressure at the specified rpm level. This has nothing to do if it's a "high volume" pump or a regular pump. Oil viscosity can have an impact, but I suspect that as long as it's reasonably close to what it needs to be to keep the bearings supplied without causing them to knock (giving consideration to the earlier times when 10W oil might be used in the very cold winter climates and thicker oil in warmer weather) the pressure should be in specs. If it's too thick, it will take too long for the pressure to build to specs (called "pumpability" in the cold weather specs). As mentioned, the bypass valving in some filters is there to not (hopefully) blow the filter housing off of the engine if the filter should become totally or significantly clogged. No more, no less. I think that relief valve is set to about 10psi pressure differential. In some later model filters, there's also an "anti-drainback" valve to keep the oil from (supposedly) draining out of the oil galleries in the block when the engine is stopped. This is supposed to help get oil flowing quicker to the bearings and such upon startup and maybe address some bearing clatter issues before things get all pressured up. As I recall, the oil pump kit for the Buick V-8s of that vintage is just a new pair of gears and a new end plate that they run against. It's a softer steel, I suppose so it is designed to wear first rather than the oil pump gears. In some engines, the oil doesn't exactly flow through the supply lines smoothly and that can place varying loads on the pump itself, which might tend to vary the pressure some and also cause "spark scatter" with the engine timing where the distributor drives off of the oil pump shaft. In earlier engines that were not specifically designed for oil filters, they did filter only part of the engine oil via the mentioned restrictions and such. By filtering only the excess oil via a fixed restriction, it was easy to adapt to the existing oiling setup in the block. The "full flow" filter arrangements came later as all of the oil was filtered as the filters were a part of the oiling circuit instead of being an "add-on" situaiton. Those oil pressure wild variations mentioned certainly sound unusual. I concur that if it was due to internal bearing clearances (main, rod, or camshaft) that they should be consistent and relative to engine temperature and possibly rpm. Perhaps the pressure relief spring was in the process of deteriorating or had broken? Combined with normal wear on the thrust plate in the pump, possibly that might explain the sporadic variations? As mentioned, it's always good to get a "second opinion" with a different gauge setup. Enjoy! NTX5467

As the 215 V-8 was also used by Olds in the early '60s Cutlass and F-85s, there might be a different trans that Olds used than the Dual-Path Dynaflow. Don't understand why you're having that much trouble getting one to last unless there are valve body issues (warpage and/or pitting) that prevent the fluid from getting where it needs to go or from going places it shouldn't in a particular operational mode. Also, as the 215 V-8 tooling was sold to Rover in the '70s AND that engine family is still in use in more recent various Land Rover models, there might be some possibilities there too. Also be aware that any swap to a different trans can have floorpan clearance issues to deal with. Finding quality rebuilder parts and getting a quality rebuild would be the best way to go if you could, of course paying attention to the valve body condition issues I mentioned in the process. You could always convert it to a manual transmission that came in those cars back then too. Even a 4-speed option! There might be someone in the Skylark Club that could have some input on this situation too. Enjoy! NTX5467

In the late '70s or early '80s, GM put out a tech bulletin to not use 20W-50 oil in their engines. The reason listed was that the viscosity improvers could stack up behind the rings and cause the rings to stick. When I questioned our Pennzoil rep about that (as I'd already logged over 100,000 miles+ in with my 305 Camaro at that time with no problems on 20W-50 Castrol), he replied that in their routine testing of oils, that GM found that problem with possibly one brand of oil so they had to make a blanket recommendation against all of them as they couldn't say "Don't use ______ oil" in their service literature. In the earlier '70s some manufacturers would allow 20W-50 if the ambient temps were consistently above 90 degrees and under sustanined speeds of 75+ mph, in other words, high speeds with heavy loads. As oil technology and ratings have progressed, that recommendation might not be applicable today. Now, even in their heavy duty rated one ton pickup applications, the GM recommendation is 10W-30 and the diesels are 15W-40 with only a few car motors recommended at 5W-30. In more modern times, the 10W-30 oil is now listed as "fuel conserving" whereas the heavier weights aren't. If the bearing clearances and such in your earlier motors are still in spec, there probably would not be any real benefit to using 20W-50 in place of 10W-40, I suspect. Using ANY viscosity improver additive with one of the heavier multi-weights is not recommended either! I suspect the main reason that 10W-30 or 5W-30 is currently recommended has more to do with decreasing the amount of power used to drive the oil pump in the engine and how quickly the oil flows after startup. These things can have an impact on the modern computer controlled engines, I suspect. Plus, if they use 10W-30 oil to run the emissions testing and fuel economy testing, that's what they have to recommend be used by the customer. My main concern would probably be making sure the complete cooling system is in good shape (the block passages and the radiator and fan clutch and shround and such) plus maybe putting a few degrees of additional spark advance in the motor (and making sure the vacuum advance is working). By design, the emission controlled motors typically ran a little hotter than their higher compression ratio counterparts to help have higher exhaust temperatures to continue "cooking" the emissions in the exhaust manifold and such. Just going from a rated 9.2 compression ratio to 8.2 will significantly increase exhaust gas temps at the end of the tail pipe. Engines with their spark timing specs retarded from optimum also resulted in higher operating temps. I suspect that some attention in these areas might help your heat concerns. To me, a quality 10W-40 regular oil would be as thick as you'd need to go if you desired a little more heat protection. Upgrading to the same brand of blended synthetic 10W-40 or 10W-30 oil that you're presently using would be an option too. It's possible that the blended synthetics might be a little slicker and might remove a little of the friction induced heat as a result, but if that amount of heat is significant, then you'll soon have other situations to address with the engine, I suspect. If the engine is running at 200 degrees, the oil temp will typically follow that temp after about 10 miles of driving. That's still about 70 degrees before oil degradation due to heat will start happening with normal oil (i.e., not blended of full synthetic). As for auto supply "wonder" additives, if you start with a quality oil of the correct viscosity, you should not need anything extra to add to the oil. Years ago, a customer had a Pontiac 400 that had some bearing noise. He changed the oil and put 20W-50 in it with one can of STP. He then added another can of STP to that mix. We sold the repair shop that got the car a new crank and set of bearings. It had been acknowledged that one can of STP would raise the upper viscosity level by 10 numbers. In that case, he ended up with 30W-70--might just as well have put rear axle lube in there. Just some thoughts . . . Have a great trip to Flint! NTX5467