1911, 1913, 1914 Stoddard Dayton Indianapolis 500 Pace Cars

[tbenvie]

I have some questions on the Stoddard Dayton Pacemakers used at the Indy 500. There seems to be a mix-up on which cars are which, but fortunately there are a few photos with dates to help ID them. All three of the cars were Roadsters, that much I know.  The placement of the headlights are the give-away to identify the cars and year they paced the race. In 1911 the headlights appear to be mounted on the front frame rails and there is a license plate. In 1913 the headlights are higher, and have a crossbar between them. In 1914 the headlights are even higher, with the cross bar, but also have a front license plate on them  So could someone tell me why the differences as I've seen photos where the 1911 has a cross bar, and photos from 1913 where the headlights are in the same position as in 1911. 

Some references state the 1913 and 1914 races were paced by the same carm especially since Stoddard did not make any cars in 1914. The photos look like two differebt cars.

Lastly, it is not known what engine was used in the cars, especially if the 1913 or 1914 used a Knight engine. Anyone know?


Here are some photos:

The first three are from the 1911 race-easy to identify the year as it was the only year the Pacemaker car was located in what is now known as the "Pole Position". The first three are from 1911, the next two from 1913, the next 4 are from 1914

The 10th picture is of a car that is said to be the Pace car, but although it was a Stoddrd Dayton it is not a roadster and the track is dirt. And the last picture is of the 1911 Stoddard Dayton found at the Speedway museum. Obviously again not a roadster. The last picture shows Carl Fisher, Pace Car driver and owner of the Speedway in a Stoddard Dayton with the same license plate seen on the 1914 Roadster. 

Can anyone make sense of all this for me?  Thanks

 

[Dandy Dave]

The top photo looks a lot like the remains of the Stoddard Dayton I owned. After some research, and with the recollection of the old fellow that last drove it, it was a Knight engine powered automobile. Here's some info from a 1913 Book that I have in my collection of stuff. 

Edited March 9 by Dandy Dave (see edit history)

[trimacar]

The front view with the IF team is Carl Fisher with his personal Special Roadster.  Fisher was a dealer for S-D, Overland, and other makes, and probably had numerous license plates with the same number on them (a typical dealer practice back then).  The picture with the three cars lined up show him in the far car, a Stoddard Dayton, the two cars in front of that are Overlands.  Note the tie rod in front of the axle on the Stoddard.

[tbenvie]

Here is. my completed 1911 Stoddard Dayton Pacemaker group:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/656795262321615

[Paul Dobbin]

  40 years ago next month, a 1906 Stoddard-Dayton and a 1910 Palmer-Singer both passed me (In a 1934 Ford Tudor) on the Indianapolis

  Motor Speedway for the end of the 1984 Interstate Batteries Great American Race.    After the rally across the country, we finished on

  the Indy track and the instructions said CAS 50 MPH, but many participants including these two had a grudge race.   I had my  entire crew

  (5 guys) in the car and the Stoddard had put the back half of the touring body on to carry their whole crew.   Joel Naive drove the white

  Stoddard and Walt Cunny drove the Palmer.

  

Edited March 23 by Paul Dobbin
Stoddard & Singer in inside lane @ Indy (see edit history)