Lea Francis

[oldcar]

An academic is something I can never lay claim to be.

My only claim to fame is as an IMPECUNIOUS ENTHUSIAST!

Likewise I have had a huge number of (Proper) cars, mainly Lagondas including a LG45 Drop head coupe and a V12 Sedan. 

I would still love to have a Pre WW1 11.1 Hp. the very first Lagonda. 

I have never even aspired to have either a Bentley or a Bugatti and certainly not a Rolls Royce.

Meanwhile we are still planning our next trip to the UK, France, and some other parts of Europe,  taking the Rapier with us to use as our daily transport for one last "Grand Tour".

 

Bernie j.

Our books are spread around almost every room in the house, except the smallest room. Likewise we have motoring memorabilia spread throughout our house.  We even have some trophies from the AACA.

I wonder how many of your American friends have even been to Australia let alone ship a car here to drive in our VSCC events. Possibly one of my regrets is that we never got to drive the Dixie Flyer while we had it in Louisville Kentucky.

At least it is now where it is most appreciated, with the people who made it in 1922! Todays extension of the Kentucky Wagon Company,  the Kentucky Trailer Co.

[oldcar]

Returning to the Lea Francis, despite the fact that many of the people reading this have never even heard the name let alone had any experience with the Marque, Lea Francis started making first bicycles and then motorcycles at the turn of the century (1901) They were well into building motorcars by about 1910. The fourteen horse-power car we are discussing here was first introduced in the 1930's and production recommenced in as early as 1945. The "Coachcraft" body on this car being Number 15, makes it one of the earliest Post WW2 Lea Francis to be made. As such it continues on with many of the features found in the Pre-war cars. Possibly the most important of these is the continuation of the "Beam-axle and leaf spring front suspension and the use of Girling rod operated brakes incorporating large drums. (see attached photograph.) 

An indication of the size of these may be found in the fact that the road wheels are 17 inch .

Edited July 13, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[DrData]

Serious looking drums. Are they self adjusting or adjusted by oneself?

[oldcar]

Thank you DrD,

The square projection at the top of the backing plate is the adjustment. Inside the drum a tapered wedge acts against the ends of both shoes forcing them apart. The  rod activated expander is located at the  oppposite ends of the brake shoes.

In this photograph both the adjustment and the rod activated expander are clearly seen. the adjustment is on the right hand side of the photograph. A quick look at Google "Girling rod activated brakes" will fully explain the operation of this powerful mechanical brake system. Girlling rod operated brakes were still being used by British car manufacturers into the 1950s. They are also used on my 1934 Lagonda Rapier, the Rapier was acclaimed as the first car to stop in less than 30 ft from 30mph. Even with damage to the rod to one wheel, unlike hydraulic systems, the brakes on the other three wheels 

continue to function normally.

 

Bernie j.

[oldcar]

My question today is, What do I do with this Lea Francis? I have had it advertised for sale, it is a rare car in restorable condition, I am ready to just about GIVE IT AWAY for what it cost me Aus $1,250 a  which is an absolute bargain.

One sold very recently for $30,000. 

 

Here are a couple of possibilities. Either of these are achieved simply by shortening the chassis to the "Sports" wheel base. i.e cuting 12 inches out of it, and doing away with the rear door but retaining all the original body, cutting off the roof if an open car is preferred.

Edited July 5, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[OldCarFan]

Perhaps if you repair the engine, first. Then you can decide later what you want to do with the body and chassis, or sell a running car, in need of a body restoration. 

[oldcar]

Thank you OCF,

I need someone to keep me on the straight and narrow. Once  I have some more of the panel work off, the engine is all but ready to "fall out".

I need to look on my shelves to see what con-rods I have in stock.

Please remember, life here in Melbourne, Australia, is very different for an 85 year old "person" than possibly in Illinois, USA. Looking at the photo of your MG "A" tells me that you are probably on a totally different wave-length  to me.

It goes without saying, the photograph below was taken some (65) years ago!

Just remember, the car shown is from the same stable as your "MG"! 

It is yet another Morris based sports car.........

 

Bj

Edited July 13, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[oldcar]

Further to the above, nothing "Morris" about this one, my taste in automobiles is very different. The car is actually a year ot two older than I am!

 1934 seems to have been a bad year for steel eating bugs. You need to look closely at these two photographs (below) to appreciate what is going on. Take a close look at the "head" of every bolt for  a start!

Then tell me what you can see? It is  not quite the same as it left the factory.

Edited July 6, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[OldCarFan]

Hi Bernie,

 

My car is also a few years older than me, and I have had it for 32 years.

While there are other cars I would have wanted, this one never fails to put a smile on my face when ever I pull the starter.

 

In the USA we don’t have lockdowns, and people can get vaccinated.

It is also summer, no snow to restrict our outdoor enjoyment.

Your LeaF project, while not a sports car, seems unusual and interesting enough to keep you going out to work on it. Hopefully the bolts don’t cause an unending headache for you, and you find some appropriate connecting rods.

 

I await your progress reports,

OCF Chris

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[oldcar]

Lea Francis despite being one of Britian's oldest manufacturers has never been what you could call a "Volume Producer"

Despite being based in Coventry one of Englands main industrial centres. You could almost count their production on the fingers of one hand. You only rarely see one for sale which makes this one that little bit different. They also sold bare chassis to "Connaught" who made even fewer Sports Racing cars. For this LeaF I have chosen not to go down thr Replica Connaught path. With all the major components of the body aluminium there is almost no rust to worry about, so I would like to retain as much as possible of the original car! Hopefully the "cut & shut" photograph (below) will give you some Idea of the direction I hope to go with.

 

Regarding the photographs of my Lagonda Rapier in my earlier post, during it's life as a "racing car" it underwent a period of weight reduction, hence the number of holes drilled in the chassis etc. I know of no other Rapier that has gone through this exercise. It's two seater sports roadster body also has Aluminium body panels etc.

 

Bernie j.

 

Edited July 6, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[DrData]

Just to chime in, my TD is about ten months older than me. I think Old Car Fan has provided you with a great plan…start with the engine and work from there. Plenty of time to consider your options. If you decide to keep the LeaF and shorten the chassis to sport spec, why not consider something more cut down for the coach, rather like a roadster look. That would still allow you to keep a good chunk of the original body and fenders.

[DrData]

Something along the lines of a 1947 LeaF 14 hp Sports?

[oldcar]

Thank you Dr D.

I have always liked to create something that little bit different, My "LeMans" version of a humble "Dodge Four" is typical. I doubt that you will ever see another Dodge quite like it.

Bj.

Edited July 7, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[oldcar]

 

Another very different 1920s Dodge. This one a dramatically shortened version!  It too has more than it's share of "lightening holes" AND trailing 1/4 elliptic rear springs. Even if I say so myself, quite unlike any other Dodge.

Bernie j.

[oldcar]

Please do not go away, I will return to the subject shortly.

 

[oldcar]

Ok, OK!   I promise not to chop up this LeaF, even though the LeaF engine was a favourite with the (Oval) Dirt Track Racers during the 1950's.

 

Bernie j.

Edited July 7, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[Stude17]

12 hours ago, oldcar said:

Ok, OK!   I promise not to chop up this LeaF, even though the LeaF engine was a favourite with the (Oval) Dirt Track Racers during the 1950's.

 

Bernie j.

Well that certainly explains its current condition Oldcar with only 42,500 genuine miles.  It was a dirt track racer for most of those miles.

[oldcar]

Hello Stude17

Not really, just sitting in a Barn collecting dust and mouse "droppings". What could be called "Total Neglect." left with the windows "open". It could be restored as a "oily rag" leaving the saloon body untouched. The  body being "all aluminium" Rust is not a problem, BUT the death-watch beetle has chewed up much of the timber body frame. Certainly "looking" at the engine is first priority.  I am afraid the the body may fall  apart if I attempt to lift it off the chassis.  Like all these things only time will tell. Sadly at 85 the amount of time left is an unknown! 

I need to move it away from our front door, it is not a "good look". At least it does discourage "door to door sales-men"

 

Bj. 

Edited July 8, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[Stude17]

Yes the decayed timber is certainly a problem.  Have you considered  something like a soft top ute?   The chassis  shouldn't need shortening for this and I'm sure you could fabricate the wooden back and brackets without too much trouble.  

[oldcar]

Hello Again

I intend to start by cutting the roof off first and next the door "pillars". I can then lift the floor and expose the chassis. 

I am not really into "Utes". 

 

Bernie j.

[oldcar]

We have just been watching the repeat of the Tour de France taking in the climb to the summit of Mount Ventou. We could relive our Climb of the same mountain in our Rapier in 2004, I cannot help wondering how many of the people reading this can make the same claim.

 

Bj

[Digger914]

Never seen a car with this much metal and a wood frame, so my imagination is running wild with what kind of rot could make it un-restorable and I really do wish I was close enough to get a good look at this thing. I didn't know anything but the absolute basics about fiberglass and nothing about carbon fiber before I bought a boat with a busted hull and my wild imagination has me wondering about replacing the rotted wood by molding in carbon fiber. 

 

I'm sure that whatever you do it will look great when it's done, but curiosity as to how this body is wrapped around the wood has me wondering.  

[oldcar]

Good Morning Digger

The attached photo shows the remaining timber in the windscreen pillars. Once the panels are fitted the timber is buried and difficult to photograph. YThje timber is also clearly visible along the top of the door in the first photograph.

You need to enter Automotive coach-built body timber frame into your search engine.

 

Bj.

Edited July 8, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[DrData]

Wow, that is really gone! Reminds me of the t8me we found termite damage when we lived in New Orleans. The framing lumber was turned into shredded wheat.

 

sad to see the coach framing in such bad shape…a true los$.

[Digger914]

Looks like keel rot but horizontal and I would have bet that it fixes the same way until I read up on timber coach / wood frame restoration and discovered that it might be even easier than I imagined. Of course there is only one way to find out and I've got nothing to try it on. 

[oldcar]

I am the first to admit I am next to useless working with wood which all my restorations have welded steel tube frames. For some unknown reason (old age) I can never get to finish any of my restorations. Most are sold and disappear behind someones garage doors, most never to be seen again. Recently I have been attempting to find a Lagonda 3 litre that I sold 3/4 finished a long time ago. It disappeared from sight about twenty (or more) years ago. It is one car that I would really like to finish. It was so close to finish and now is so far away.

 

Bj.

[Digger914]

Bernie,

 

Never to old to try something new and never underestimate the WOW factor, that is the boost you get when someone walks into your shop and says WOW. 

 

What you might be lacking in youthful stamina and exuberance, you more than make up for in talent and experience. To me, what you do with steel tubing is so far beyond my ability that it boggles the mind and way more difficult that replacing sections of rotted wood with epoxy soaked strips of fiber mesh. 

 

I knew almost nothing about fiberglass when I bought a boat with a busted hull and it was a learning experience, a big part of the experience was removing what I did wrong so I could do it right and doing it more than once. 

[oldcar]

Thank you Digger,

There is really just one car that is close to my heart, It has been mine for almost 50 years! This since buying it as a very run down and incomplete racing car. At last after months of "on and off lock down" we are going on a VSCC of Vic (Australia) day navigation run tomorrow. I have had it out today to top up the petrol tank and to check the tyre pressure. These are Michelin "Super Comfort" designed to run at a maximum of 20 lbs psi. Make them any harder and the car is "all overthe place". It will be great to have it out on the road again. There may be one or two looking  at this for the first time. That lever on the floor and working fore and aft through the quadrant, just where the drivers left hand falls is an important part of the package. It is the gear selection lever for the close ratio, ENV 75 Preselect transmission. 

I really can not explain why I even bother to become involved with lesser cars such as the LeaF.

 

Bj.

 

 

Edited July 10, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[Digger914]

You don't have to explain the LeaF to me, I have a similar weakness for projects and if I lived across the road from you I would learn everything I could from you and I wouldn't get anything done around my house until everything I knew how to do on the LeaF was done, or there was nothing more I could do to help.  

 

 

[oldcar]

Thank you Digger.

Before we return to the LeaF, we (Helen & I) have spent the entire day today driving in a remote corner of Victoria (Australia) Naturally this was a day for the Lagonda Rapier. Narrow twisting roads that took us around in a BIG circle.

It was great to be able to spend most of the day driving.   I am sure that the Lagonda Rapier enjoyed the outing too..

Remind me sometime to talk about the Rapier's engine.

 

Bernie j.

Edited July 11, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[DrData]

Bernie, good for you and Helen...out enjoying the Lagonda on a road trip day.  Our old cars need the exercise of a good run.  On your shot illustrating the shifter for the pre-selector gearbox, there is a "mushroom" situated further back, almost between the seats.  What is the function?

[Digger914]

Did you see any Koalas crossing at the Koala crossing signs?? 

[oldcar]

Hello Digger

You must learn, Koalas only ever come down out of their tree is to go to the toilet. Once they find a really comfortable tree they will stay up there all day. The effort of climbing up there is just too much. It is only after they have eaten all the best and juiciest leaves that they may decide to try another tree.

Meanwhile "H" and I had a really good drive yesterday. The Lagonda Rapier did not miss a beat.

Now I must go out into the garage and give it a quick check over so that it will be ready for our next outing.

 

Bj. 

 

 

After checking the water and oil levels, it just needs the carpet in the drivers "compartment" being given a quick "brush" with the little hand broom. I must also put my fur cap and warm gloves away for another winter's day of open air motoring!  

The one question after all this is, Why am I wasting my time  messing about with the Lea Francis when all I need to keep me smiling is to go out and look at my faithful "Little Lagonda"?

I really must be mad!  

 

Bj

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 12, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[oldcar]

Looking at my fur hat you have to remember here in Australia our seasons are the opposite to those in the northern hemisphere. July is "mid-winter" while December-January is summer. We are lucky that we can still find days to do our motoring with the hood(top) carefully stowed away. We can go from one year to the next without ever putting the hood up. You just dress to suit the  season!

If you go fast enough the rain goes over your head, so you may never get wet.

 

Bj.

[Digger914]

Hey Bernie,

 

Everything I know about Koalas is second hand  and the last word I had on Koalas in Victoria, was that when the road near my aunts old home got widened and paved there must have been 50 cars a day going by, so many Koalas were getting killed crossing the road they made their own Koala crossing signs. I had a couple of great aunts from down under, my Kiwi Aunt passed away when I was little and I don't remember her, but her son lived in town until his father died. I was in my late 40's when my Aussie aunt passed, she was actually Tasmanian but moved to Victoria when she was little. It was always an event when one of her siblings passed through town on their way to or from Europe and there were always pictures from back home and travel, most of them were black and white. The pictures of so many different things were always interesting, but it was a bit disappointing to learn that the Tasmanian Devil didn't look anything like it did in the cartoons.

 

If you're mad then I'm mad too. The LeaF would be a nothing car, but the thought of putting it back together appeals to me because it looks so much like the old thing behind the barn that grandpa let my brother and I play in until it got hauled away with the old silo. The Rapier is a classic and classy roadster, seeing pictures of it out on the road always puts a smile on my face and I'm not the one behind the wheel. I love the pictures of it running through the countryside and color adds to the experience. Never really gave any thought as to how green Australia and New Zealand could be. 

[oldcar]

Hello Digger

Last Sunday was an ideal day for the Rapier, good roads with almost no traffic, good company at lunch in an older style "Country Pub". I am sure that you would enjoy it. I find it hard to believe but It appears (to me) as though you do not even drive them to your "Shows". It is a very long time since I even owned a trailer. I do still have a towing "Hitch" on the rear of the Peugeot but I cannot remember when I last used it.

Bernie j.

 

 It seems (to me) that most people in USA just don't drive their "old" cars. I must admit we have only visited a very limited amount of your country so I could be wrong.  I doubt that we will ever visit again. All our over seas visits these days seem to be restricted to the UK and Europe and even then I imagine that our next visit will be our last. I hate saying that because it sounds so negative and defeatist.

 

Bernie j.

Edited July 12, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[oldcar]

Now a week later with the Lagonda safely tucked up in its garage, work is commencing again on the Lea Francis.

The more I look the more I have become convinced that the saloon body will have to go, it is simply falling apart. 

This will now mean a slight change in my plans, the body will have to go. The chassis will then need 12 inches cut from the middle to shorten it to the factory "sports two seater" length and a complete new body built.

Not at all what I had in mind when I first bought the car. It is not a problem, it is something I have a lifelong experience in doing. It will just take a little more effort and time.

 

Bernie j.

Edited July 18, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[oldcar]

While almost 20 years older this Austin 10/Six has had it's chassis "pruned" by a similar amount to bring it to "Two seater" length. Just how the LeaF finishes remains to be seen. With its 17 inch steel disc wheels the Leaf will require some slightly different treatment, just how different remains to be seen.  Perhaps the Jaguar special is nearer time wise.

See also below.

 

Edited July 18, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[oldcar]

No doubt there are some people who are wondering about the sanity of an 85 year oldd man even thinking about starting another project of this magnitude.   My reply is that, this is how I got to be 85 years old, Without my involvement with Vintage and Post Vintage cars I could well have been dead 20 years ago.

I will let you know if I need a "push start" for my wheel chair!

Normally I just push it down a hill and run along-side so I can jump in once it starts.

Bj.

Edited July 18, 2021 by oldcar (see edit history)

[OldCarFan]

No question about your sanity. These project keep you thinking and moving. 
Though the LeaF is smaller, perhaps this Bentley special will give an idea of how it could look with the steel wheels. I am looking forward to your progress reports.

http://www.collectorcarads.com/Bentley-Mark-VI/40819