What to look for if buying a 1912 Buick Model 29

[26-25Buick]

Disclaimer: This vehicle is not mine and the intent here is not to run this car in to the ground but rather learn the pitfalls of the early Buicks

 

Now I've always dreamed of owning a brass Buick and there has been a 1912 Buick Model 29 for sale on eBay (http://m.ebay.com/itm/1912-Buick-Other-Model-29-/222548480376) for awhile so I thought it might make an interesting topic to comment on to get people's thoughts on why it hasn't sold. If you could ignore the price because it's only worth what someone will pay based on what they know and see, but are there some obvious flaws to watch out for with this model that this one may or may not exhibit?

 

I'll start it off with what I know and what I think I can see. First up it's being sold as a non-runner because it hasn't been started for a number of years, so you are unlikely to get an opportunity to see or hear it running as it will require a full service. That clearly would affect what people are willing to pay for it.

Looking at the rockers on 1 & 3 exhaust & 2 inlet they are not sitting on the push rod straight and in one of the photos #3 exhaust push rod doesn't look straight. Does this suggest that you could have stuck valves and was that a common problem?

The other thing which strikes me is the gaps in the spokes at wheel hubs which suggests they might be very dry and one appears to be sporting a crack in either the spoke or the paint work? Is that also a weakest with the early Buicks?

 

I'm sure there is other things to the more trained eye amongst you

 

[Larry Schramm]

Not possible to ignore the price. 

 

Items change hands when the price becomes what a willing seller will sell to a willing buyer. That is defined "value" of the item and what it is worth.

 

Everything must be considered in the selling price and some items may give indicators of other issues of the car.  Like I did not see the top rests on the rear posts for the top to set on when retracted.  That can lead to other questions.

 

Most of us in the brass/ nickel era will tell you that it appears to be fairly rich for the year and model of car.   Rarity does not equate to a big value.

 

Just IMHO.
 

Edited June 17, 2017 by Larry Schramm (see edit history)

[trimacar]

Agree, price is why it hasn't sold.  That's silly money for that car in that condition, a price in the 20's would be more appropriate.  For money being asked you can buy a very nice, higher horsepower, brass car.

[ROD W]

This 1913 roadster was on the market for $25,000.  Not totally original,  but ?   These models 28 and 29 were for sale not all that long back,  can,t remember the exact price,  but well below the asking price of the car presently listed.  There may be somebody out there who says,  " I just have to have that car "  and has just won the lottery.  It looks like a well maintained older restoration.

Edited June 18, 2017 by ROD W (see edit history)

[26-25Buick]

It is certainly difficult to overlook the price when you have a Buick at Cadillac money especially when this one is listed https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/142412808104 also but at quite a bit less. I thought it was expensive too, but at least it is running.

 

The non-runner part here is certainly a red flag especially given the Model 29 is also with a dealer and you would think he would do just about anything to show a working car. With really no idea what condition the running gear is in, in my opinion reduces it to the value of the body only, or would you take a gamble if the price was right? Would an order of magnitude lower in price start to interest you?

 

So do we think the Model 29 is mutton dressed up as lamb or just poor knowledge of the brass era Buicks?

[dibarlaw]

26-25

As someone who has chased some of these cars (and not caught any) I understand your concerns. The 1912-35 in the ebay ad looks to be head and shoulders above in condition the model 29. At least it seems that the goal was correct originality of restoration. The several Brass era Buicks I went after were all older to very older restorations being offered in the $20 to 30 thousands range. (2) 1913-model 31s and a 1910 model 10 runabout. The one model 31 I offered $15K. It was not running, cracked peeling paint etc. The person it sold to for around $20K put more money into it to make it a tour car and then lost the transmission the first day out on that tour. (the original seller told me that 2nd gear was a bit touchy.) I saw it for sale at fall Hershey for $28,000. I believe it went to England.

The other model 31 I believe still has not sold since they were trying for around $32,000. In need of a top, not running, with much jury rigging on engine and electrical. The vinyl walnut contact paper on the dash made it look nice.  

The model 10 was 1 1/2 hours away in Virginia and looked very nice. The owner wanted to start at $20,000 and "dicker" up? But, it had not been run in over 5 years at the time and the more I shared information about it the more it appeared to be a compilation of parts.

 

Notice the incorrect front axle and 1911-12 radiator shell. Also incorrect spark and throttle quadrant on steering column.

 My last contact with the son of the former owner (as he has since passed) was last April 2016. He is concerned that some one will "hot Rod" it! 

 

[cxgvd]

The model 29 was built by Buick with a different model numbers for three years and is likely one of the best touring cars you could choose.  Engineering by Walter Marr is sound, ride is comfortable and it looks good too.  That car on ebay sound have a brass radiator, not painted and should sport a Schebler carb.  My wife and I are driving our 1913 Model 31 on the AACA Vintage tour in July and have recently driven round Lake Erie, 700 miles.  That 4X4 engine is in a good car.  Best of luck, Gary

 

PS; the second car ( Blue one) is smaller and less powerful

Edited June 18, 2017 by cxgvd
add a ps (see edit history)

[carbking]

In the for what its worth category, my records indicate Buick used a Marvel type S-H carb on the model 29 in the 1912 model year, and switched to a Schebler model L for 1913.

 

Jon.