Help ID 20's roadster

[Guest prewar40]

This roadster does not have the original drive train. It's a Duesenberg under the hood, but who made the body? The 2 door deck lid was introduced with the 1926 Gardner which also had the same cowl vent. However the windshield does not match Gardner - so what is it?

Does anyone know who else made a two door deck lid?

Thanks

I've attached 5 pictures of the mystery car and 1 picture of a 1926 Gardner.

Edited December 4, 2010 by prewar40 (see edit history)

[keiser31]

Body looks to me to be a 1928 Chrysler Model '72' Sport roadster or 1928 Chrysler Imperial '80' roadster. I am pretty certain they both had the double door rumble seat lid. The windshield mounting will tell the story.

[Guest prewar40]

I'm sure you're right.

I did confirm that the 72 did have both the vent and the double door

deck lid. So everything matches.

Thanks

[alsancle]

What does Randy think it is? He's driving :-).

[keiser31]

The radiator looks like it may be from a 1929 Graham...

[keiser31]

Looks like it has 1931 Chrysler headlamps...

[keiser31]

Looks like it has a 1929 Lincoln bumper on the front (and maybe '29 Lincoln rear fenders?).

[keiser31]

When do we get to see the engine and dashboard??

[stexch]

If it is a Chrysler dash, hold a flashlight at an angle to the Chrysler emblem that is front and center on the dash. the serial number is vertical in the middle of the emblem. It should be 2 letters, three numbers, and a letter. If you can post that number, it can be decoded to a model.

[Guest Silverghost]

Guys:

There is a thread running over at the ACD (Auburn Cord Duesenberg ) Club Forum about this mystery car pictured above~~~~.

"Model A Duesenberg Special"~

This thread was posted on the ACD forum Sun at 8:30 AM~

Check it out~

I have several posts there myself as I am a ACD forum member there also.

From what I gather this car which has a Duesenberg model "A" engine. It's big unusual radiator sports a Duesenberg 8 logo badge. The mystery car was found parked just next to the now famous model "X" Duesenberg discovered , and bought by Jay Leno some years back in that small old Caif. house's garage near Jay's Tonight Show TV studio.

Jay's now very famous model "X" garage find story was all over cable TV & in automotive blogs, mags and in the "Barn Find" book some years back~

As we watched on TV ,and all saw Jay & noted Duesenberg Restorer/ Historian/Expert~~~ Randy Ema open that small garage after 50+ years to remove the long sleeping model "X" Duesenberg~~~ We all also saw another car parked next to it with stuff piled all around and on it.

There has been much speculation about this second mystery car, now posted here above, for many years since Jay found and finally bought the now famous and very rare model "X"

Only 4 Model "X" Dueseys are still known to exist today out of less than 100 once built ~

.

It is indeed Randy Ema Jay's longtime Duesenberg friend, shown in the above photos.

I am sure that there will be much more of this mystery "Duesenberg Model "A" Special" car's story comming out very soon !

Was it an early hotrod project ?

Who actually built it ?

What is this roadster's body ?

What about the chassis itself ?

Where did that big strange radiator with the Duesenberg 8 logo come from ?

What was this car's past history?

Was it ever raced or used as a hill-climb car ?

I, along with others who also post on the AACA forum here and the ACD forum, have asked many more questions about this garage car find.~~~ To this very hour these questions remain as yet unaswered ~~~

Did Jay, or Randy, also buy this garage find along with the famous Model "X" ???

We will all "Stay Tuned" for more up-dates ~~~

Edited December 9, 2010 by Silverghost (see edit history)

[Guest Silverghost]

On the ACD Club forum Randy Ema just posted that HE in fact just bought this Duesey out of that same garage that Jay's Model "X" came from . He stated the project is for himself ~

Check-It-Out at ACD Club's forum website !

[keiser31]

I think I have identified the radiator and the body already. Here's another similar Chrysler body photo.

Edited December 7, 2010 by keiser31 (see edit history)

[keiser31]

Looks to me like the car in question has altered 1929 Lincoln front fenders. Does ANYONE agree with me on any of my theories/i.d.s?

[West Peterson]

I think you've nailed it. Not sure about the fenders. They could be from the Duesenberg chassis.

[HotRodTom]

You know when I watched that show about the "barn find" model X, I saw this car in the background, but couldnt identify it. I figured that if it wasnt a Duesenberg, then Jay or Randy must not care about it. I guess then didnt want to detact from the mystery of the model X.

boy, I sure did think it was a '26 Gardner with some horrible fenders, but after seeing that Chrysler, thats definitely it. The rearend is shaped slightly different than my Gardner too.. And of course the windshield is different.

Pretty neat though. I need to find one of these magic garages..

[Grandpa]

All,

I would like to offer a correction to the post by "Silverghost" (above). Duesenberg made a total of 12 or 13 Model Xs (not 100). This conclusion is based on a review of original factory records. It appears that Duesenberg had enough parts to assemble 13 chassis, but likely made only 12 cars.

The car shown in this post is assembled on a Model A Duesenberg chassis. The re-body of the Model A chassis was likely done in Chicago by the Madis Auto Construction Co. on the north side of the city. In 1930, the Madis address was 5541 N. Clark St. Post 1930, the address was 5210 N. Broadway. The Clark St. address still has the original buiding (the Capital Garage) - Pictured. The two locations are less than one mile apart. Any information on Madis would be greatly appreciated.

Grandpa

[alsancle]

You know when I watched that show about the "barn find" model X, I saw this car in the background, but couldnt identify it. I figured that if it wasnt a Duesenberg, then Jay or Randy must not care about it. I guess then didnt want to detact from the mystery of the model X.

boy, I sure did think it was a '26 Gardner with some horrible fenders, but after seeing that Chrysler, thats definitely it. The rearend is shaped slightly different than my Gardner too.. And of course the windshield is different.

Pretty neat though. I need to find one of these magic garages..

The amount of cool stuff that was in that garage is unbelievable. All of it was purchased in Chicago prior to WWII and moved to Southern California around 1950. My Stutz blower came out of that garage and I believe was also purchased from Madis as was the Model A.

[keiser31]

So....do you folks think that this is a Duesenberg that was maybe stripped of the body during the war for the scrap drive and "added onto" or rebodied later? Is that a 1945 or 1949 California license plate on there?

Edited December 8, 2010 by keiser31 (see edit history)

[Guest Silverghost]

I stand corrected on the number of the very rare Model X Duesenbergs built ! Believe me these guys above should know !

They are far rarer than I thought ...

In fact I have never seen one in 55 years close-up in person ! Only published pictures & videos of Jay's super garage find "X" !

Many surviving Duesenberg Model "A" s have fairly plain Jane closed body coachwork typical of many autos in their time period.

BUT~~~Their mechanical engineering was way ahead of the typical car of that period...

Their engines were fantastic.

Some coachwork was downright ugly !

Perhapps this mystery car's owner just wanted a more sporty roadster style body put on his older Sedan or Coupe' Model "A" Duesey ?

Using an existing car body would have been far cheaper than having a custom coachbuilt body made from scratch ! ?

Used car dealers in the period would also swap out Sedan, Coupe', and more formal old car bodywork for the more sporty and more easily sold roadster styles.

Body swaps were very common in this era.

Some cars had a Summer open touring or roadster body along with a closed Winter body that would be swapped at the change of each season.

Just several possible body swap ideas ! ?

Randy if you in fact do read this~ What a great unusual find you have there !

I would get it mechanically sorted-out, painted, and possibly re-cover the seats and drive it !

It might be fun for you to show it as an as found garage find for a bit first before doing any rstoration work ! I, for one, like driver/survivor cars~~~

I am looking for a model "A" Duesenberg to add to our growing collections...

Possibly an older restored car or original survivor. Open drop-top preferred .

Edited December 9, 2010 by Silverghost (see edit history)

[Grandpa]

Hi Stexch,

In your post (above) you asked about the dashboard in the roadster - -

Grandpa

[keiser31]

I was wondering what the bar was across the rear of the car in question...now I know. Here is another similar Deusenberg chassis

[Guest Silverghost]

I just spotted a period photo of a similar design Duesenberg Model "A" Victoria/Opera Coupe'

This Coupe' has front & rear fenders exactly like this roadster garage find project.

It also has the short step-style aluminum running boards.

The rear spare tire carrier, with bar underneath is also of a similar design.

I suspect that this Duesenberg Model "A" roadster once storted out in it's early life as a similar Victoria/Opera Coupe' before the roadster body change at a later time.

Check-it-Out at the new website below~

www.duesey186.com

Click-on gallery at left~~Then Model A for photos of Duesenberg Model "A"

# A 1000-0602

This is a great NEW Duesenberg website owned by~~~ Jack Curtright owner of Duesenberg J-186

[alsancle]

So....do you folks think that this is a Duesenberg that was maybe stripped of the body during the war for the scrap drive and "added onto" or rebodied later? Is that a 1945 or 1949 California license plate on there?

When the car was purchased in the 1930s but W. Johnson it had the current body on it. I believe Randy has paperwork to prove that.

[keiser31]

I just spotted a period photo of a similar design Duesenberg Model "A" Victoria/Opera Coupe'

This Coupe' has front & rear fenders exactly like this roadster garage find project.

It also has the short step-style aluminum running boards.

The rear spare tire carrier, with bar underneath is also of a similar design.

I suspect that this Duesenberg Model "A" roadster once storted out in it's early life as a similar Victoria/Opera Coupe' before the roadster body change at a later time.

Check-it-Out at the new website below~

www.duesey186.com

Click-on gallery at left~~Then Model A for photos of Duesenberg Model "A"

# A 1000-0602

This is a great NEW Duesenberg website owned by~~~ Jack Curtright owner of Duesenberg J-186

I don't think it is that similar.