Reatta Prototypes

[ALF1]

Robert, Ed, Nic, Gregg, Jim, Mike, Howard, Jim, et.al.:

Shall we return to a revered automobile when the rice-pipers have moved on to the latest four-wheeled version of Britney Spears...?

<span style="font-weight: bold">-- ALF</span>

[Guest F14CRAZY]

Then again, my mom's more or less German engineered Dodge blew out a Pontiac with about the same motor as your Regal. And it wasn't like he wasn't trying. He peeled too. But my AWD delivered the thrust to the ground.

Well, at least we can still pretend that Dodge/Chrysler is still American

[Jibby]

Yeah, pretend... bwa ha ha ha ha!

Well, the Crossfire, is basically a Benz, with the Chrysler badge on it.

The Durango, has a nasty engine in it, that I wouldn't (bleep) with, even in the Police Interceptor Crown Victoria.

I've already seen what it can do to an Import vehicle, on numerous occasions. And it's an SUV, too!

If I was to go Chrysler, the only vehicles that I would think about, are the 300M and the Wrangler. That's it... because Chrysler sucks (bleep) in my not-so-humble <span style="font-style: italic">opinion</span>, and those are the only two vehicles that they've made in the last few years that are worth my praise. Excepting maybe the last generation Grand Cherokee, in which case, I might make one more exception.

Now if they made a real Power Wagon, not a Ram, with the Power Wagon name pasted on it's rear end, I might reconsider Dodge. Of course, that would involve, an inline 6-cylinder engine, not a "Hemi" V8.

Remember, 300M, not 300C. The 300C is a gansta-mobile, and I think it's ugly, personally. Now if Dodge had stayed with their 2000 Concept Charger, then I might consider that, but the new one, is uglier than the 300C. Who's making decisions over at Daimler-Chrysler? An idiot? Oh, I thought so...

In 2006, Chrysler will be making the powertrain warranty, non-standard... as in, you'll have to buy it extra... most likely because of all of the fixes and recalls on the Dodge Ram... and the lawsuits to get them to do the fixes, that they refuse to do, under the contract that <span style="font-style: italic">they</span> signed with the owner.

Now, tell Buick to make a new Northstar V8 coupe, with AWD. Also, tell them to make sure that Cadillac doesn't tune it "specially for Buick", and make you lose 25 horsepower. What a rip... I guess people will be buying chips for the Lucerne... to put it back to spec.

Once again, these are my <span style="font-style: italic">opinions</span>, not the facts, so please no retaliation, for my <span style="font-style: italic">thoughts</span> on the matter. If you choose to agree, great... if not, I don't need an all-out assault on my intelligence, because whomever, is so much more intelligent, than I.

It's sad, that I have to add that, to this post...

[Jibby]

I'm glad that some of these honeys, are still alive. GM likes to trash old concepts, for some reason.

When we get this thing sold to someone, we'll need pictures, and a lecture on the car.

[scourge]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[edited]

Hey, if the RWD project comes through, I was wondering what engine would be used? Probably a GNX or some other turbo 231?

How about a Buick 215 V8 aluminum -- stroked out? (although, if it's to be streetable, I suppose the motor might need to be FI -- for emissions sake)

Or a Buick 300 or 330 V8? Could add a TBI to it I suppose...

K </div></div>

Please pardon my Buick ignorance, but why not just use the 3800 SeriesI engine that came with the car and maybe turbocharge it. There are shops online that do just this for the SeriesII. More knowledgeable people will correct me if I am wrong, but I am fairly certain that the SeriesI/SeriesII engines are fairly the same block so the F-Body transmissions should bolt up easily. You will need to fab a crossmember and most likely cut out some of the floorpan, but I already figured this anyway.

If you stick with the SeriesI, then no rewiring. Unless you get all crazy with boost, the engine should be able to withstand at least 7lbs and the front of the car already has a sweet spot for an intercooler.

Maybe more experienced mechanics can swap/rewire many engine choices, but I am just thinking sticking with the seriesI is not a bad choice for a daily driver.

[Jibby]

I agree.

[Guest Reatta1]

Here is what I'd like to see Buick build, with a 502 V8. I'd hock the wife and kids to buy it.

[manikmekanik]

Beautiful, but it looks like a car which deserves a TURBINE powerplant, too unique and aero for a standard engine.

[scourge]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Beautiful, but it looks like a car which deserves a TURBINE powerplant, too unique and aero for a standard engine. </div></div>

We all know about the GN turbo engine and the SeriesII SC engine that can be swapped to turbo, but what about a SeriesI engine? I have looked for websites that deal with making performance parts but all I have ever found are sites dedicated to the GN engine and SeriesII.

Now, I am not a mechanic so I simply don't know compatability. I keep reading about rewiring engine swaps are hard/impossible due to the Reatta's touch screen. I dunno. Maybe there is some way to turbo a SeriesI SC engine (which I would think would be better than starting with a NA SeriesI engine) and get the electronics still to work. I know that on Japanese cars, it's a simple thing to turbo cars without doing anything to the stock ECU. Aftermarket ECUs take care of performance while the stock ECU runs the car's other functions. I'd like to see what GM did with the electronics and the GN engine. I wonder of anything worked.

Again, I am not a mechanic so I cannot say authoritatively. I would be game for a SC SeriesI engine with a turbo instead of the SC in a RWD Reatta. I so hope this is something that is not a dream and is doable. After all GM did it and one need only see what GM did and copy that. No need for the thousands of hours of R&D and thousands of $$$$$ that would make such a project impossible for a middle calss person.

[Guest F14CRAZY]

I think he meant a gas turbine engine, like airplanes, some Chrysler prototypes back in the day, and some Union Pacific locomotives

[2seater]

You can turbocharge almost anything, mine has been for a few years (23k miles). Knock control is an issue, and I am gradually getting a handle on that. Greg Ross with his S/C application faces the same. Everything still works as original. IMHO the stock engine (maybe better pistons), will safely produce 350+ hp although the transaxle would probably blow up. A rwd conversion would take care of that.

[Guest F14CRAZY]

Does the (W body?) manual tranny that Greg has take the extra power better than the stock auto? I've always figured that sticks can take more than autos

[Jibby]

I'm going to take a large turbine engine, and build a Reatta body around the exterior of the turbine. It'll look weird, but I won't have a problem beating anybody, on the road. If I add retractable wings, I might even be able to catch some air. In fact, if I add a Gatling gun, I might even get a Military contract!

[Machiner 55]

You'll probably want to do something like this.........

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/aviation/1559477.html

[Guest F14CRAZY]

Reattas have about the right aerodynamics. Would retract headlights and antenna first

[Jibby]

Yeah, but I wouldn't put the Iron Cross, on it, nor would it look like the Baron's plane.

[2seater]

No expert on manual vs automatics. I do believe Greg's can likely handle more input than the stock auto. transaxle. An automatic can be built to be plenty stout and the torque converter will add to the torque output also. Since we are on this subject of rwd anyway, the GN guys run auto's almost exlusively, even the really fast ones. From what I have seen, they have experimented with stick transmissions and almost always wound up going slower. It's hard to beat a well built auto for shift speed and lots of grunt for launch. At the upper end of the hp. scale the sticks are probably all that will live. I have seen autos rated for 1500 hp or so but not really more than that.

[Jibby]

I like GN, and T-Types. They're sick cars, and they'll defeat almost any stock eight, with some help from some aftermarket parts.

Even stock, they're a real (bleep), to launch past. In fact, the dude that I saw at Batavia, had a nice T-Type, and I was drooling over the GN in the parking lot.

The T-Type guy, told me that his friend has a 9 second GN or T-Type. I can't remember which one. But in any event, he deserves a free, "You've just been SPANKED... by a Buick!", bumpersticker.

[manikmekanik]

Yes, F14, I did intend to suggest a gas turbine powerplant, but for the car pictured, not a Reatta. The car dipicted has a look harkening to jets, or rockets. Problem with them is all the cars with plastic bumpers and grilles-they'd melt! That's why I cunningly suggested the car LOOKS like it should house a TURBINE.

Scourge, Take a look at how much nice Reattae are going for, Few in the "middle class" can afford the car, let alone a turbo or S/C engine. Unless they've re-financed the house, or drawn from 401k accounts, or won the lottery.

Yes, RWD for Reatta IS a dream at this point, without any GM data or photos.

I don't know about you, but I don't have a "George Barris" or "Rat Fink" budget available for such an undertaking.

Maybe we should apply to guest on a "Monster Garage" show to build one. Better yet, the show where two teams build cars, then drag race to win both. Except the race should be on an F-1 track, 5 laps each. One team builds a turbo Reatta, the other a supercharged one. The time limit may not allow for the RWD swap, so a mini-series would be in order.

If we act now, we may even get it done before we hear anything about the proto in AL.!!

[Guest F14CRAZY]

I wouldn't use a mint condition Reatta for a swap like this. Would be a waste of a decent car, and pointless since you're rebuilding the entire drivetrain.

As long as its not rusty and has a half decent body/interior you could find a $1000 Reatta and be fine. Even better with a blown motor or tranny

[Jibby]

Manik,

I just did it...

Monster Garage Forums, including the suggestion sub-forum...

We shall see, what transpires...

[scourge]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wouldn't use a mint condition Reatta for a swap like this. Would be a waste of a decent car, and pointless since you're rebuilding the entire drivetrain.

As long as its not rusty and has a half decent body/interior you could find a $1000 Reatta and be fine. Even better with a blown motor or tranny </div></div>

Exactly. If you can do some of the work yourself and source quality parts from a salvage yard (you'll need to know what you're looking for or else they can wind up costing more than stock after you have them refurbished), and you have the GM plan to copy exactly, then this project is easily doable for under $10k. If you cannot do anything and just take it to a shop, well then, it could cost up to $50k most likely.

[manikmekanik]

I have 4 Reattae available for a project of this nature, so we have a few for "trial & error" , donor parts, reference, or just more RWD's

[scourge]

Despite the insanely high gas prices, I thought that I'd bump this to keep it on the front page. I think we're down to one more week before anything new develops.

[Guest F14CRAZY]

Reattas don't have that bad o' milage. On a 180 mile trip over the weekend, the ECC was reportingaround 27.5 mpg, and I could get 28 for short periods. While driving about 77 with the air con on and headlights retracted

[scourge]

Drove a 2006 Chrysler Sebring sedan to Charlotte, NC and back over the weekend and spent $104 on gas. This was less than a 900mile trip and this is the worst gas mileage from a 4cyl I've ever seen in my life! My truck gets better than that & it's a TRUCK!

[Guest F14CRAZY]

Who buys those Sebring 4 doors? Chrysler should stop wasting money on them

Shoulda whipped a 300C Hemi. Prolly the same gas milage, unless you keep it to the floor

[Jibby]

There are many factors, which could have caused the horrible gas mileage... but one comes to mind... Chrysler...

[Guest F14CRAZY]

Reminds me: my mom bought new a '98 Durango with the old 5.2L/318. Earlier this year we bought the new '05 Hemi Durango and sold the old one. The Hemi gets A LOT better gas milage than the 318 ever did. Not like we didn't do tune ups etc either.

[padgett]

$104 @ $3/gal = 34.7 gallons for 900 miles is almost 26 mpg. Mouse motors working hard (especially if into the PE range a lot) will use more gas than a larger but lazy engine. What kind of revs at 70 ?

[scourge]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">$104 @ $3/gal = 34.7 gallons for 900 miles is almost 26 mpg. Mouse motors working hard (especially if into the PE range a lot) will use more gas than a larger but lazy engine. What kind of revs at 70 ? </div></div>

2000-2500RPM until the cruise control would jack up to over 4000RPM going down a slope to maintain 70MPH. Never had a car do like that before. My 2.5l 4cyl truck still gets better than that.

[manikmekanik]

I recently spoke with a new Reatta owner, who bought it from his aunt in florida. A maui blue/blue 90 coupe w/79k miles. He and his wife had only driven it back a week earlier, and said he got 33 MPG on his trip home to Racine, WI.

I told him of this forum, and to come here for info/help. Once I realized he would'nt sell us his car. Panikmekanik loved the maui blue color.

[manikmekanik]

If they'll go for it, let's suggest they take it on the road!

I have a well-stocked shop and all the Reattae needed for the transformation(s) here in "CHEEZELAND". Do you think they've ever experienced SNOW?

Of course, when it's all over, the cool new tools stay here!!!

[scourge]

Just thought that I would bump this. I am very serious about learning more. I know a lot of people <span style="font-weight: bold">talk</span> online, and this is why I admit that I'm not going to start any such project for a few more months, but I would like to get as much information as I can.

[Guest F14CRAZY]

On a trip with about 150 miles worth of 70 mph freeway travel, I've reset the ECC to toss out the old mpg numbers and get new ones. Driving like it was controlled by cruise control, I've got 27s, and 28 mph for short periods. Air con running and doing 75-78 mph. Haven't checked it with math though since the ECC gets a theoretical mpg count according to the voltage being sent to the injectors

[padgett]

"said he got 33 MPG on his trip home to Racine, WI" - possible, is about what my instantaneous reads at 55-60 mph and I know that is about 10% low. (actual fillups vs readings & tire error).

As speed goes up, mpg goes down so on the Interstate I usually average out to about 26.5.

Never had it over about 80 miles from home so never a full tank through at speed. Just putzing around with 5 mile stop and go & 45 mph or less is more like 18-19.

[Guest Greg Ross]

This is a memory challenge but as I recall, on my first trip to Louisiana some years ago. That's Pre-Getrag, Pre-S/C, Pre-3800 Series I rebuilt;

So good old stock 3.8L/ Auto with around 200K on the clock I pushed fairly hard for all those miles. Without Padgetts' 10% variance on the On-board Fuel Calculator;

Accumulated average speed (including fuel, food, pit stops and sleep stops) time travelled vs avg speed of about 68 mph for the whole run, 32 hours and displayed fuel mileage was just under 29 mpg. I wonder if they recalibrated the Canadian delivered Reattas for the Imperial Gallon?

Less 10% is 26 mpg and I was generally exceeding 80 mph constant.

[Guest tomt]

This post is getting a little long to follow, so if I'm repeating someone, I'm sorry.

I have a regular trip that I check mileage on, from DeKalb IL to Naperville essentially. As good as the wind coefficient is supposed to be on Reattae, I will do 30-33 going in, and 26-27 coming back. Wires and plugs are new so that helps on the up side. I never saw 33 with old plugs and wires, but now I do. Just never realized how much of an effect wind is. I reset at either end of the trip.

[Jibby]

Possibly, but they've shown no interest as of yet, and probably won't... because it's not a Muscle Car, or some sort of strange contraption.

We'll see, though... it may pan out.

[scourge]

No new info? It's been three weeks & I know people have lives, but I just wnated to bump this thread.