1990 Coupe w/149K dies....

[ptt]

I first had a problem starting the Coupe a couple weeks ago.  I do get the fuel pump buzz and stopping.  It finally started.  Now it will intermittantly start and idle fine for a minute or two and just die as if I turned the key off.  Now it will only turn over and catch then idle a few seconds and die .  I noticed the coil packs were leaking so I replaced with a new one.  Still starting then stalling out.  Thoughts appreciated.

[Barney Eaton]

Check the fuel pressure,

Turn on the key but don't start for 15 seconds......does it run any longer?

Could be bad pump or bad pressure regulator if the fuel pressure is low.

[89RedDarkGrey]

Install a fuel pressure gauge on the fuel rail Schrader valve. Key on, not start- should read 38-40psi. Key off. Watch for leak down, should hold pressure at least 15 minutes. How old is the Crankshaft Position sensor? Spray an inverted can of PC duster on the sensor- that will immediately freeze it. Start engine. If it runs longer than it has been- there's the culprit. A new CPS gets warm when in use- over time, it gets weaker, builds resistance, and gets hotter till burn out.

[89RedDarkGrey]

If you don't have one- buy one, use it, bring it back if you don't want it

 

To clear up any confusion of my above statement:

 

Many FLAPS have a "Loan-a-tool" program for "uncommon" tools and "1-use" tools. Simply pay the regular purchase price (as a deposit) then when finished using it- bring it back, and you are refunded your deposit.

 

Edited May 30, 2017 by 89RedDarkGrey
loaner tool explination (see edit history)

[smithbrother]

I'm confused, are you saying "USE IT, THEN IF YOU DON'T WANT IT, TAKE IT BACK"?

 

Hoping that's not what you are suggesting.  If that's what you are suggesting I offer this.  

 

As a forty year former hardware/tool store owner, I can assure you stores aren't in the tool loaning business. 

 

Dale in Indy

 

 

 

[Ronnie]

10 minutes ago, smithbrother said:

I'm confused, are you saying "USE IT, THEN IF YOU DON'T WANT IT, TAKE IT BACK"?

 

Hoping that's not what you are suggesting.  If that's what you are suggesting I offer this.  

 

As a forty year former hardware/tool store owner, I can assure you stores aren't in the tool loaning business. 

 

Dale in Indy

 

I'm afraid you are a little behind the times. Many auto parts store chains do loan tools. Here is an example.  Here is another example.

 

 

 

Edited May 29, 2017 by Ronnie (see edit history)

[smithbrother]

Well, if that's what they offer, I have no issue with such.  

 

Thanks for the info. 

 

Dale in Indy

[89RedDarkGrey]

Thanks for the apology for your attempted defamation of my character.

 

Thank you, Ronnie- for pointing out that most car parts stores have "loan-a-tool" or tool rental programs now days.

 

I would never tell someone here to use a product and simply bring it back unscrupulously- just to get a refund.

[smithbrother]

Well, I'm a artist, was unaware of a LOAN TOOL POLICY.  That's good for the hobby, and do-it-yourself folks.

 

I feel bad/sorry you feel I was attacking your character, never was my intent,  

 

Dale in Indy 

'

 

Edited May 30, 2017 by smithbrother (see edit history)

[89RedDarkGrey]

Apology accepted.

 

[ptt]

Could an undercharged/weak battery cause the same symptoms?  Ive got a fuel pressure tester ordered.

Edited June 6, 2017 by ptt (see edit history)

[89RedDarkGrey]

40 minutes ago, ptt said:

Could an undercharged/weak battery cause the same symptoms?

 

Opening a door (or using RKE) causes 7 incandescent light bulbs to illuminate and odometer to display

Closing Drivers door causes Light Show and CRT "Reatta" display ('88-'89)

 

Think about what the battery powers upon startup: (key on engine cranking)

 

Fuel pump

ECM

Injectors

Starter

Energize alternator

BCM

C3I (ignition)

ICM

 

After charging or installing a new battery, and checking fuel pressure- I'd seriously consider a new CPS (Crankshaft Position Sensor) or test what you have.

 

MAKE TOOL- http://reattaowner.com/roj/component/content/article/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&catid=96:ignition-system&id=203:how-to-make-a-cps-tester

USE TOOL- http://reattaowner.com/roj/component/content/article/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&catid=96:ignition-system&id=202:icm-crank-position-sensor-troubleshooting

 

A spark tester is a must have tool- http://thereattastore.com/kd-tools-2756-ignition-tester-calibrated-for-hei-ignitions/  (or something similar sold at your FLAPS.)

[ptt]

Took delivery of new fuel pressure tester and hooked it up.  It read 40psi and 15min later it was at 36psi.  It started right up with previously charged battery.  Once the engine had warmed up to 4th bar on temp gauge it died. 

[KDirk]

Have you ruled out the ignition control module? Suddenly dying at hot engine temp is a classic failure symptom of the Magnavox ICM used on the 88-90 models, less frequently seen on the Delco setup used in 1991. Sounds like a thermal problem certainly (induced by heat of engine at full operating temp). The ICM and crankshaft position sensor are the two likely suspects where a sudden hot shutdown is in play.

 

The ICM frequently exhibits the leakage of a light green sticky slime - apparently the heat dissapation compound placed inside the module at manufacture - when it starts failing in this manner.

[ptt]

ICM is only two weeks old.  When this problem first started I automatically checked to see if the ICM was spewing green slime.  There was green goop on the coolant hose below it so I swappd on my spare I keep for such a situation.  Its starting to look like the CPS may be the culprit.

[Ronnie]

2 hours ago, ptt said:

Once the engine had warmed up to 4th bar on temp gauge it died.

 

When the engine warms up one thing that effects engine operation is the ECM goes into closed loop operation.

 

Try this.... Unplug the O2 sensor and drive it until is gets hot and see if it still dies. Unplugging the O2 sensor will keep the ECM from going into closed loop operation. That will probably set a code but it will tell you if going into closed loop is causing the engine to die.