Ladytrae Posted January 22, 2007 Share Posted January 22, 2007 New post for a new problem. I started out changing the crankshaft position sensor on my 3800 1989 Buick. I replaced the oil pan gasket, timing chain gasket and oil filter housing gasket. After getting everything back together and starting it up Im getting my oil light on. I am wondering if the problem could be 1. The oil pan was off for two days. Could oil have drained from the pump? Has it lost its prime? or 2. Something in the oil filter housing like the pressure regulator valve and spring located in the timing chain cover. Thanks again for the help. -Ladytrae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 It lost prime...Does the 89 still have a distributor? If so, then you need to pull it and prime the pump by using a priming tool (www.taperformance.com sells them) with a hi speed drill. You will probably have to pack the pump gears with vaseline as well, before you try priming the pump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD1956 Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Adam is right. You have to pack the pump with vaseline before starting it up, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ladytrae Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 I have the oil pressure under control now, but the car is running the same if not worse than it did before changing the crankshaft position sensor and the camshaft position sensor. I took it to the store near by to see how it was running and as soon as it got up to temprature it was real "jerky" I guess you could say. Kinda like when you get water in your fuel it wants to die out a bit. And then at every stop it would want to stall. After the work was done on the car I did reset the codes before testing again and Im still getting an error code of 41. In my not so good Haynes book it says 41 is Cylinder select error - MEM-CAL or ECM problem? Any new suggestions? I apretiate the responses I have gotten, Thanks. -Ladytrae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 Plug wires crossed? Firing order mixed up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ladytrae Posted January 23, 2007 Author Share Posted January 23, 2007 I was very careful to number all of the wires with a sharpy to where they went as to not get them mixed up. So this can be ruled out. Thanks for keeping up with this Smartin. -Ladytrae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smartin Posted January 23, 2007 Share Posted January 23, 2007 It's a common mistake people (including myself a couple times) have made, so it makes sense to go through it again and be certain you covered your bases, even if it seems excessive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2seater Posted January 24, 2007 Share Posted January 24, 2007 Code 041 is the cam sensor. Was the magnet (interuptor) replaced when all the other work was done? Two of the possible things for an erratic idle. One is the ECM needs to relearn the operating parameters if the battery was disconnected, which it should have been. The second item would be if the check engine light is on and the cam sensor is inoperative. The ECM has to guess at the correct sequence for the injectors to fire. If it has it wrong, it will probably have a rougher feel to the engine at low speeds but will be fine at higher rpm. It starts the sequence every time the engine is started, so it may hit it right one time and wrong the next. The engine will operate okay without the sensor, but it may not be as smooth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ladytrae Posted January 24, 2007 Author Share Posted January 24, 2007 The magnet was replaced when all the work was done. The check engine light is on and the cam sensor is one of the things replaced. As far as the erratic idle, it doesnt matter if the car is sitting at an idle position, running 35 MP or 65 MPH. There is no difference. ? . Would the MEM-CAL be anything to consider? -Ladytrae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 Typically, there is the MEM-CAL and the PROM in the computer. The PROM is what fine-tunes the computer to the respective vehicle it's in. The MEM-CAL is the one that is not replaced, but comes with the ECM.Please make sure the plug wires are not only plugged onto the correct terminals on the coil(s), but also go to the appropriate spark plugs. I believe that vehicle uses the "waste spark" system for a little additional emissions controls, which means that both (across from each other) cylinders fire at the same time (one on compression stroke and the other one 180 degrees out), but if the wires are not plugged onto the correct spark plugs, that's the "crossed wires" situation.If you replaced the interruptor and are still getting the cam sensor code, you might double-check the wiring harness to see if there's a wiring problem (a connector not plugged-in, a connector where the terminals are not making good contact, a wiring issue of other causes).From what I understand of the "relearn" mode, that can take some run time to get it completed, but I would suspect that as when you start the engine cold, it'll be in open loop until operating temperature is reached and then it would go into closed loop (feedback control) mode and start the learning process. I doubt that would be causing a performance issue as you describe, though.I have no doubt you were careful with the plug wires to get them to the place they belong, but please double check that situation. Also, check the condition of the plugs too, as a chunk of carbon might be shorting one out OR a plug wire might have an internal problem (causing rough running and a "miss").Somewhere back in that time frame, the Mass Air Flow Sensors had some sproadic issues. They'd be running fine and then the engine would go "rough" or die. A GM bulletin mentioned a "tap test" for the sensor. What this was, was with the engine running (in which ever smooth or rough state), you'd take the handle end of a screwdriver (or similar) and "tap" on the MAF body. If the engine was rough and then smoothed out, it was at fault. If it was smooth and died, it was also at fault. If "no change", it was ok.In the GM Parts database, there was not a consistent location for the MAF listings. One year, it was in the normal group listings . . . another year, it would be in the parts illustrations . . . and another year it was in a chart. NO fun to find until you knew where to look. I would think that all of the flaky MAFs had already been changed, but it might still be a "last ditch" something to check.My gut suspicion is that it'll be something simple that might have been overlooked. I would hope that the interruptor had not fallen out again!Just some thoughts,NTX5467 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2seater Posted January 25, 2007 Share Posted January 25, 2007 The Memcal contains the PROM along with other things and is replaceable, but generally don't go bad. It is possible the ECM itself is bad, and is unfortunately not really uncommon. The good thing is they are relatively inexpensive from most good auto arts store but you need to switch the old Memcal into the new ECM. Before I would go to that extreme, the suggestions to double and triple check everything that was done already are very good. There have been a few instances where the rear plug boots were not fully seated, particularly if they have the stock metal heat shield on the boots. They can be a bear to get them all the way on. Check the harness that runs across the front (passengers side) of the engine. It connects the cam sensor and crank sensor to the ignition module and there have been instances where a wire has been rubbed through from the moving parts in the area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ladytrae Posted January 26, 2007 Author Share Posted January 26, 2007 Just to touch base on my situation here. Since my last post I have:1. Tried a matching PROM from my mother n laws car. No difference.2. Tried her ECM as well, just for the heck of it. The numbers matched so why not? No difference.3. Took it to GM to get a diagnostics done. Why? Getting desperate I guess. $45. to tell me its the cam sensor. DONE THAT!4. Started cleaning and checking electrical harnesses. 5. After much reading on here about the ingnition control module decided to change it too.6. New plugs and wires.Took it out for a ride, stalled in the driveway. Musta been from shock. While out she seemed a little off but otherwise ok. No sputtering or stalling. Brought it home. Waited 20 mimutes and took it back out again, which always proves to be the problem time. I dont want to jinx myself yet but she runs so strong. Very responsive. She has balls again if I may say that. Its late now so tomorrow will be a good test. BUT the darn engine light is still on...... I reset the code test and I still get the same old number 41. Go figure. After a long week and a half of trying to get to the bottom of this problem, I feel I can go to bed tonight with a little bit of self accomplishment. (Knock Knock on my desk) Anyway, I wanted to catch those of you that have helped me and threw your two cents in up on the situation and say Im glad I found this site. It truly helped me on this wild goose chase I have been on. Just an idea, could the car not like an aftermerket cam sensor to keep giving me the 41 code?? -Ladytrae Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Albert Posted January 26, 2007 Share Posted January 26, 2007 I have been driving with a 41 error in my 92 Pont Bonniville for over 2 years, i have gone through the wiring, and changed both the cam sensor and the coil pack, the next thing i have heard of is the maginnet on the cam gear breaks off, check in the Regetta section.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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