DonLarson Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 Have a friend that has a beautiful Leather-Bound book depicting many views of a 'Pan American' automobile - does anyone have any information on the Pan American? Also I'm STILL looking for any information on the Clement Bayard - I have a 1912 'Torpedo' and can use any info, pictures, or - other owners in the U.S. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter J.Heizmann Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 Hi, Don...Both of your questions sound to me like excellent ones for the Library & Research Center.Did you contact them? I feel you may find expedient answers to include a lot of fact, not bits and pieces. Regards, Peter J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RO Posted August 3, 2004 Share Posted August 3, 2004 Don, for the Pan American, go over to the Packard site and you should get some responses. I believe the Pan American was 1952. Regarding the Clement and Torpedo, see if you can locate a copy of the 640 page book "The Complete Encyclopedia of Motorcars 1885-1968 edited by G.N. Georgano and published for E.P. Dutton. The Clement-Bayard is on Pages 72 & 133 and the Torpedo on Page 562. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter J.Heizmann Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 RO...Why do all that "see if you can get a copy of the 640 page book The Complete Encylcopedia of Motorcars" when this AACA "owned" website promotes utilizing the "AACA Library & Research Center", of which, I would bet already has a copy.It is really simple. Click on the Antique Automobile Club of America in the left column, once opened, scroll down to the L&RC, open the research prompt, fill it out, and, receive prompt/factual information.One would be amazed at the volumes of data, of which, has been collected since circa-1935 just sitting there awaiting service to "we" AACA Members.Regards, Peter J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poci1957 Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Don, what era is the car from? If it is a 1950's car then it is the Packard Pan American show car of 1952 as stated. If it is from the teens then it is a 1917-22 Pan American assembled car of Decatur IL. I am researching this very obscure car of the teens and if that is the car featured I would be happy to give you the story and would love to see some pictures of that book. Please contact me if that is the one, thanks, Todd C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter J.Heizmann Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Todd C...should Don opt to take advantage, please keep the thread alive so all of us benefit.To suggest a private e-mail benefits no one on this AACA Forum.Thanks in advance, Peter J. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Binger Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Don,Was the Pan American you are asking about built between 1917 and 1922 in Decatur, Ill. ?Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poci1957 Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Peter, you are right, and in fact since Don and Dan are both broaching the subject I will post a new thread to try to get some input from others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter J.Heizmann Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 Great, Todd...thank you!Peter J. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksparks Posted August 4, 2004 Share Posted August 4, 2004 A friend of mine in Australia as a 17 Pan American project. He is looking for a Hershal Spillman motor. I also understand that the Pan American also used Continental engines maybe 7R. Also looking for early 20 auburn/moon parts.thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poci1957 Posted August 5, 2004 Share Posted August 5, 2004 I bet you are referring to John Ryder, who I have also contacted. We are unsure about the use of the Continental engine, a company brochure from 1920 lists a Continental 9N but another brochure and all other sources list the Herschell Spillman 11000 as being used from approx late 1919 through 1922. A Ruetenber was used from 1917-mid-1919, all this according to incomplete research. If you contact John please tell him I said hello from Decatur and have found the Herschell-Spillman 11000 listed as used in these 1921-22 models--Ace Model L, American Six, Birch Model 66, Crow-Elkhart S-65, Pilot 6-50, and Climber Model S. Thanks for the post, Todd C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poci1957 Posted August 9, 2004 Share Posted August 9, 2004 Don, what about the era of the Pan American in your book? Is it the Packard showcar or my 1917-22 model? Would be interested to hear, thanks, Todd C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksparks Posted August 10, 2004 Share Posted August 10, 2004 thanks, John R is a good man. I have looked for a year for an engine for him with no luck but i always believe there is something out there. I have bent his ear on occasion after a guy from PERTH picked up stuff i sold in Virginia. Problem was that i am in Colombia working and my friend was not versed on car stuff when this guy picked up what i had sold. next thing when i got back to teh states i know i missing early stutz cowl, hcs front end, etc etc plus did not leave the balance of the money owed. good lesson but 90 per cent of old car guys are honest.with your engine advice maybe we can search also for something other than a HS engine. i too am interested in independent makes 17-23 ( i have a 20 moon and 22 auburn project ). thanks and enjoyed the conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poci1957 Posted August 11, 2004 Share Posted August 11, 2004 I enjoyed my corrospondance with John and always have an eye open for Herschell-SPillman stuff for him. Note regarding my post, there was also a Herschell-Spillman 7000 engine listed, I do not know the difference between it and an 11000 as used in the Pan American. It seems Herschell-Spillman was a prominent carousel manufacturer in Buffalo NY and they offered engines to the small automakers, according to John the casting of the block appears to have been done by Westinghouse. All very old and obscure information, to be sure. Speaking of obscure, you are a brave man to tackle a Moon and a rare Auburn, best wishes, Todd C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksparks Posted August 13, 2004 Share Posted August 13, 2004 thanks for the note. in between a busy job down here i like the diversion of checking the aaca slot. the auburn is a great project but one of sentiment. i owned a 22 auburn beauty six found in a field in vermont in 1970 as a fourteen year old. my dad bought the 24 stude special six next two it. later when i went to college my dad had so many projects the auburn was sold. i was disappointed but such is life. I spent ( now 47 ) 25 plus years periodically advertising for a auburn beauty six project. one day i got an email stating a gentleman had a 22 auburn. found out it was the exact same car i had owned as a kid. my dad sold to a guy in canada then this gentleman's father. thus i have the same car back and will restore it. i will give John Ryder a call in the near future to see how his projects are going. he also a 23 stutz bearcat project but i believe that needs more body parts than anything else on the stutz. the pan american he has sent me literature on what he needs but it is tough search. i know the majority independent makes dont hold the same value ( exception Reveres, Cunninghams etc ) but it more about the love of cars when you stumbled across something.take carekeith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poci1957 Posted August 15, 2004 Share Posted August 15, 2004 It is true the independents are not worth too much in today's big money/big auction/speculator-driven market, but they are really interesting stories. I am interested in the Pan American and Comet more for historical reasons. Decatur IL is a long-time company town and the two car companies are a footnote in our history that have never been researched by a real old car guy. Of course I would love to buy one and bring it home to Decatur, and I am actively looking for actual cars, but for me the research is the thing right now. Great story on your Auburn, best wishes, Todd C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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