1929 Fargo Express Panel Update

[Jack Bennett]

Since I bought the 1929 Fargo Express Panel a few months ago, I have concentrated most of my efforts to get the sheet metal and rotten woodwork back into a condition I could determine if the truck was even repairable.

I have managed to fit enough pieces of the rotten wood together to make a relatively accurate set of patterns, and have managed to complete fabrication of most of the wooden body parts. The doors were a real task since the regulators were broken, badly bent and rusted beyond recognition. The windows were both broken with most of the glass missing. These I have replaced with plexiglass, and I personally think they look better than the glass originals.

The original flathead six cylinder engine had been left outside with four of the six spark plugs missing, and the bores had sat since, at least, 1976 full of nasty water and debris. The engine was locked up and four of the six cylinder bores was badly rusted and deeply pitted.

So, rather than beat a dead horse by attempting to rebuild a engine, I could never determine a model for, with no transmission or drive shaft, I elected to replace the 1929 engine with the engine and transmission from a 1951 Dodge 1/2 ton pickup.

This was a learning experience since the Canadian built Fargo engine had a 25” head, and the pickup engine was only 23”. That measurement gradually evolved into a 7” difference between the motor mounts, and entailed moving the 1951 engine 7” toward the truck rear to place it in the rear mounts and allow the fabrication of new front mounts.

The change back to the spring daylight savings plan gave me enough daylight to get the engine complete and ready to run.

So today the 1951 Dodge, 218 CI engine started and ran like a new one.

OH, that is if a new one had a leaking fuel pump, a broken fuel pump settling bulb and a leaking carburetor.

The original engine I removed from the truck used an odd looking electric fuel pump so I took the electric fuel pump I’d installed in my 1951 Plymouth Cambridge, hooked it up to the Fargo engine, and it works great….But, as I said, the carburetor started leaking. 
I have a few problems though and I need some help. 
The original radiator, with honeycomb water passages leaks too bad to even think about repairing it myself.

And, the clutch pedal on the 1951 bell housing is about 5 or 6 inches too far to the left of the steering column to fit into the firewall slots which would allow it to be fully depressed.

And, the biggy…..the original, 1929, engine I removed from the truck used a electric push button, mounted on the engine bell housing, to engage the electrically operated starter.

The 1951 Dodge engine has a manually operated starter, with a yoke mounted atop the bendix housing on the starter, and the starter is engaged by pressing (with your foot) on a pad mounted to the floorboard.

I need to fabricate a device which mounts to the floorboards, and is used to depress the extension on the starter. 
I won’t tie up space here by trying to detail how it works because, if you don’t have it, the explanation would not help anyway.

But, if you do have a 1950’s vintage dodge pickup, with a manually engaged starter, I would really appreciate a few photos of the device to give me a idea where to go with this.

Jack

 

Edited March 22 by Jack Bennett (see edit history)

[Jeff Perkins / Mn]

Glad you are back! This is one of my most favorite sagas…….

[Jack Bennett]

While not the discovery of King Tut’s tomb, or even finding the lost White House corner stone, in Tacoma, Washington archeology, this rates as a ten on a scale of 1 to 10.

I have nearly finished up all the wood work of the cab and bed on then 1929 Fargo Express Panel, and am now preparing the sheet metal for re-installation.

During this procedure I use a surface preparation tool, large and small grinders, a small sander and steel and copper brushes.

If you have the picture, it isn’t hard to imagine the amount of metal and paint which can be laid to waste very quickly.

But, sometime this is destructive, and can actually destroy the historical information shed along with the metal and paint.

Thankfully, I was able to move from a power sander and grinder when I found very fragile lettering under the old coat of black paint covering the side panel of the truck bed.

So, I discarded the haste of getting the panel prepared for painting, and instead went into the preservation mode and switched to using a scraper and a awl to carefully remove the rust, crud and paint.

I dote on history, and the origin and use of my old vehicles is as important as the metal, wood and rubber they are made of.

In this case I found, concealed under the flaking paint a hint at what sort of job the Fargo Express Panel done during its service life.

We all Know Kenworth, but I had not heard of the “Federal” truck brand  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Motor_Truck_Company until I began stripping the layers of past from the Fargo’s bed.

This made my day, and I am seriously considering on using the “ROBERTS MOTOR COMPANY”  logo on the repainted truck bed panels……….

Comments are welcome and will be part of my decision as to how the truck will be finished.

Jack

Edited March 25 by Jack Bennett (see edit history)

[Jack Bennett]

Just a bit of Deja Vu.

In case you missed it, in the comments on the link I provided, Federal trucks were equipped with the same Willys sleeve valve engine you will find under the hood of my 1927 Willys Knight 70A, and were marketed under the brand “Federal Knight”…….and the circle is completed in the Bennett stable.

Jack

[Jeff Perkins / Mn]

To sum up my thoughts in few words……..YES! Your truck has an identifiable past life, it must be honored!

[1912 Minerva]

Great find Jack! Would you possibly consider a clear varnish over the top of that original lettering? It would preserve the history yet still have a shiny finish to match whatever other fresh painting you do.  As you say, being able to show off the past history of the vehicle's use is invaluable.

[Walt G]

Remarkable is the only word that comes immediately to mind when I see all of this and your reports of progress and discovery.

thank you for taking the time to share with us your on going saga of preservation.

Walt

[Jack Bennett]

7 hours ago, 1912 Minerva said:

Great find Jack! Would you possibly consider a clear varnish over the top of that original lettering? It would preserve the history yet still have a shiny finish to match whatever other fresh painting you do.  As you say, being able to show off the past history of the vehicle's use is invaluable.

Hi 1912 Minerva…….How very strange you suggest that. 
I had nearly finished sanding one panel of the truck side, and I noticed flecks of red and white paint mixed with the green base paint.

So, I set aside the surface preparation tool and reverted my scraping to a razor blade.

All that was left of the lettering on that panel was the numbers 123-***, but everything had been erased with the paint removal.

So, I stopped working on the first panel and began carefully removing the paint on the second panel with a small scraper.

Sadly, there was no number on the second panel, and I thought the rest of the letters had became unreadable too.

But, a few more minutes of scraping began revealing letters, and the first thought in my mind was putting the clear varnish I’d bought to do the cab inside to a new use.

What a cool idea!

It will be a tedious task to scrape all the old black paint off, and remove the badly rusted parts of the panel without damaging the lettering……but, isn’t this what it’s all about?

Thanks for the suggestion. With my tiny 750 megabyte memory it will be easy to find as I work my way through this.

Jack

[Jack Bennett]

2 hours ago, Walt G said:

Remarkable is the only word that comes immediately to mind when I see all of this and your reports of progress and discovery.

thank you for taking the time to share with us your on going saga of preservation.

Walt

Hello Walt……Having a single track mind, and even more focalized as I work on these old machines, I immediately Googled “FEDERAL” and “KENWORTH”, thinking they would return a location where the truck may have been used.

Instead the results always came up with “KENWORTH” being a truck, and no cities named “FEDERAL”. We do have a “Federal Way” not far from Tacoma, but the truck was bought over 200 miles away in Oregon.

So, I Googled just the word “Federal”, and the truck brand “FEDERAL” popped up, and a new link to my 1927 Willys Knight was opened.

That sort of history makes my timbers shiver, and I just had to share it.

Jack

[Jack Bennett]

14 hours ago, Jeff Perkins / Mn said:

To sum up my thoughts in few words……..YES! Your truck has an identifiable past life, it must be honored!

Hi Jeff……I have been continually cautioned that assigning names, and personifying a machine, or any other inanimate object is extremely dangerous to the maintenance of a suitable social status, and may possibly result in irreversible mental damage.

This considered, I neither assign names or personalities to my old cars until they are “reanimated” and I have returned them to a level of operability.

Still, there is credence to what you say, and it is a necessity, rather than a just a part, of living with these old machines that we move them beyond the “just another car” stage of existence.

It hurts a seventy-plus year old body as much when it is cut by the sharp metal of a new Cadillac Escalade as it does when cut by the metal of a 100 year old Dodge Roadster.

But, the Escalade is parked in the driveway while the roadster sits comfortably in the well lit, and heated, garage.

A mental search may reveal that the Dodge is considered to be “family”, and the Escalade will never be more than “transportation”.

And having a precious relative with no name, or past, is simply unimaginable.

Jack

 

[Jack Bennett]

I will continue my search for more information regarding the location and history of the “Robert’s Motor Company”.

But as is expected, the smooth road of a otherwise benign search often contains bumps which are as interesting as they are distracting.

If you bleed 30 weight and sweat kerosene, this link may be as interesting as it is distracting https://oldmachinepress.com/2014/10/25/roberts-motor-company-aircraft-engines/

Jack

[Jack Bennett]

Weather really stinks today in Washington State. Rain all day and cold enough you can see your breath.

Even for a hard core guy like me, this isn’t the sort of weather I consider fit for a fellow to be working outside.

So I took the opportunity to do some sheet metal work on the Fargo, and have nearly gotten one fender ready for primer and paint.

The past couple of days have been nice enough that I have gotten the wooden parts of the bed finished and in place. But, I still need to cut the boards which make the floor of the bed and attach the metal flooring to it.

 

[Jack Bennett]

Today is a total bust in regards to working on the Fargo.

Wet weather I can stand, and cold weather I can stand…..but cold, wet weather just doesn’t appeal to me as being conducive to working outside on a old truck.

So, today I may start on re upholstering the back of the seat, and start shopping for springs to fabricate a lower part of the seat.

Yesterday was a bummed out day too with hail, rain, wind and gloom, but I did get the boards which form the base of the bed nailed down, and the sheet metal cover reinstalled.

A real plus to the days labor was determining that the flange which connects 

the 1951 Dodge pickup drive shaft to the four speed transmission appears to be the same bolt pattern used to connect a drive shaft to the 1929 Fargo rear end.

I have not actually fit this up to determine it as being fact, but I made patterns of both the rear end input shaft, and the Dodge front drive shaft flange, and by all appearances they are the same.

This is a huge load off my shoulders because I have been sweating having a new drive shaft fabricated, and the rear flange made up to fit it.

Jack

[Jack Bennett]

As I tore the panels and decking from the metal frame of the Fargo, I found piles of indistinguishable pieces of rotted wood which had been confined and concealed for possibly decades.

There was badly rusted bolts, with the (square) nuts and washers still attached, and little shards of wood, clearly cut square, with holes drilled in them.

Even rhe larger, and somewhat distinguishable pieces of wood, which literally fell apart as the bolts and screws which held them together was cut, gave no clue as to what the smaller pieces was used for.

Now, over a month into the reconstruction of the wooden portion of the body, and some really vexing minutes trying to figure out why my measurements were so far off in fitting the pieces back together, I made a monumental discovery.

I had done basically the same thing to reconstruct the badly rotted frame of the 1927 Willys Knight I bought a few years back. And the most notable thing about the construction of the car was the craftsmanship which went into piecing the frame together.

I was truly amazed at the formed corners and finger joint attachments holding the frame together, and blending it into a super strong unit, although it consisted of many tiny pieces of a number of assorted wood types.

Totally baffeled by the mountain of seemingly useless debris I had collected as I disassembled the Fargo, I decided, rather than “think outside the box” I needed to “discard what I thought the box should look like”, and take some time to reconstruct the framework as near to what it was originally, and use the debris to fill in the vacant spots.

It made me as happy as it disappointed me to discover that the debris was actually pieces of material the workers had used during assembly of the framework to correct errors in measurement, and to economize use of every piece of wood available.

In the construction of the Willys, it seems as though they used a plan with dimensions layer out whereby they could use two 7” pieces of wood, joined together by a finger joint at the center to make a 14” long piece, glued and supported by planning the intersection of other pieces. But, on the Fargo it looks like they took, to accomplish the same thing, a piece of wood 12” long, bolted it to the nearest cross piece, and the took a 2” long piece of scrap and used it to fill in the vacant 2” to make it meet a nailed corner piece.

Consequently, the extreme amount of stuructural damage found in the Fargo, but not in the Willys, is due to shoddy construction practices and a G-a-S attitude regarding the quality of construction materials used to fabricate the Fargo.

The term we use to describe a modern version of this atrocity is a “Friday” or a “Monday” car. This quip suffices to explain, in as few words as possible, how the days of the week affected the level of pride and attentiveness the workers employed as they assembled the car. Those showing for work on Monday were worn out from the weekend and possibly hung over from a two day drinking binge. Those leaving work on Friday didn’t mind if a shoddy job was necessary to complete a task prior to starting a weekend, and possibly, begin a two day long drinking binge.

It appears though, that the Canadians involved in the construction of the Fargo, didn’t even own a calendar, and every morning was a Monday, and every afternoon was a Friday.

No complaints though, because now that I have figured this out, I no longer need math skills to finish the project. I just estimate the length of a piece, cut it way too long, and chop it off how ever many times it takes to make it fit…….and that folks, is what makes this hobby so dang fun.🤪.

Jack

Edited March 30 by Jack Bennett (see edit history)

[Jack Bennett]

The weather here in Washington State is a daily mix of WOW! and wow……but it is finally warm enough by mid-day that I can get a few hours work done on the Frgo.

Today was a pretty good day in Fargo terms, and I made some noteworthy progress toward the reanimation of the old man.

Exchanging the original 1929, 25” six cylinder engine for the 230 cubic inch, 1951 Dodge pickup six cylinder, 23” engine posed a few problems with the brake, clutch, starter and gas pedals, which complicated cutting and installing new floor boards in the cab. 
At the close of the business day in Fargo Land, many of these bumps have been smoothed out.

The transmission, clutch have been installed and the pedals have been cut and bent to fit the Dodge bell housing and the Fargo firewall. 
This put me to a point I was able to measure the length of the drive shaft I need to connect the Dodge transmission to the Fargo rear end.

A new master cylinder has replaced the unserviceable one in the truck so this leaves only the rear brake cylinders to worry about.

A guy on Facebook marketing advertises he has Dodge driveshafts for sale so maybe a trip to Puyallup is in the offing over the next few days.

Bottom line to all this ambling is that “Mite”, the 1929 Fargo Express Panel just may be able to move under his own power, for the first time in at least fifty years, by this time next week.

Jack

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

That will be an EXCITING day, Jack.   Pulling for you.

 

  Ben

[Jack Bennett]

4 hours ago, Ben Bruce aka First Born said:

That will be an EXCITING day, Jack.   Pulling for you.

 

  Ben

Thank you Ben. Just a note for any spatially impaired eighty year old guy, who still thinks they occupy a 18 year old body, and decides putting a massive four speed gear box, in a tiny truck intended for a three speed box will be easy………think again because it isn’t.

There was a time that I considered cutting out the frame cross member which runs under the seat because the pickup truck emergency brake operating mechanism doesn’t have clearance to fit.

Thankfully, I still had a can of MGD left and decided to drink it instead of grabbing my zip tool. Then it occurred to me that the emergency brake on the transmission was intended to fit a 1951 Dodge pickup, which apparently uses a banana shaped pull handle located under the left side of the truck dash board.

I plan on fabricating a floor mounted lever, which I suppose is more original to a 1929 Fargo than a 1951 Dodge Pilothouse pickup, Fortunately I have a couple of transmissions left over from building the 1923 Roadster, and one of them has a complete lever operated emergency brake, with the lever and the little toothy piece which mounts on the gear box and keeps the handle engaged in the hold position.

The new voltage regulator should arrive in the mail today or tomorrow and the cutout switch on the generator will be updated to a voltage regulator.

Meanwhile, I have a old friend who does plasma cutting as a hobby, and I will see if he will cut me a new mount to adapt the emergency brake handle to the Fargo.

I’ll post a bit more as “Mite” returns to life……..thanks for your input and encouragement.

Jack