PhilAndrews Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 (edited) Afternoon, all I'm making prep to pull my engine and transmission out- 8 with hydramatic because I need to rebuild the gearbox valve block (plus it leaks like the Exxon Valdez). I'm thinking the easiest method will be to pull them both out as a unit, I'm going to remove the strengthening frame from in front of the radiator and the front grille to give enough room. The radiator is out already. There's a mount at the front (2 bolts that I see), the propshaft, a mount at the rear, the gearshift linkage, throttle linkage, gearbox thrill position linkage, speedometer and the electricals to remove. I've pulled the generator off, I'll take the manifolds off and I was looking to use four of the head bolts as lifting points. Anything I've missed? The service manual helpfully shows a nice sketch of one side of the engine and that's all there is on the topic. Phil Edited March 14, 2021 by PhilAndrews (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 Bummer...my manual has step by step for removal/installation of both the transmission and engine. It does state the engine may be removed from the car with the transmission attached.....good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted January 24, 2019 Author Share Posted January 24, 2019 Hmm. Which manual is that? I plan on taking them both out, attached. With the grille and everything off the access if actually pretty good. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 Oh ya....it's the 1949-1954 Pontiac Shop Manual. Guess that would work for you too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 3, 2019 Author Share Posted February 3, 2019 I bought myself a hydraulic floor crane (1000lb on full extension). I have a couple of engine chains, the type that you attach to bolts. The shop manual states you can lift the engine using the head bolts- I'm going to lift the engine and transmission out together. Whereabouts is the balance point? I'm looking at it and thinking towards the back of the engine? Also are the head bolts long enough to have enough thread with standard engine chains? The plates are about a third of an inch thick. Thanks Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 hi, do the chains have a lifting plate at each end ?, how many chains are going to do the lifting, 2 or 4 ?, i would advise you to buy or rent a engine tilter, with four chain lifting points and a worm shaft with crank handle at one end, and fasten the rear portion to both rear corner headbolts and the front portion to the headbolts near #4 spark plugs. 1/3" plates, the headbolts will be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 4, 2019 Share Posted February 4, 2019 once you have the engine/trans supported by the hoist, unbolt the left and right rear motor mounts from the bell housing and remove the 6 bolts mounting the rear cross member to drop the cross member from the frame. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 4, 2019 Author Share Posted February 4, 2019 23 minutes ago, pontiac1953 said: hi, do the chains have a lifting plate at each end ?, how many chains are going to do the lifting, 2 or 4 ?, i would advise you to buy or rent a engine tilter, with four chain lifting points and a worm shaft with crank handle at one end, and fasten the rear portion to both rear corner headbolts and the front portion to the headbolts near #4 spark plugs. 1/3" plates, the headbolts will be fine. They do. I have 2 chains, they have a plate at each end. I was going to cross them over in an X and lift in the center of the X, which would be over cylinder 6 or thereabouts. I'm going to fight it without a load leveler, I've pulled the radiator, I'm going to remove the U channel stiffener, cross brace and front grille so I don't have to lift it up really high (and avoid removing the hood). Phil 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 4, 2019 Author Share Posted February 4, 2019 I have a pair like this. 1000lb rated load. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 This is where I left off today. Manifolds removed, fuel pump off, throttle and gears disconnected. Next up, disconnect the propshaft, pull the crossbrace off the front, get the cradle undone and start on getting it out of the car. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GARY F Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Looking forward to see it out of the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Likewise! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 10, 2019 Author Share Posted February 10, 2019 Propshaft. I've not been up under the car too much so far because of all the damn spiders. If I undo the flange bolts on the diff, drop the prop down will the front end just pull off the splines? Manual doesn't show any retainer on the front. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, PhilAndrews said: yes, the splined driveshaft yoke should slip off the splined trans tailshaft. I've not been up under the car too much so far because of all the damn spiders. If I undo the flange bolts on the diff, drop the prop down will the front end just pull off the splines? Manual doesn't show any retainer on the front. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 10, 2019 Share Posted February 10, 2019 I always preferred to remove the front clip and not have to raise the engine/trans so high to remove or install them, here is 20 years ago installing the 55 287 V8 & hydramatic into my 53 Pontiac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 10, 2019 Author Share Posted February 10, 2019 (edited) All I need to do is remove the crossbrace (4 sheet metal bolts) and there's a gap the width of the radiator and the highest point is the lip of the front bumper. The entire assembly should come out of there. That and I didn't fancy realigning it all, and I also am doing this by myself so this seems to be the most sane route at this juncture. Phil Edited February 10, 2019 by PhilAndrews (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 10, 2019 Author Share Posted February 10, 2019 (edited) Next up past this is a bit more expense. 1) Radiator needs repair. Hopefully it just needs a bit of brazing to seal it up, rather than a full recore. 2) I need to replace the generator. I'm going to get an alternator that is built into the original style generator housing. I've run dynamo generators in the past and they work fine but truly they hold nothing against a decent alternator. 3) Tempted to pull the head off and inspect the block and bores for cracks. 4) Gearbox valve block and seal rebuild (reason for engine removal) Then on to steering and brakes and then wiring. Piece by piece! Phil Edited February 10, 2019 by PhilAndrews (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 17, 2019 Author Share Posted February 17, 2019 That was easier than anticipated. Bought a load leveler- proved invaluable. Phil 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 glad to read that you did take my advice about getting the engine tilter aka load leveler. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 17, 2019 Author Share Posted February 17, 2019 I had a leveler with my old crane back in England. It was useful. I was concerned that it would add too much height and I'd foul the hood lifting it out. Discovered the gearbox leaks when you take the propshaft off the splines. Kitty litter to the rescue. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Glad to hear it worked out for you and thanks for the pic. I'll probably have to attempt this one day too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 17, 2019 Author Share Posted February 17, 2019 2 hours ago, Summershandy said: Glad to hear it worked out for you and thanks for the pic. I'll probably have to attempt this one day too. If you're willing to drill the rivets out, this is a moderately easy operation. No front clip removal, no hood removal. I can list what I did in order if you need. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 18, 2019 Author Share Posted February 18, 2019 (edited) Question, is the tailshaft meant to pass oil with the propshaft end removed removed? It looks like there's meant to be a seal inside that wouldn't take that for it to seal. Edit, going the section of the rebuild manual that shows it does. Phil Edited February 18, 2019 by PhilAndrews (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 5 hours ago, PhilAndrews said: Question, is the tailshaft meant to pass oil with the propshaft end removed removed? It looks like there's meant to be a seal inside that wouldn't take that for it to seal. Edit, going the section of the rebuild manual that shows it does. Phil the slip yoke is what the rear seal seals against, so naturally if the slip yoke and driveshaft come away from the rear seal and tailshaft spline, you're going to spill some ATF fluids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 20, 2019 Author Share Posted February 20, 2019 Is there meant to be a lower bellhousing cover? The manual picture looks like there should be. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 13 hours ago, PhilAndrews said: Is there meant to be a lower bellhousing cover? Do you mean that cover in the back of the table? The cover for the flywheel? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 20, 2019 Author Share Posted February 20, 2019 Yeah that. Is that just a pressed steel cover? Mine is missing in that case. Phil 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, PhilAndrews said: Is that just a pressed steel cover? Yup...along with a tiny hole drilled in the bottom, I guess as an indicator of a seal leak up above like I got. Engine will have to be removed to fix that one. I hate leaks and I pretty much got it dry except for that one. I'm sure that cover would be available and not that expensive. Wouldn't want any debris hitting the flywheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 20, 2019 Author Share Posted February 20, 2019 There's a bunch of random tinware missing from mine. I need to replace the crank ventilation tube also. I think I may paint the engine the correct shade of green while it's out. What color should the gearbox be? Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 I painted my engine the blue/green colour and got it from Bill Hirsh. I'm very happy with the brushability and durability but I've only ran it one summer. Can't help you with the trans...couldn't find much info on it. Mine is a combination orange and metallic blue....probably the past owners left overs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 20, 2019 Author Share Posted February 20, 2019 That sounds very.. eighties. I think I'll stick with the light gray, it's a sensible color. I'm going to get something approximately Pontiac green for this go around. Thanks Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, PhilAndrews said: That sounds very.. eighties. I think I'll stick with the light gray, it's a sensible color. Haha....agreed. I wasn't so concerned about the hydramatic colour....you can't really see it from above and looked a lot harder to paint installed. You've got the convenience of removal so go at it. I didn't like the blue/green when I first put it on but it grew on me and now I love it! I painted the horn, air cleaner, battery cover, inner fenders etc. semi gloss black and like that look too. Cheers, Mark Edited February 20, 2019 by Summershandy add picture (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 20, 2019 Author Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) That looks really smart! I'm going for a similar look, only the black items are gloss enamel instead. To I like the shiny black. I figured I couldn't make it look any worse! Phil Edited February 20, 2019 by PhilAndrews (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 I like gloss and flat also. Looked at a lot of examples for results that I liked. It's one question you can't ask anyone else but yourself! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilAndrews Posted February 20, 2019 Author Share Posted February 20, 2019 Amen to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 22 hours ago, PhilAndrews said: Is there meant to be a lower bellhousing cover? The manual picture looks like there should be. Phil yes, pontiac engines have a sheet metal lower flywheel/torus cover. p/n 515090 1948 to 1954 pontiacs. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 8 hours ago, PhilAndrews said: Yeah that. Is that just a pressed steel cover? Mine is missing in that case. Phil yes, it is stamped steel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PONTIAC1953 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 8 hours ago, Summershandy said: Yup...along with a tiny hole drilled in the bottom, I guess as an indicator of a seal leak up above like I got. Engine will have to be removed to fix that one. I hate leaks and I pretty much got it dry except for that one. I'm sure that cover would be available and not that expensive. Wouldn't want any debris hitting the flywheel. so is your rear engine rope seal leaking ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 15 minutes ago, pontiac1953 said: so is your rear engine rope seal leaking ? That's what I figure....it's a minor leak with a more major fix. I'll cross that bridge when I get there. I didn't get the car on the road as soon as I wanted to last year and I'd like to enjoy it a little more this summer. Which by the way, are very very short up here in Northern Ontario! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Summershandy Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I did however, fix the front crank seal which was leaking really bad when I got the car. Of course, I didn't have to remove the engine, crankshaft or transmission for that one...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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