32 Ply PB tranny prob

[AlfaTazio]

I have a 32 Plymouth PB and lately, it decided to have the tranny become stuck in 1st gear.....the clutch works fine, the gearbox has plenty of oit, etc.....and it had been shifting very well but.....the free wheeling knob was all the way in, and I believe that allows the lever to actually be *in* freewheeling, even though it did not drive that way.  This car also has the optional *clutchless* system from the factory that assists shifts due to throttle pressure and a vacuum system.  On the intake manifold, I had inserted a brass threaded plug to dis-able the system, and it has worked fine for some time.  Though, lately, I was hearing a bit of gearbox noise, as if the gear was not sliding correctly into position.  Anyway, its stuck in first gear, and I have moved the freewheeling lever into the position to dis-able the device, but with no luck.  Would it be possible for the free-wheeling mechansim to allow a gear to become stuck, or am I pulling the tranny to have a look at the shifter forks and rods....

[F&J]

48 minutes ago, AlfaTazio said:

Would it be possible for the free-wheeling mechansim to allow a gear to become stuck

 

I can't see how, the freewheel unit is a one way clutching device at the back of trans.

 

49 minutes ago, AlfaTazio said:

am I pulling the tranny to have a look at the shifter forks and rods....

 

If you can remove the flooring above the trans, I would do that, to remove the top cover of the trans.  Then look at those pieces and see if they move. 

 

 

52 minutes ago, AlfaTazio said:

lately, I was hearing a bit of gearbox noise

 

It is possible that a bearing is falling apart, causing misalignments, etc.   Take the cover off and check all that you can see, and feel.

 

You have front and rear main case bearings, and also a bearing hidden inside the back end of the input shaft where the mainshaft fits into it.  These will be on the top shafts.  The lower countershaft is needle bearings not likely to cause that.

 

Noise in all gears could be case bearings.   If quiet in high only, then it can be that hidden input bearing.  Noise in neutral, car stopped, clutch out, would be front case bearing.

.

[hddennis]

I may be totally off base here but my first antique car was a PB sedan over 50 years ago and I remember something about a rubber and steel transmission mount and if I recall correctly the gearshift lever  was mounted on a frame cross member and floated above the transmission shifting rails so if your mounts rubber is shot like mine was it may be allowing the lever and rails to go out of alignment and could be causing the gears to jam or hang up. 

 

Howard Dennis

Took awhile but I finally found the link:

 

http://then-now-auto.com/plymouth-motor-mounts/

 

I'd be willing to bet your transmission has dropped down due to a decayed mount like this.

 

Edited January 17, 2017 by hddennis (see edit history)

[AlfaTazio]

Thanks for the replies.

 

I have had several cars with failing input shaft bearings over the years, and know the sound well.  This PB has a quiet smooth tranny, in this case, I don't think its the bearings.  In regards to the rubber tranny mount,  that's a very good suggestion as well, so I inspected it and it must have been replaced the last time the car had restoration work done, its in okay shape.  I checked by placing a floor jack with a bit of wood under that tranny and gently jacking it, there was no movement upwards of the tranny. 

 

In reference to my suspicion of the free-wheeling device,  I had a 31 Plymouth PA, and had removed the freewheeling cable to do some dash repair.  When I first re-installed the cable, I didn't have it in the right spot,  and the car would not engage reverse gear....finally, I postioned the cable correctly, and reverse began working again.....

 

So, I will remove the floorboards, etc...and then detach the shift tower and try and see whats doing.  I have the feeling a small rap on a shift fork might help....especially with the free-wheeling device locked out now....

 

Jay

[Spinneyhill]

 

5 hours ago, AlfaTazio said:

So, I will remove the floorboards, etc...and then detach the shift tower and try and see whats doing.  I have the feeling a small rap on a shift fork might help....especially with the free-wheeling device locked out now....

 

Jay

 

Just a dumb thought. When I was learning to drive, I managed to jam the family Mark II Cortina in 3rd gear (column shift). I suppose with a little wear and maladjustment it went into third but partially engaged another gear too and jammed. Dad drove it home like that and at the gate set up to push the car in backwards. Just in case, he pulled the lever and it easily went into neutral. Maybe yours will do the same with a bit of vibration if you drive it around the block, flex it a bit with one wheel higher, etc.?

[Guest newbymachineworks]

Never worked on a PB, but have 32 Chrysler CI and 32 Dodge DL. Both have floating power mounts, shift lever is mounted to frame and not to transmission. Maybe sagging mounts have allowed lever to pull out of 1st and reverse shifter rail?

[AlfaTazio]

Thanks for all the replies and suggestions, they are very much appreciated.

 

Okay, the bloody tranny is fixed......I pulled up the floorboards and large metal tranny cover, then removed the shift tower, only to have the intermediate piece surrounding the ends of the shift rods to move around....then I saw it, there is a bolt hole right through the center of the large frame/tranny bracket and a 1/2 inch bolt passes through and helps secure this intermediate piece. Once I installed a new threaded bolt and aligned the shift rods, then re-inserted the shift tower, I could access the gears again and yes, the car is now moving in reverse as well as the forward gears....without that bolt, there must have been some flexing. 

 

When i work on my cars, I believe, I always put the bolts and nuts back.....

 

Which brings to mind another car I have been working on, a 1925 Pierce Series 80 I acquired this past summer.  There were problems with shifting, grinding gears, etc.  The seller, whom is a very decent collector, talked about some specialist working on the engine, and other things, etc.... well, upon removing those floorboards to attempt to adjust up the clutch, I could see perhaps 4 nuts missing around the bell housing, no washers on the others, nasty old rusty nuts being the ones used....and its a Pierce Arrow?  Did the guy have zero respect for what he was working on.... must happen all the time