Headliner

[ChrisWhewell]

Yeah, so I have a decent looking '90 coupe, and recently picked up a second one of the same car, as a parts car.  As dictated by Murphy's Law, the headliner on the car I like the better of the two is in bad shape, but the one on the parts car is in mint condition.   I've read some old postings by Barney and others about doing the headliner job but seriously doubt I'm competent to do it, I lack patience for that sort of thing.   My question is, ..... is a headliner job something that qualified labor is commonly available for ?   i.e., where would I look for someone to do it for me ?   Obviously, an "auto upholstery shop" in the yellow pages, but before I delve I thought I'd maybe just pick your brains for any tips or pointers, what to look out for, etc.   Thanks !!   

.

oh, and BTW, if any of you has some time on their hands... and want a little job.....

[raleets]

Not to worry........three years ago my wife bought me a '89 coupe for Father's Day.  (what a wife, right?)

It was a good running car, but needed some immediate TLC, including a new headliner.

I took it to a local professional trim shop here in town.  It was ready the next day and looked like a brand new car for LESS THAN $200.

Even more important, it still looks as good as the day I picked it up from the trim shop.

Good luck,

[Barney Eaton]

Chris.......I hate to spend good $$ on a job that I can do myself,  the first Reatta headliner that I did...I pulled the headliner and took it somewhere in Georgetown (don't recall where it was) and they charged $90 just for covering the headliner.

With all the jobs you have done recently on your Reattas the headliner should be a walk in the park.    It takes about 1 1/2 yards of material which is available at Jo Ann fabrics and other fabric shops for about $15 a yard, and you need some

adhesive.    If you want some help let me know.    

Yesterday I started to drive my 2011 GMC P/U to the post office and discovered the outside drivers door handle was broken.   Did a Utube search and there was a great video.......pulled the door panel, removed the broken (factory plastic) handle and

went to Hewlett for a new one.......retail was $75, my cost was $56, and I could have ordered one online for $34......and the new part is the same design that broke.    So lets not complain too much about 25 year old Reattas that we must work on when my fairly new P/U has a pretty fragile design on the door handle.......another tip, if you lock yourself out of a similar P/U...break the door handle, unlock the car via the holes for the handle and it would be easier and cheaper than replacing a window.

[ChrisWhewell]

I hear ya Barney, I'm the same way.   But also, sometimes.... I've saved so much $$ by doing so much on my own, that I can afford to spend a little having a professional do something.  Like the time I tried putting window tint on a car....twice.... it ended up badly so I just hired the pro and got a guarantee.   Well, today I got the finial off the antenna, next is to rip into it and put that piece of cable you gave me in there.  What kind of solder should I use to attach the cable to the antenna ?

[Barney Eaton]

Because the top and "J" hook end are made of stainless,  silver solder works best.........I had no luck trying to tin/lead solder or brazing.

[ChrisWhewell]

33 minutes ago, Barney Eaton said:

 silver solder works best.........

 

Ok, I still have some of that from when I did my belt buckle, real silver solder, jeweler's grade from a little joint down on Burnet road.  Thanks again

[KDirk]

The headliner isn't too bad to do save for the needed disassembly of the interior required to remove and reinstall it. Need to pull the visors, overhead courtesy lamp, a pillar trims and rear upper quarter trim to do it. getting the old material off can be a nasty job as the cloth separates from the foam and leaves pieces of foam all over the fiberglass form.

 

I've actually used a blow torch to melt off the foam (being careful not to burn the fiberglass underneath) as it is not advisable to use abrasive action to remove 

it. Tends to gum up anyway as the foam breaks down with age and gets an almost tar like consistency to it.

 

Finding the correct material can be difficult, depending on the color you need. Some fabric stores sell it (and some can special order any available color). Also make sure you get good adhesive. 3M makes a headliner adhesive in a spray can, it is the best I've found so far. This biggest thing I have to stress is to be careful removing and handling the headliner. The fiberglass shell is very fragile and easy to damage if you bend it, especially at the corners. If you decide to have it done by a professional I can certainly understand, but it isn't all that tough to do, just time consuming.

 

 

[bikemikey]

I just thought I'd mention that when applying the new material to the core, use the palm of your hand to smooth out the material. Don't press down with your finger tips, I found this out the hard way. The core I was using was real soft and left indentations. When I was done it looked like the craters on the moon.   

[ChrisWhewell]

2 hours ago, KDirk said:

If you decide to have it done by a professional I can certainly understand, but it isn't all that tough to do, just time consuming.

 

 

Yes, I'll hire this job out, I'd probably end up with the craters on the moon look, per the last post above by bikemikey.    Maybe I can try to spray some electronics cleaner on the saggy portions so as to saturate them, then gently press them to the existing pad, under the theory the hexane in the electronic cleaner will re-soften the old adhesive enough to make it stick again.  woudln't that be funny if it worked ?   !!!!

 

[Digger914]

When the factory installed headliner falls, it's the foam between the fabric and the backer that gives up the ghost, not the glue. When that happens you can spray glue it till the fabric is soaked and it will keep on falling.

Almost easy to replace, hardest part is removing the 25 year old trim without breaking the retainer clips.

When you do get the thing out don't use solvent, pull the fabric free from the backer, scrape off as much of what's left and then smooth the surface with a rough scrubber / paint remover pad, they do make these for 3 inch power heads. Give it a good vacuum and wipe with a tack cloth, don't want to install a lump in the new headliner.

Spray the backer with 3M Super 77, give it a couple of good coats and lay on the new foam backed headliner. Start in the center and work your way to the edges smoothing as you go.

 

 

[KDirk]

The headliner form is pressed fiberglass. Essentially it has the same consistency as yellow fiberglass household insulation that would be installed in walls and ceilings but was compressed down to about 1/4" thickness in a high pressure stamping mold to give it it's shape and contours.

 

It is easily bent and torn by rough or careless handling during removal or recovering. The corners and area around the sun visor mounts is especially easy to damage. The back (upper) side of the form has numerous hook and loop (Velcro) type pads that hold it to mating fasteners on the underside of the roof panel. These are easily torn off during installation and then require very strong glue to reattach successfully to the fiberglass.

 

I suppose this material was chosen for its light weight versus a chipboard form (often used in more recent vehicles) but the trade-off is a lack of durability. Repairs can be done with a fiberglass mat and resin kit such as those used to repair boats or car bodies made of rigid fiberglass.

 

The material used to cover the form is a thin layer of color keyed material bonded to about 3/16" of closed cell foam. This foam breaks down over time and separates from the cloth layer. This causes the typical sagging problem. Spraying with solvent will not help as it is not the adhesive that failed but rather the bond between the fabric and the foam.

 

I should have added there are places online that offer headliner material by the yard (among other auto upholstery materials) and will typically be less costly than a retail fabric shop. If you are unsure of the color, some online stores sell a material sample chart for about $10. Helpful to have this (I do) if you have multiple cars and want to match the existing color correctly. On screen swatches are often difficult to nail down in terms of exact color match.

 

[KDirk]

I have assumed the headliner form was done as it was to reduce weight. Compare it to the form for the storage bins behind the seats which is hard (gel coat) fiberglass. It weighs...a lot. You did raise an interesting point though, regarding it's safety in an accident. I can see concern over its weight (collapsing onto occupants of vehicle) and potential breakage into dangerous chunks (causing injury) being considered.

 

As to inflammability, with all the other stuff to burn in a car (wiring insulation, plastics, synthetic upholstery foams and coverings and so forth)  I doubt there is much consideration given to the form for the headliner adding to the issue of toxic smoke. Pretty well have to figure you are in big trouble regardless, if you don't escape a burning vehicle in short order.