Steve_bigD Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 I am rebuilding the steering in my 1938 40-41 and am ready to remove the gearbox but can't see how to disconnect the steering column and tube from the box. There is no tube clamp like other cars. Does the gearbox have to be removed with the steering column attached? The column is 50" long and I don't have a lift so I wonder if it can be maneuvered out with the car raised only 18" or so.Thanks,Steve D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan at larescorp Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Yes the input shaft goes all the way up to the steering wheel so that is all part of the gearbox. Once you remove the steering wheel the column should have a snap ring or something along thse lines that hold the input shaft in the column. Once that is removed you should be able to pull the gearbox down and slide the input shaft out. Its not a fun job but its not impossible either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_bigD Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 Thanks for the info. I kind of thought that was the case but before I took the steering wheel, etc. off I thought I'd ask. Do you know if bearings and seals are available for this box if I need them?Steve D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danhar1960 Posted October 12, 2012 Share Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) Steve,I've pulled a few of these apart and generally speaking it's not the bearings you should be worrying about. The main problem is finding chunks of metal missing from the worm and/or the sector wheel. Also, as the sector shaft bushes (bushings) wear, the seal is more prone to leaking. The good news is that the seals are available from Bob's Auto Suspension/Steering for only a few bucks.Danny Edited October 12, 2012 by danhar1960 Fat fingers :) (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_bigD Posted October 16, 2012 Author Share Posted October 16, 2012 Thanks for all your helpful responses. I pulled the steering gearbox out this past weekend and took the box apart. The roller and worm seem in good shape but the roller shaft appears to be twisted in the spline area where the pitman arm attaches. (see attached photos) I think the shaft must have been damaged years ago but I can't imagine the force it would take to twist such a thick shaft and without the shaft or splines breaking or stripping.Can this shaft be repaired? If not are there any sources to obtain a replacement? I don't think the shaft can be reused as is since it must be weakened and could snap, and wouldn't the twist offset affect the steering geometry? Thanks for any help.Steve D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan at larescorp Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 The shaft is no good. I wouldnt recomend using it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danhar1960 Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 I wouldn't use it. I haven't seen a twisted sector shaft like that before. They're are usually just worn splines from being lose. Can't imagine the bang it took to do that and the fact that it didn't damage the worm and/or sector wheel in the process is surprising. New shafts have been known to turn up from time to time.Danny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan at larescorp Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Usually when you see a twist like that it is from a sudden hard impact to one of the tires. Something like a car smacking in to the front of it. Most of the time once they are that far twisted they just shear off. I have to ask how long have you been driving the car with the sector that way? It couldnt have happened while you were driving without you remembering getting hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_bigD Posted October 16, 2012 Author Share Posted October 16, 2012 I have had the car since 1978 and never opened the gearbox so it happened before I got the car. When I first got the car home and drove it around the neighborhood, besides overheating and smoking like a locomotive, the front tires would softly squeal going straight down the road and the tires feathered in a few miles. I found the left steering arm was bent about 2". I replaced the arm and re-adjusted the toe in, steering box backlash, and end play and it seemed decent except for maybe 4" of play in the steering wheel. Recently that has gotten worse and was the reason I decided to rebuild the steering. The tie rod ball joints seem fine so I guess the play is a combination of the steering box and the drag links. Now I wonder if the pitman arm is damaged in the spline area as well. The pitman arm nut was fairly loose and the arm came off with very little force which is not normal as usually you have to press it off. So together with the evidence of the bent steering rod it seems that the car was in an accident that perhaps impacted the wheel and bent the rod and the shaft. I did notice when I rebuilt the suspension that the left upper pivot pin was bent with about 1/2" play perhaps from the same impact. Here is a photo of the front suspension after removal of it and about 20 pounds of caked on road grime and grease.Dan from Lares, would you know if there are any of these shafts available? Could it be repaired?Thanks,Steve D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLYER15015 Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Steve,The only place for that shaft is on the mantle, next to your Saint Christopher statue.The spline is twisted right at the inner edge of wherethe pitman arm mounts, where the steel has exceeded it's elastic limit.Your only option is to replace it, and attend church regularly from now on........With your comments about the left steering arm being bent, you can bet she took a big hit (while turning left). Ask me how I know.Mike in Colorado Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan at larescorp Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 Steve give me a call. I am at work from 7am to 330 pm central time. 1-800-334-5749 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gmorse Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 I have been following this thread, and would like to know if anyone has done this removal on a '39 series40? Does the long shaft come out of the housing that holds the gear shift and switch? I have checked both the '38 and '39 shop manuals, and it does not seem to give a proceedure for removing the gear box for repairs. Any info would be appreciated.Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Grant Magrath Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 http://forums.aaca.org/f165/1939-steering-shaft-worm-gear-326653.htmlGary, we restored our steering box earlier in the year. Lift the front of the car up on axle stands. remove the pitman arm There are about 4 bolts holding the box to the frame, and the gear linkages, shifter, and obviously, the steering wheel have to come off. Remove the panel in the floor by the pedals. Now the fun part. Hopefully, you would have taped up your steering mast jacket to prevent scratches as you lower the steering box out from under the car. I hope I haven't forgotten too much! If the pics are dead in the thread I've posted, let me know, and I'll put some new ones up. The procedure is very similar on a 37 or 38, but minus the gear linkages.CheersGrant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gmorse Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Hello Grant, Thank you for the info, however the pictures did not come through. Sounds like you have a lot of experience with these steering gear boxes!Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Grant Magrath Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Yeah, I've pulled a few apart! Forgot to mention that it's a good idea to take pictures of your gear linkage setup to refer to when putting things back together.Here's the old gear....... And here's the one we had made....As you may have picked up, we had a huge amount of wear pretty much everywhere. Even the pitman arm was slogged out! We just worked through things until the only things that could cause problems were the worm and sector. Thanks to Danny, we got a NOS roller and pitman shaft, and we had the worm gear made. Ours is an early Series 40, so we can supply new worm gears for them. The ratio changed part way through the run, but I don't know when sorry.CheersGrant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gmorse Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Thanks for the photos, Grant. One question, though, you show the worm separated from the shaft in one of the photos. How is the shaft connected to the worm? Thanks again.Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Grant Magrath Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Gary, it's pressed on to a splined end, most likely using heat. The guys at the gear shop did it. Is yours an early or later production car?CheersGrant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gmorse Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 Thanks Grant. I have a late production car,it was built in April of '39. If I can figure how to do it, I will post a picture.Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1939_Buick Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) ...The ratio changed part way through the run, but I don't know when sorry..Thanks Grant. I have a late production car,it was built in April of '39. If I can figure how to do it, I will post a picture.1939 S40 & S60 Steering box changed at frame x3439464 [x--- 1=Flint, 2= Cal, 3=Linden]Never got to ask Dave C what month that was1942 shop manual is the best. 100 times better than the 1938 & 1939 shop manualsGary: email me a picture if you cannot upload. (go to "go advanced") Edited October 27, 2012 by 1939_buick (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gmorse Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 hello Grant,My '39 model 48 is serial number 33532904.the first 3 indicating Linden plant, and yes, it does have the full length frame. I have put 2 photos in the Gallery. Hope I did it correctly.Thanks again for all the info.Gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John's Buick Posted August 15, 2019 Share Posted August 15, 2019 How do I get the tube out of the box ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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