Dodge Brothers logo (Emblem) ???

[Guest brian j]

Hi Brian here. After having read quite a bit on the Dodge Brothers logo....prominent on all their vehicles.......i'm surprised that the mystery of their logo's meaning has never been solved. There's always been speculation, but no one has ever been able to quote a concrete answer. From my perspective, when i look at it, i don't see a senseless conglomeration of artwork with no meaning. The logo appears to have obvious symbolism. Start with the "DB". From what i gather they worked well together as machinists, and were able to accomplish their goals as a pair. There is a quote on the internet that says they refused to answer mail addressed to them individually, only as the "Dodge Brothers". They obviously believed they were at their best as an inseparable pair. And having their Father (who was a machinist) teach them their trade would implicate strong family ties. So it seems appropriate that the "DB" would be intertwined, showing their bond. Being entrepreneurs, and with their confidence in their abilities, having "put their eggs in one basket" with Ford(whom lesser men might not have been willing to take a chance on). They appeared to have a larger vision of their potential. Some automakers of the time would have only saw their market as North America only. But it seems obvious the "World" part of the symbol addresses their vision of a worldwide market for their cars. Being an owner of one of their cars, and having had a couple of Henry's cars of the same period at one time, it's obvious to me they were able to build a better car than many of their competitors. I'm thinking it's reasonable that, had they lived, they would have unseated him as the #1 producer at some point in the future. Of course one of the biggest speculations, is the intertwined triangles. They don't appear to me at all to have a relationship to Judiaism. They appear as 2 triangles, intertwined in the same manner as the "DB", on the emblem, which might necessitate they be different colors to make it more obvious that they are intertwined. What they MEAN is anyones guess. Assuming they ARE two triangles, one would have to ask.....what would a triangle represent to them individually, and intertwined together? I have heard the Freemason rumor, and would assume if they were, someone in the family, or a business associate would have knowledge of that. Or there would be records of the Mason's organization to show this. A triangle being three points, could be the relationship of their Father to them, as machinists. The intertwining of the triangles representing their "bond" together as one entity. Or it could symbolize 3 points of importance, only known to them. One theory of mine is, the machinist's of the day became organized in 1888. There were changes of names to these fraternal brotherhoods, but by the early 1900's there existed An International Association of Machinists, in which i once saw an old lapel pin with IAM in each corner of an equilateral triangle. These early associations were not so much as Unions per se, but were created to facilitate apprenticeships, and to correctly and uniformly guide apprenticeships, which were sometimes frought with problems at the turn of the century. They eventually became Unions, as working conditions changed with the industrialization of America They were not Masonic, but were organized in a way similar to the Freemason organization, complete with "secrets" of the trade, as were early Unions also. So MY theory is.......the intertwined triangles probably symbolized the same bond as brothers(DB), only as machinist's/manufacturers, in a non- Masonic, non organized labor capacity. (in which they MAY have had an association with the IAM.....which was an INTERNATIONAL organization.) Which also might explain the "world" symbol on their emblem. WOW, i slobbered a bib full there....... Am i totally off base on this or are my theories possible? Or did someone figure it out, and i'm the last fool to know? Regards.

[MikeC5]

It sounds quite plausible to me Brian. The only other thing I would add is that the triangle is thought of as the 'strongest' shape (from a structural point of view). Think of bridge trusses, etc. and so there might be some symbolism in the strength of the bond between them.

[dwollam]

It has also been said that the triangles are the Greek symbols for the letter D or Delta in Greek. Hence 2 intertwined "D's" for the 2 Dodge Brothers.

[keiser31]

Freemasons have a five pointed star.

[Guest brian j]

Hi. Mike and Dave, i think your ideas have great credibility. I like Mikes idea better than my own. It seems the most common sensical reality is that UNLESS they had WELL KNOWN affiliation with a religion, a Machinists fraternal organization, Freemasonry, or any other entity..... they would NOT include such a significant symbol in their logo.... That they would give the symbols of the logo a major significance to represent a new brand of automobile THEY created from the ground up, implies as with many other Brands of the day that the symbols represent things about themselves, as auto makers. Ford had his blue oval with a script of his name to give a solid Brand identification. The "Intertwined" triangles, and "intertwined" DB, i do not believe to be a coincedence, but part of an overall ideal. Consequently, i see the DB as Brand identification, with their idealism mixed in. The triangles then probably ALSO represent commentary about them also, with their idealism mixed in. One thing to note: many of the makers of the early cars had in some form placed "wings" on their logo, or hood ornaments/motometers. Common sensically one can see that going from the horse drawn carriage to the automobile would inspire the representation of "flying", which is what it must have felt like on that first ride in a car of the day. With that in mind i would tend to believe the Dodge Brother's motivations for their logo were less than mysterious or secretive. Regards.

[Guest Backyardmechanic]

Is it possible that the Brothers were tooling around with the thought of a emblem came up with the interlock DB then one said to the other "looks to plain" so the "glope" inter the picture Then one would say "Yeah" then to set off every thing The "triangles were added."Yeap"that's it."Lets have a beer"!

I have been ask how ROMAR got it's name.Well Bob longs and wife Martha was doing jst that (tooling around for a name for there new business) Mrs. Long chose Ro(Robert) mar(Martha) = ROMAR

vern

[MikeC5]

Ha ha yes! I especially like the "let's have a beer" part.

[Guest Backyardmechanic]

Well the Dodge Brthers were know to tip a few.

If there's no record of what the logo stands for.Why not

[MikeC5]

Or maybe they represent martini glasses?

[Guest brian j]

Yes i agree...... they were hard working men, who probably had little time to sit down together and come up with a logo, the odds of them brainstorming over a couple of beers is pretty high, i would think. No mystical stuff, just a couple of guys, who liked a cold one after a hard days work. Merry Christmas everyone!

[Steve Suttle]

I might add as the smallest of afterthoughts that the Mogen David - the six pointed star - although well known was not as universally used as a symbol of the Jewish religion as it is today. You do see it on older synagogues in New York's Lower Eastside even today, most of which were built c. 1890.

However, the menorah - the seven candle version not the nine candles used at Chanukah - was more commonly used to represent Judaism at the time DB was formed. Much like that the fish was the earliest symbol of Christianity, but gave way to the cross around the Third Century. Symbols do change with the times.

Today, after the infamous yellow star and the recognizable Israeli flag, the Star of David is universally associated with the religion and the country.

I think this is the most common question I'm asked when tooling about in my roadster. I don't think anyone would have even speculated on a Jewish association with this trademark in 1914.

I like the intertwined delta answer. In fact, it's the one I use when asked.

It's simpler.

[Guest TommyDodge]

If you read Charlie Hyde's book. The Dodge Brothers, The Men , The Motorcars, and The Company, It says in there that the white triangle always points up meaning light and the dark triangle always points down meaning night, and the delta star is mentioned as well. The Brothers did refuse to answer any mail not addressed to Dodge Brothers and the B in Brothers had to be capitalized. Where one was, the other was always nearby. The emblem has nothing at all to do with Judaism.

The mausoleum where the Dodge Brothers are, is quite unique, in that it has 2 Sphinxes, one on either side of the door and looking inside there is a stained glass window that shows the 3 pyramids at Giza.

The neatest thing is how they treated their employees. I wish more emplyers would do that today

Merry Christmas every one

[Guest brian j]

It's very interesting these anecdotes from the book. I asked myself the question, what interest would the pyramids of Giza be to an average person in the turn of the century? Of the ORIGINAL ancient Greek designated "Seven wonders of the(ancient) world". The Great Pyramid of Giza is the only one left standing. The others were destroyed over time in floods/earthquakes/fire,etc. I wonder if they were relating the Dodge Brothers car being able to stand the test of time(like the great Pyramid), "day or night". Food for thought.

[Guest brian j]

Or maybe, they figured the DB would be the only company "left standing" over time.