1937hd45 Posted November 22, 2001 Share Posted November 22, 2001 Was Cadillac the first to offer an automatic transmission in 1941? If not who was? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2001 Share Posted November 22, 2001 LI ~ In '38 Buick had some kind of automatic transmission that proved to be less than satisfactory, I believe. I think they were recalled, permanently.<P>Dynaflash, if you read this could you give us some input on that Buick transmission?<P>hvs<P>An after thought. Back in the good old days when Cadillac really was the "Standard of the World", they tried out their new developments on cars like Oldsmobile before they put them on on the Cadillac. Hence, hydramatic on the '40 Olds and then on the Cadillac in '41. If the idea proved to be no good, it never saw a Cadillac.<P>Today all of the new, wierd and cocamamie ideas are slapped on the Cadillac and how many do we know of that have bombed? Air suspension in the '50s and 4-6-8 engines to name two.<P>No wonder Cadillac is having trouble selling cars. Who knows what strange, new, unworkable gimmick will be on a new Cadillac. Best to wait 2 years and buy a used one after they discover what bombs.<P>But of course that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.<p>[ 11-22-2001: Message edited by: hvs ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2001 Share Posted November 22, 2001 Yes indeed Howard, it was called the "safety automatic" which debuted in '38, a semiauto similar to buick's offering which still required manual shifting between high and low ranges plus accelerator release upshift like fluid-drive, gyro-matic etc. Not a true automatic in the conventional sense, but an interesting technical stop-gap, remember Reo's "self shifter" in '32 or '33? same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 22, 2001 Share Posted November 22, 2001 I meant to add that Olds's version was called Safety automatic and ran concurrent with Buick who's engineers developed it years earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 23, 2001 Share Posted November 23, 2001 I believe hydra-matic was offered on the series 90 Olds in '40, the first truly automatic tranny,at least in the U.S. So-called "automatics" which were just semi-autos went back at least a decade, i.e. Reo, Daimler, Wilson preselector etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clincher Posted November 24, 2001 Share Posted November 24, 2001 The "Sturtevant" car, built by the Sturtevant Mill Company in Boston from 1905 to 1907 featured an automatic transmission consisting of centrifugal clutches for the forward speeds and a sliding gear for reverse. A more comprehensive description of "The Automatic Sturtevant" may be found in "The Standard Catalog of American Cars 1805 - 1942". The old brick building where these cars were made still stands in the Dorchester section of Boston, Mass., with the faded white-painted lettering "Sturtevant Mill Machine Company" on the side still readable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Huston Posted November 24, 2001 Share Posted November 24, 2001 Studebaker was also working on a automatic transmission in the late 1930's. In September of 1941 Studebaker started announcing the new "perfected Turbo-matic Drive" transmission. The transmission used a combination of automatic vacuum-operated clutch, fluid torque converter, and three-speed transmission with an automatic overdrive. Six Studebaker President models were assembled with this transmission durring the 1942 model run. It was reported that before the cars were sold they were converted back to standared overdrive transmissions and were either then sold or used as excutive cars. Not one of the Presidents survived with an automatic transmission. To bad, would be fun to test drive one of those units. The main reason given for Studebakers droping the automatic transmission is the start of WW2 and the end of auto production for the duration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 24, 2001 Share Posted November 24, 2001 C'mon guys, let's hear more about these early alternatives to the hated crashbox! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 1, 2001 Share Posted December 1, 2001 I thought that the 38 Olds had the Hydro-Matic. Is this correct? Anyhow GM must have gotten the bugs out of it as the Hydro was used in WWII tanks. Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Bond Posted December 2, 2001 Share Posted December 2, 2001 I guess it depends on how you define automatic transmission, but Im surprised nobody has mentioned the Model T yet - very simple, no gears to clash, just a couple of pedals. Once I get my 14 into hi, its good-to-go. Now if you are talking about a transmission that shifts all by itself, then thats a different ball-game. The ol "T" hasn't done that yet!<BR>Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 2, 2001 Share Posted December 2, 2001 Had an old "T" that really was self-shifting, vibrated so much that the hand brake which held the pedal in neutral would release itself on account of the worn quadrant teeth and shoot forward in high. Then again my ,'26 dodge had what I called a "shiftless transmission" as it would refuse at times to go into high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 3, 2001 Share Posted December 3, 2001 To my knowledge, the first true automatic, actually called Hydra-Matic was sold in the 1939 Oldsmobile. As the late Casey Stengel used to say "you can look it up."<BR>-----and that's from a Studebaker guy.<BR>Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 4, 2001 Share Posted December 4, 2001 Well, seems like deja-vu all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 4, 2001 Share Posted December 4, 2001 L I -<BR>Nope that was Yogi! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 4, 2001 Share Posted December 4, 2001 Thanks Ted, I stand erected,as Al Kelly said. <P>By the way, who's the one that said "parenthood is hereditary"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 8, 2001 Share Posted December 8, 2001 I believe that the late Irma Bombeck said that insanity is hereditary. You get it from your kids. Maybe that's what you're saying. Maybe not.<BR>Yes, Yogi said "deja vu all over again".<BR>Rog<BR>p.s.: what does this have to do with Hydra-matic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 9, 2001 Share Posted December 9, 2001 What does this have to do with hydra-matic? Why nothing of course, just some harmless lunacy with malice toward none. I recall the first hydra-matics did not have a park position, you put the lever in neutral and set the handbrake much like Chrysler's powerflite, anyone have experience with Packard's Ultramatic? how did it differ from a variable pitch vane unit like dynaflow or a conventional "stepped shift" one like the aforementioned hydra-matic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasBorchers Posted December 9, 2001 Share Posted December 9, 2001 In the standart catalog I can read this under 1940 Olds: Olds and GM engineers produced the first HydraMatic equipped cars this model year. Although certainly not the first automatic transmission, probably the best unit to this date.<BR>But: Who built the first?<P>Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 9, 2001 Share Posted December 9, 2001 Well Tom, here we are again with the question of how does one define an automatic. It is generally conceded that a true automatic performs all functions except choosing the shift lever position and as far as I know hydra-matic was the first PRODUCTION tranny to offer this, all others preceding this were semi-autos that reqiured some form of manual range selection and upshift control. This is the extent of my limited knowledge although I'm always eager to learn more about such an interesting and challenging subject. Carleton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 12, 2001 Share Posted December 12, 2001 hvs, I've been busy driving back and forth to Virginia and Florida between homes. Don't get here much anymore. <BR> If anybody wants to know the full story of the Buick semi-automatic transmission of 1938, go back and read my extensive article on the Buick Straight 8 in the March-April, 1971 issue of Antique Automobile. Of course Terry Dunham also covered this in his Buick History later. My research came directly from Charley Chayne, the Chief Engineer at Buick, who was still living in 1969 when I did the research.<BR> Later information by Terry Dunham revealed that a Reo engineer was onto the automatic transmission leading up to 1932 when, as I understand it, Reo did produce some. I can't remember his name, it was something like John Dolzol. Heck after 30 years I'm lucky to have even a glimmer.<BR> At GM, it was Oldsmobile engineering who came up with the first automatic transmission design, which was really a semi-automatic transmission. They wanted to produce it in the 1937-38 time-frame, but did not have the shop capacity. Buick did have the capacity. GM told Buick to build it for Olds. Harlow Curtice, President of Buick, wasn't given a choice in that, but made the decision if "Buick was going to build it, Buick was going to use it." It wasn't a great decision. As Charley Chayne (Buick Chief Engineer in the 30s and 40s)wrote to me, "it shifted like a student driver on their first day," because of Buick's tried and true torque tube drive. It was abandoned during the 1938 model year on Buick, and I guess on Oldsmobile as well, but I do not know that. By 1940 the Hydramatic was pefected to the point that it was introduced on Oldsmobile. Cadillac got it in 1941 and Pontiac in 1948. Buick and Chevrolet went their own way with the Buick Dynaflow in 1948 and Chevrolet PowerGlide in 1950. Buick upped their small engine from 248 to 263 ci in 1950 on the Super and 1951 on the Special and Super to carry the Dynaflow. Chevrolet upped their engine from 216 ci to 235 in 1950 for the same reason. Treatise finished <smile>. Have a Merry Christmas all and a Happy New Year.<p>[ 12-13-2001: Message edited by: DynaflashSouth ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 Thank you Mr. Dynaflash south for a most informative post about a pivotal subject, I really enjoyed reading it. Did'nt Buick engineers develop something in the early '30's called the "roller transmission"? A friend who just happens to own a '32 Reo with the "self shifter" claims that they are the same thing, perhaps you or someone can enlighten us. Carleton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 In all of my research in the late 1960s I did not hear of that. Send a private email at buickman@strato.net and I'll give you the email address of someone else who would definitely know if that is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 Is "Antique Automobile" available by subscription, or is it only for AACA members? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 Antique Automobile is available only to membership sofar as I know. Membership is $26 a year for you and your wife, or just you if you don't have a wife. Of course, if that is the case you could get married and give her a membership for a wedding present....and it wouldn't cost you anything, haha. Seriously, AACA is the oldest and largest club in the U.S. Most of what has come to be of the antique automobile hobby had its roots with AACA,formed in 1935. Come on and join. We would like to have you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2001 Share Posted December 13, 2001 Hey Earl, glad to see that you have stopped somewhere long enough to get back on here. Try to stay put now and then. We miss your input. ~ Howard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 I would like to join AACA. Please let me know the mailing address. Will I be assigned to a local chapter? If so, are there local dues as well? Does each local chapter have a newsletter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 pmen -<BR>Click here for AACA membership: <A HREF="http://www.aaca.org/membership/membership.htm" TARGET=_blank>http://www.aaca.org/membership/membership.htm</A> <P>It's your decision to join an AACA local region or chapter (or one of the national specialty regions).<P>Click here to view the list of AACA clubs: <A HREF="http://www.aaca.org/regions/index.htm" TARGET=_blank>http://www.aaca.org/regions/index.htm</A> <P>Many AACA members are also members or multiple local AACA clubs. Most regions/chapters have some form of newsletter, but not all. Your best bet is to join an active local AACA club and attend monthly meetings (if they have them) and events. Get to know people in the hobby.<P>Enjoy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 Ted: Thanks for the information. I sent my completed application & dues check to Hershey today. I looked at the list of regions, but didn't find any serving Kansas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 I don't know much about the early cars but didn't the Owen magnetic have a type of automatic transmission? Also wasn't there a car that used a variable belt drive similar to the the 50s DAF? Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 There are three Region's in Kansas.<BR>There is one in Arkansas City, one in Topeka and one in Lawrence. There are Regions in most states. We are still attempted to get one started in Nebraska, Utah, Montana, New Hampshire, Vermont, Arkansas, and Oregon.<P>As a matter of fact the one in Topeka is hosting a September, 2002 National Meet and a follow-on Central Divisional "Sentimental" Tour (this tour is limited to 1928-1958 vehicles) as all three of the "Sentimental" tours have/will be. There are no more tours of this type on tap for 2003. One was held in 2001 and two in 2002.<P>Howard (hvs) You and Judy have a great Christmas & New Year. Sure is nice and warm here in Florida, haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 I would like to know the date, place,& time for the Sentimental Tour in Topeka. Please relay this information if you know it. Otherwise, please let me know how to contact someone from the Topeka chapter (preferably an email address, but phone number or street address would be okay too). thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronbarn Posted December 14, 2001 Share Posted December 14, 2001 The Owens-Magnetic used the electric motor portion of the system as a transmission, however the driver had to select the drive range - thus not automatic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 15, 2001 Share Posted December 15, 2001 Earl, you know that making the Topeka tour a Sentimental Tour will prevent some of us out here in the West from including that tour in out trip east for the Reliability Tour.<P>Were it a regular Divisional Tour we could have made it part of our trip, but no cars eligible for the Reliability Tour will be eligible for the Topeka Tour. I suppose there will be plenty of cars without us, but it sure is a dissapointment. Glad I read this before making any more plans.<P>You know if you start turning too many Divisional Tours into Sentimental Tours you are going to kill the Divisional concept for many of us. I know this is your baby, but think about the rest of us tourists. Give us a break. ~ hvs<P>I am going to start a new thread seeking input from other tourists as to how they feel about this proliferation of "Sentimental Tours" and what is doing to the Divisional Tour concept. I for one don't like it one damned bit. <p>[ 12-14-2001: Message edited by: hvs ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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