Guest Merchant Xpress Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 This is the first of my posts regarding restoring my 29 DB pick up. I'm starting with the cooling system. I've sent the water pump off to be rebuilt and I've got the radiator off. It was a test to get the cowl off the radiator and I'll have to sandblast the cowl to get rid of the pitting on the cowl. If I can get it smooth I'm thinking of powder coating it rather than chrome plating it. There is a lot of rust inside of everything. I'll have the radiator cored and pressure tested, except for the rust it looks pretty good. I was surprised to find a thermostat on the head and it's stuck open, better than stuck closed I guess. Who makes a replacement thermostat? I've never seen one like this before. Since this engine is all iron, what should I put through it to get rid of the rust? I can close up outlets and let it soak for a few days then flush it I just don't know what to soak it with. I welcome any help or suggestions during this restoration. I think the wooden cab is going to be a real challenge. I also need a new front motor mount. So this is my beginning. I'll try to keep my posts current to what I'm doing and I hope I don't bore everyone with too many posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed_Joyce Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Merchant: 6 cylinder or 4 in your truck? Is the front part of your cab metal and then wood frame from doors back? I replaced all wood in our truck so I have some experience in this. Would be interested to see some pictures of your truck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nearchoclatetown Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 I was wondering too about it being a 4 or 6, Ed. I'm not sure I would put anything in the engine to eat the rust, it may eat rust in the wrong places. Try flushing with lots of water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Four cylinders guys, it's the Plymouth Silver Dome engine. The cowl is metal but back from there is wood. Much of which has had termites at some time and needs to be replaced. For some reason I can only find pictures I have taken from the back of the truck. I will take some pictures but remember the cowl, radiator and hood are off. It looks okay anyway. I'll try backflushing the engine with water and see if I can clear it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 The water pump is getting rebuilt, the guy at the shop says just a couple of days, no problem. The radiator is in the shop also,it is the first one this shop has done and they specialize in antiques. The found one small leak at the bottom and think they can fix it without too many problems, unless the bottom tank has to be pulled, it's curved and may present problems. I'll have to wait and see if the leak can be fixed with the tank on.Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Here are a couple of pics of my truck, don't laugh to hard. Also a pic of the front motor mount, does any one know of a source for these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 As you can see I need to replace the roof wooden slats and the door sills, not so obvious. The truck is straight and no rust. What is worse, termites or rust? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwollam Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 I LIKE IT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nearchoclatetown Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Me too. Merchant Express, take a look at Hershey '08 pics. You will MAYBE find a long wheel base red and black '29 DB truck similar to yours. It too has a Plymouth four cylinder engine. I can get you more pics or detail pics of it as it belongs to my neighbor. Yours sure looks pretty complete and in fairly good condition. PM or email me if I can help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nearchoclatetown Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 A few differances for sure that I see right now are his doors are differant. His do not have door glass or tops, handles are differant too. His gas tank is also under the seat. It came from the Stroudsburg Railroad, Pa. and was used as a tour bus, has seats that run lengthwise. His wheels are far differant from any I've seen too. They are wood spoke but much heavier in construction. Maybe Ed took a pic at Hershey of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted October 30, 2008 Share Posted October 30, 2008 It is a half ton Merchants Express pickup. I think they were only made for a couple of years. From what I have read the beds were made to order. The rails are pipe and the brackets holding the rails are wrought iron. The gas tank is under the back of the bed. My tail light lens was stolen by some guy who stopped to look at my truck one day. He kept me busy while his buddy stole the lens. Not sure where I'll get another one but I will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted October 30, 2008 Share Posted October 30, 2008 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: nearchoclatetown</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Me too. Merchant Express, take a look at Hershey '08 pics. You will MAYBE find a long wheel base red and black '29 DB truck similar to yours. It too has a Plymouth four cylinder engine. I can get you more pics or detail pics of it as it belongs to my neighbor. Yours sure looks pretty complete and in fairly good condition. PM or email me if I can help. </div></div>There is a great picture of a 28 Graham Bros canopy truck that is allot like my truck. Dodge Bros was making a screen side truck and the Merchants Express pickup that were duplicates of what they designed for Graham Bros. My truck is a California truck from what I can understand but I really don't know to much about it's history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 So, waiting for things to get done by other people makes me crazy. The radiator and water pump should be done this week. I sent my front motor mount off to Andy Berbaum in Mass. to remake. It doesn't seem many people keep a motor mount for a 29 Dodge sitting on their shelves, go figure. I'm thinking my cooling system is a no pressure system. I have a motometer for it and I will need to get another neck soldered onto the tank for it to work. I think I need to drop the oil pan to check the oil pump to see why I lost oil pressure originally. I guess this is stuff to do while I wait for parts to come home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed_Joyce Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Merchant: Here are a couple pictures of the 29 Dodge beefed up wheels that Choclatetown referred to in a previous post. Great looking truck with interesting history. Your project looks great. Many differences from our Graham that is only 1 year older. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Merchant Xpress...what tail lamp lens do you need? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: keiser31</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Merchant Xpress...what tail lamp lens do you need? </div></div>My truck has a single tail light/brake light on the left side. The lens had STOP on it and was embossed with DB. I would be happy just to get the STOP lens, I doubt if I will find the DB lens. The head light glass is common and I don't think I will have trouble replacing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ed_Joyce</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Merchant: Here are a couple pictures of the 29 Dodge beefed up wheels that Choclatetown referred to in a previous post. Great looking truck with interesting history. Your project looks great. Many differences from our Graham that is only 1 year older. </div></div>Ed, did you see the pictures of the Blue Graham Bros 1/2 ton in the Hershey pictures? That is much closer to how my truck looks. At least in that one picture. My friend had a 30 1 1/2 ton DB truck and it was greatly different than my truck. It seems the merchant express truck was a special little truck unlike anything else Dodge Bros were making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 And now a question from the blissfully ignorant. When starting these old gals do I retard the spark or advance the spark? Which direction should the arm on the distributor go? Towards the front or to the back? Doing it correctly will help the car start easier with the electric and keep me from breaking my arm with the hand crank. Something I knew forty some years ago but right now I no longer know. I am a strong believer is acknowledging my lack of knowledge and learning from others than the harsh teacher bad experience. Thanks to all who are willing to share what they know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 2, 2008 Share Posted November 2, 2008 Well, after writing my last question I did a little internet research and came up with the answer to my own question. Will the wonders of the computer never cease? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nearchoclatetown Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Thank you Ed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest elmo39 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 for a tail light lens you could try this guy he is in Australia but i have heard he does very good reproductions. i am not sure if he does the 29 dodge one but a freind of mine got a 1930 chrysler lens fom him. his email is georglaurie@bigpond.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: elmo39</div><div class="ubbcode-body">for a tail light lens you could try this guy he is in Australia but i have heard he does very good reproductions. i am not sure if he does the 29 dodge one but a freind of mine got a 1930 chrysler lens fom him. his email is georglaurie@bigpond.com </div></div>Thank you, I'll write him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed_Joyce Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Merchant: Since we were at Hershey this year in our blue Graham Bros. Canopy Express and I didn't see anything else like ours I guess you are talking about our truck. I can't seem to find pictures you talk about but if you know the site or link I would be interested. We purchased our truck from the grandson's of the original owner and 2 of the grandson's were at Hershey to see us drive in and we met after we parked. Also a grandaughter and her son and husband stopped by later in the day. It was neat to get a fourth generation family member picture with the truck. We have alot of documentation and information about our truck if any of that helps. Attached is a picture of us at Hershey and another picture of Joe Cioppa's 1930 truck from Pgh. PA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Ed, that could be it, I can't remember where I found the pictures of all the Hershey cars. I'll try to find it again. The picture showed the truck quartering from the right front I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 I got my water pump back today. It had to be rebuilt from the ground up. Not cheap but I actually paid more to have a common tractor pump rebuilt so the guys treated me pretty fairly. I should get the radiator back this week and then start doing wood work while I'm waiting for the front motor mount to get home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 I was surprised to find the thermostat still operational. I thought because it was partially open it was broke until I realized it had to be partially open to work properly in a no pressure system. I put it in a pan of water and heated it up to find it still opened wider and closed to it's original position when the water cooled. I also found the reason the engine has been dragging is the front pulley was rubbing on the cross member from the motor mount collapsing. With the front of the engine jacked up the engine turns freely. I set up a temporary gas system and fired it up and it started right up. Next I need to drop the oil pan to check the oil pump, in the short time the engine ran the oil pressure didn't come up. That is my next big worry. I hope the pan gasket isn't gone as I can't seem to find any parts or gaskets for this engine. The Plymouth four must not have been manufactured very long as no one seems to have anything for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted November 10, 2008 Share Posted November 10, 2008 Try EGGE Machine for early 4 cylinder gaskets. They are in Santa Fe Springs, California and they have a website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 I finally got my radiator back today and put it on temporarily while I'm working on the truck. I'm trying to get my moto meter repaired so I can put it on the truck. It's maxed out and needs another thermometer put in it. Still looking for someone who repairs them. I'm going to get a sheet of cork so I can drop the oil pan. Maybe the pick up screen on the oil pump is plugged and keeping the engine from building oil pressure. the engine runs though and sounds good for the short time I ran it.Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nearchoclatetown Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 Check the pressure relief plunger too, it may be siezed from sitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 13, 2008 Share Posted November 13, 2008 good idea, I would have forgotten that. I'm looking for a manual for this engine. I'm thinking the oil pump is up by the distributer but there is also a vacuum/oil pump on the side of the block that pulls the vacuum for the fuel vacuum tank.Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 Okay, I dropped the oil pan today, not too bad for an 80 year old engine. A little sludge in the pan but not as much as I would have expected. The oil pan is triple chambered with the oil pick up screen in the center section. I think the idea of a triple chamber is not letting the oil slosh past the pickup tube. The screen wasn't dirty so at least I know the pickup wasn't plugged.So now I have to figure out why the oil pump isn't pumping oil. There should be a pressure plug somewhere that has a spring behind it. My problem could be as simple as the pressure plug is stuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 Is there a dome-shaped protrusion on the driver's side of the engine block just behind the oil filler tube? If so, I believe the pressure relief valve is in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 Keiser 31, there is a large dome shaped nut sticking out the side of the engine.I thought it was some kind of a crank case vent. You are a genius my friend if the pressure relief valve is under that. I almost want to go out in the dark and pull it off to see if it is stuck. I'd better wait until tomorrow though so I don't lose anything in the dark. Thank You Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 Thanks for the compliment. Just trying to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 I have the relief valve out, it clicked when I first turned the cover nut so it may have been stuck, lots of carbonized oil on it so I'm giving it a good cleaning. There appeared to be a leather or some kind of fiber disk in the seal unit that has deteriorated into little chunks. I don't think it's rubber. I'm not sure of it's function unless it is to seal the bottom of the plunger at the relief holes to the engine side, not at the spring side. If I can get this clean enough I may find some parts numbers on the valve, not that the will be a lot of help, who knows though the local parts store may have one on the shelf. I wonder if the disk restricted how much oil got past the plunger at the relief holes?Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nearchoclatetown Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 It was probably bypassing too much pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 I think so also but I don't know how thick the disk should be so that it lets enough oil past but not so much that the relief valve doesn't let it build oil pressure. I'm wondering if the failure of the disk is why I suddenly lost oil pressure? I keep calling it a disk but it could also have been a leather washer with a hole in the center that let oil get past.Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 I just removed the pressure relief valve from a spare '31 Dodge engine block and no leather anything came out with it. There should not be anything in there like that. Are you certain that it isn't simply compacted crud? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Keiser31, that is the conclusion I came to. Even though it looked like little bits of leather I think I was just crud trapped in the plunger. I put it back in and will start the engine to see if the oil pressure has returned. I did hear a click like the plunger moved when I took the cap off so the plunger may have been stuck. I cleaned all the oil residual off everything and that should help. Still waiting for my motor mount to come home so I don't want to do too much until the engine is secure.Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Merchant Xpress Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Well what is wrong with the materials of yesteryear? After only eighty years the rubber in the brake lines has decided to fail. I filled the brake fluid can the other day and it all leaked out, all over my wheels. I guess I'll pull all the lines off and take them to work and make new ones. It sure does come in handy to be able to make hydraulic hoses at work.Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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