edinmass
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Posts posted by edinmass
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A magnitic drill press works great in these situations. Keeps everything square. The nightmare situation that Matt ended up dealing with is all too common. At a certain point, pulling the block becomes your only option. Problem with pulling the block is now you may end up doing the crank and main bearings.......adding ten grand and 18 months to the project. It's always hard to tell when the perfect time to stop is.............good enough is never good enough. But the reality of time, money, aggravation, and life in general can make people do the repair in a certain fashion........which I understand 100 percent. Short term these asinine projects get you down, drive you crazy, and make you want to light the car on fire. After forty years of it........I'm numb to it all. I just keep pushing forward. When pushing forward in the face of these bleak projects becomes routine and you don't even notice it? That's when you know you have gasoline in your veins.
Friday night I drilled and used a timesert in two critical holes on my 1917 White. It was get them perfect, or tear down the entire motor and do an overhaul. It took me 10 days to screw my head on straight, and not be too tired, aggravated, and pissed off to make the attempt. It came out fine. None of this stuff is easy, if it were, everyone would do it. The only thing that is a necessity to restore a car, is insanity
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The true indication of a cars provenance and desirability is simple...............look at the past owners and who restored it. It tells the entire tale. Recently at dinner, someone was talking about a well known collection in the states. He asked me if I had seen it, and my thoughts. I replied, since thirty percent or more are modified coachwork, modified chassis, and restored like circus wagons......I declined to visit the collection. He was shocked at my response.......and clearly didn't "understand or get it". Once you touch a dirty car......you are forever tainted. I won't even work on one.............
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Fantastic work can only be done by a select few.............most cars coming out of a restoration shop need 100 hours or more of sorting. Good restoration shops are as rare as the cars they restore. Fantastic restoration shops are so busy they interview the client and the car before they decide to take on the project. True craftsmanship is time and passion..........not money. Money is just the thing that secures perfection. And, by the way, no car is perfect. "We pursue perfection in the attempt to achieve excellence." Vince Lombardi.
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1 hour ago, alsancle said:
I'm surprised by the Pebble invite. Definitely frowned upon by the top shows.
EXHIBITED............probably filling in a last minute opening on the field.........today, they wouldn't use it as a filler. Especially since there are real examples available. Notice what auction is listing it? Even the big boys won't touch it.
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I noticed the cars advertised in the HCCA. I’ll try and find a few photos of the Pierce.
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Update: Back on the road today!
You did get to the party late.......too bad. I’m amazed at the White truck guys and their knowledge. Ultimately we needed to address the entire car and all its mechanical parts. The right rear wheel hub and axel had been hacked at by a tractor mechanic back in the 20’s. The car was parked in early 1928 and was only briefly run in 1939-1940. Then it sat again till August of 2020. We decided to pull the driver side apart since there was no damage that could be seen, and it had a axel seal leak covering the brake drum .........it comes apart in an interesting way.........it was new to me. Not complicated, and fortunately we have the shop manual and we could see clearly how to take it apart. The wheel bearing was bad on the driver side. We went through everything on that side, and then pulled apart the passenger side. That bearing was bad also. It’s all back together as of today. We got distracted by a JN Duesenberg, and two V-16 Cadillacs that needed our attention. Today we also reinstalled the broken snubber, reset the rims to the wheels, installed the water pump for the final time, made one last clutch adjustment, and replaced modern hardware with period correct stuff. After sitting for two months, she fired right up. Ran well, and we took her for a spin, made some roadside adjustments as the brakes were too tight. I can announce the car is 100 percent done as far as recommissioning and sorting go. Had a major early car collector stop by this week, offered some additional advice......which I am going to follow. The car will be on the AACA Florida tour in two weeks! We will still be making small adjustments but we believe when have crossed the bridge and now are at the sweet spot. We did a back of the envelope calculation on the fair market value of the repairs, service, and maintenance we did. Figuring a hourly rate of 125 dollars.........parts, labor, machining, outside suppliers and services, the total spent on the cat to date is.........drum roll...............72,000 dollars. That does not include the purchase price, and also, Phil and I are very experienced in pre war stuff and I seriously doubt anyone could have been more efficient with their time and resources. We have a few small items on our lunch list. We don’t plan on installing the engine pans till after the tour in the event they are in the way of any possible adjustments/issues that pop up. Took a thirty year Pierce Arrow owner for a speed run at lunch today. He was blown away with the cars speed. It’s very happy and in its sweet spot at 47-48 mph. More than that, and the platform starts talking to you. As you approach 70 things are happening faster than you want to imagine......it’s safe......but a huge handful at that speed. In the era road tests had the car going 80 mph. I’ll never see it with mine. I’m quite content to keep it under 60 at all times. I will post a few more updates in the next week or so, as well as the tour.........as it happens. Maybe do some live video. More to come........Ed.
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Matt.........I don’t think I would be happy with that repair either. Hard to say what the best avenue is without actually seeing it in person. Maybe a stitch repair would be an option. Just what you wanted to hear. The try it without the engine installed is the way to go. I would probably test it to 15 pounds over the called for regular torque. If it holds there, then I think it may be a gamble you can try...........but I’m guessing another R&R will bum you out. I think a certain fix even if it causes a delay is best. Maybe a few other eyes would be helpful.
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Interesting fact, I had two people contact me about buying an early 30’s pre war big car from this site in the last year. John was one of them. In the last two weeks, both bought a club sedan.....John and his Packard, and the other friend a 1932 Pierce club sedan. Fun and strange coincidence. I’m certain both gentlemen will be happy with their purchase.
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AND THE ANSWER IS............BAD COIL, AND IT'S NEW!
I STILL HAVE NOT CHECKED THE DISTRIBUTOR OR CARBURETOR....MORE TO COME.
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5 hours ago, 1935Packard said:
Well done! And welcome to the Packard family.
Well........we ALL make mistakes........don't we? 🤔 No worries......still time for him to get a Pierce!😝
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Looks very nice. I haven’t driven a 733. It sure looks like you purchased a very presentable and drivable car. Take you time. Don’t be in a hurry. Fluids, lubrication, safety inspection, ect. Start with very short trips, and work your way up to sorting it to its optimal performance. Try and get a written history from the past owner ASAP.........photos, paperwork, Ext. History gets lost and forgotten quickly. Looking forward to more pictures and your learning curve on your first early 30’s Classic. When we meet in person, I’ll show you the secret handshake now that you have a car that qualifies as “heavy iron”. 👍
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Keep it out of the sun. Nothing will help as far as chemicals go. How is it running? Is the water issue solved?
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3 hours ago, alsancle said:
The list is open to debate but this car would be considered a factory SJ by anybody that matters.
It's a very good car, and a category one ACD vehicle........I would consider it a factory blower. Model J's are hot as they can be right now..........I would think that the car will brings a very respectable price.
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On 4/7/2021 at 10:02 AM, John_S_in_Penna said:
One of our local members, who is a Past President
of the AACA, says when he first joined around 1972,
his 1940 Pontiac was disparaged by someone as just
a used car. It almost turned him away, but he persevered.
Almost all members are supportive, so never let a few
opinions sully your show! We all have our favorites. But
for someone to like only pre-1942 cars--criticizing anything
less than 70 years old--is absurd. When the AACA was
founded in 1935, would such people disparage ANY old car
and like only horses born before 1865?!
In 1979 I attempted to join the Pierce Arrow Society. An "old jerk" at the table pushed me away and blew me off. It was 6 years later before I attempted to join again. He was still there a decade later. I spoke to the club officers, and they finally dumped him. I bet he turned off five hundred people over the years. I went on to become a prolfic owner and manufacturer of Pierce cars and parts. Instead of being a 42 year member, I'm a 36 year member. Your "front man" need to be a people person, not an old miseriable grease monkey. Later on he mellowed, and I became friends with him, though I never brought up the subject.
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On 4/8/2021 at 6:15 AM, alsancle said:
Probably any other car and that snap ring would have never been put to the test like it was on that Duesenberg. The problem with a Duesenberg is that it will end up on the Duesenberg tour and get pushed hard. Are you sure that was a new ring, or a rechromed old ring?
New rim, new ring, new spokes, factory hub.
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Interesting....my 1914 Caddy didn't have a pop off valve from the factory. I didn't know the 20's cars had them. With their propensity to burn, a non powder fire extinguisher should be used, as the powder will ruin paint, damage a running engine, and make a mess that takes months to clean up. Having a good BRASS float is important....the cork units suck...........
PS - Sunnyjay.........looks like a very nice car.
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Having a “show car” makes it ten times harder. Barn finds and forty year old restorations don’t show scratches and dings. New fresh paint on wheels that then need snap rings installed are true nightmares. Then having a ring snap or crack when the truck picking up the car is only a few hours out adds to the entertainment just before Pebble.. Snap ring and wheel failure has occurred on the last four tours I have been on. Not only old wheels.......entirely new wheels are suffering failures today. 2/3 of the problems is workmanship and lack of experience.
These are new wheels, snap rings, and spokes. Less than two hundred miles to failure.
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Just something for thought..............
Virtually every tire guy working on a split ring, snap ring, clincher, ect...........has ABSOLUTELY NO CLUE about antique cars, has no clue about metal fatigue, has no clue on difficulty in replacement parts, ect. I can think of four or five shops that I would trust with my wheels. Today, I was doing tire work on my GMC crew cab tow vehicle. Last “good” shop that worked in it for me, that came with great recommendations........damaged my wheels, installed them incorrectly, over tightened the lugs, and didn’t properly apply never seize as I requested. I only spent 3k with them doing tires and some basic maintenance. I’m done with every shop I come across now.......I just do my own work. At least it’s done right, and I don’t have any middle of the night nightmares.....or a daytime driving disaster because 99 percent of all wheel and rim people today are fifth grade drop outs.........no craftsmanship, no pride in work, just shoddy service......and is it time to get high yet?
it’s worth fifty dollars per tire minimum to do snap ring wheels............just from the labor standpoint. Then another fifty to cover liability issues. Simply put.......,you can’t pay enough money to most shops to justify the labor, exposure to damage to the rim, paint, or tire. Then the nightmare scenario of a failure of some tire/rim/tube and a resultant loss of life? You got to be nuts to service early car wheels today.
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Caution........do not drive the car with this condition. You should carry three Halon fire extinguishers when driving this car because of their propensity to burn to the ground.......and take your garage and house with it.
You should install a pressure pop off valve, limiting tank pressure and helping to vent over aggressive air pumps. I also recommend an in line electric cut off switch with a impact sensor to shut the fuel off to the carburetor even if you still have pressure in the tank. A sunk float, or over pressurized system is a disaster waiting to happen on these cars. They burn ........a lot. And yes, I have owned countless early Cadillacs.
also, in the event of a fire, remember to open the gas cap BEFORE you attempt to put the fire out, or it will be almost impossible to smother the fire with a pressurized fuel leak. If you need help with what I am explaining, PM me with your contact info. You have a fun car, but it has several bad habits that need to be attended to. Properly addressed, it’s a fun and safe car. Ed
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A year or two.......for the chassis. Hell, I expect my ride before the end of this year! Pick up the pace........after reading all these pages it’s time for you to start giving rides in your car! 👍
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A rubber supply house can provide material of the right durometer to machine and press the sleeve in. The felt seal is probably something you will have to make up. On Pierce covers, we remove the internal plate, spin up a ring on the lathe, weld it in, and run a modern seal. Over the years we did so many, we started to sell them exchange with a new seal and ready to paint.
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I like the page.......
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Try these........
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Classics with bodies not original to their chassis
in CCCA - General
Posted · Edited by edinmass (see edit history)
Interesting fact.......if the cars from that collection ever go to auction...........it won’t be one of the “big” auction houses........just too many cars with bad stories. Also, even the few good cars are now tainted. Too cheap to buy good stuff, and too cheap to fix and maintain them properly. He had unlimited money, and just had to have more bling and iron. To say there was no curation is an understatement.