wayne sheldon
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Posts posted by wayne sheldon
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Wow, somebody really had to work at blowing up a transmission like that!
And please, do not consider replacing any of the drivetrain with something newer. That car is way to nice to be ruined that way.
Sadly, way to much of old rusty iron was shipped off on the one way trip to China without anyone considering that some of it was actually valuable in a historic sense as spare parts to keep our history alive and active.
History is important! And things like antique automobiles help to connect people to their history.
While they are not as plentiful as they were thirty years ago, Chrysler built lot of that series automobiles. A lot of them survive still, and there should still be a lot of decent extra transmissions out there to be had. Not like the 1927 Paige 6-45 sedan my dad bought to be restored as the "great family project" in 1967 when I was fifteen. The original owner of that car managed to blow the cluster gear twenty years earlier. And it wasn't anywhere near that bad! For the Paige? It took me 25 years to find a correct replacement! You should be able to get a replacement for that within a couple months.
And, "Welcome to the affliction" as we sometimes say!
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13 hours ago, edinmass said:
I never do selfies with famous people as I feel it’s poor taste.
I generally agree with you here. However, one of my longest time best friends has one of the best "selfies" ever of himself and Jay Leno! It has a good story behind it.
"My friend" worked most of his adult life as you do, somewhat managing a private collection. In addition to the one collection he worked for for many years, he consulted for several major collectors on purchases and restorations. He was a master painter and great detailer of older restorations making them sharper than they had ever been. He managed several full restorations for a few collectors, several of his cars being shown at Pebble Beach. He was also, a darn good early automobile mechanic.
So quite a few years ago, he was in Monterey, doing his thing with several collectors, helping with the showing of a couple cars, drove one on the preshow tour. That same week of course was the Laguna Seca Historic Car Races (which a few friends sometimes participate in!).
For those not familiar with them, there are a lot of cars from the early days through prewar and post war eras. Practice runs are needed, numerous vehicle classes racing against like cars, and limited track time and space. The whole thing is very well organized and runs on a very tight schedule!
A friend, well known to many was there with an incredible prewar (1910s!) racing car! (A Fiat if I recall correctly?) As luck would have it, about an hour before his scheduled track time, something in the valve train broke! My friend was wandering around chatting with the many people he knows, looking at all the cars in the parking area and the pits, when a few mutual friends go running to him calling his name "You gotta come over (so-n-so) broke down!" Turns out, my friend had recently repaired a similar engine a few months before, and therefore had an idea how to fix it. Some bits and pieces were quickly scrounged up (as I recall, a valve spring had to be made to fit well enough to work?). The clock is ticking away, he is working feverishly trying to fit in an incorrect valve spring that doesn't quite fit, and make adjustments to the mechanism.
"Hey! You gotta stand up and turn around!"
"I can't stand up and turn around, I almost have this spring in place!"
"No, you gotta stand up and turn around!"
"No! I have to get this push rod lined up!"
"STAND UP and TURN AROUND!"
"Cussing"
Cameras click.
Long story short. He got the car running in time, and it completed the runs to the enjoyment of thousands (?) of people watching!
And shortly after, the questions began. "Did you get to talk to Jay Leno?"
"No, was he here?"
"He was standing right next to you!"
"Well, I didn't see him"
About a week later, his boss handed him a small package. "Jay sent this for you!" It was a framed closeup photo of my friend and Jay side by side with the open hood of the race car behind them!
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nz, Most United States automobile manufacturers brought out the next years model somewhere around September or October most years. In the beginning, part of that was trying to beat the winter months and make sales on the idea of having the new model before springtime. Due to the seasons and the condition of most roads here during winter, many people put their cars to bed for the duration. The idea was that when springtime arrived, one could awaken the car and be seen from the start in a shiny new model! A few manufacturers, including Studebaker, had a habit of sometimes bringing models out even earlier. Studebaker for many years made running changes during production rather than waiting for the model year change to bring them out all at once.
In addition to that, 1915 was a difficult year with the war starting in Europe. Although the USA was not immediately in the war, automobile manufacturers were being hit with material shortages. They also feared the USA may enter the war sooner rather than later, and that all automobile production might be stopped. For that reason, they were trying to make as many sales as they could before the unknown happened. So a lot of manufacturers including Reo and Hudson also brought out 1916 models extra early.
As it turned out, domestic production did continue, however, there were some cutbacks on production imposed. And most automobile manufacturers did quite well with wartime production before and during the USA's official involvement. At least until the postwar recession hit about 1921, which killed most small producers of automobiles.
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16 hours ago, 58L-Y8 said:
I believe that the lack of a splash apron below the radiator and the slight offset between the hood and cowl makes this a 1915 EC6 model. The EC6 and SD4 Studebakers still had the cowl gasoline tank, but the filler was moved to the dash panel were it remained through the later 1915/'16 model ED6 and SF4 series 16 cars. Their year model designations were pretty screwed up through those years. The "true" 1915s were produced from about August of 1914 through about May of 1915. The so-called 1916 model (officially renamed the series 16!) was only produced from about June of 1915 through most of December of 1915, whereas the series 17 began production late in December of 1915. No so-called 1916 Studebakers were actually manufactured during calendar year 1916. All models built most of that year (1916) were called series 17s, with series 18s being built at the end of calendar 1916.
It was the series 17s that first had the splash apron below the radiator, and the gasoline tank moved to the rear of the chassis and fed to the carburetor by a Stewart vacuum tank.
Calendar year 1915 was split between two distinctly different models series, each with a production run of considerably less than twelve months.
Small wonder that the HCCA fought for nearly thirty years over where to draw the line on Studebakers. (Current rules are fine, or as fine as they really can be.)
That is a great photo of a wonderful car!
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That "tree" may be one of the most famous and most recognizable photo-ops in the world! However, from what I have read it has been basically dead for nearly a hundred years already. It, for over a hundred years, makes a great backdrop for photos of people, whether in cars or carriages on foot or bicycles, one of the best known "we were here" shots anywhere!
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I will second Erik Barrett! I have been fortunate to know him for quite a few years, and have known many of his happy customers. I often buy parts from him, and he would be my first choice for any machine work I had to have done.
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Thank you Walt for the tribute to one of the truly great ones of our hobby!
History is important. It is how we got where we are, it is what we are. We cannot really know ourselves unless we understand what brought us to here.
All the great early collectors that preserved so many of the best and rarest early automobiles for us to continue enjoy today should be remembered along with the cars they saved from total obscurity.
Happy birthday Henry!
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Dodge very famously had twelve volt electrics in the early 1920s. I think they began that way in the mid 1910s. If I recall correctly, they switched to six volt around 1927ish (maybe 1928?).
There were quite a few other cars of the 1910s and 1920s that used twelve volt systems. Many years ago, I saw a list of them. I wish I had a copy of it to share.
Since I have never owned one, I rarely ever check out the Dodge Brothers forum below. However, a quick look there shows quite a bit of activity there over the earlier four cylinder Dodge years. I second the motion that you should post your question there as well as here. Probably a better chance of getting an informed response instead of someone like me that has never really worked on an early Dodge.
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It is always tough being "the new kid". Whether one is in middle school, or collecting well earned social security? Trying to get that "feel" for how things are can be very difficult. Some people handle that sort of stress better than do others.
Pure speculation here. The OP may be a bit paranoid. Fearing that a bunch of us are lurking in the shadows, waiting for a clue, to swoop in and beat him out of the deal of the year!
While there are quite a few people here that routinely buy and sell cars? Most of us here don't play in those puddles. Most of us don't have enough cash on hand to simply jump on something that happens by. Most of the regulars here are too decent to jump quickly and beat out someone asking basic questions. And the truth is, there are flippers reading these pages, that might jump on something if an opportunity did present itself.
And quite frankly, most of the collectors here that have that kind of money? They have so many opportunities to buy better cars, in better condition, or far more desirable, that a cousin of a Rolls Royce or not, they aren't going to give this car a second look!
The OP has been given some good advice. He should consider it and decide if he is ready to commit to something that could in fact be worth much less than he may think it is? Or be more forthcoming with details that will affect the real value and so to make a more informed decision.
I have never had the kind of money to be able to play with cars quite like this. I don't know what this car is really worth in today's market. I do know that cars with too many unknown factors are becoming much harder to find buyers for. Certainly, it is worth considerably more than scrap value. However, maybe not so much as one might expect. It certainly has historic value, and is nice enough to likely be desirable to a hobby restorer. It may already be at that point where the cost of a professional restoration would exceed the cars sellable value when finished.
It should go to someone with the desire and at least some means to restore this treasure to the road where it belongs.
Whether the OP is that person of not? Only he can decide. If he decides he isn't the one to restore it? He can risk a low offer to flip it and hope? (I have seen dozens of flippers lose their proverbial shirts because they didn't understand the markets they were playing with!) Or he may be choose to be a nice guy and try to facilitate a sale to help out someone he knows? That could be done through these forums.
The truth is, that "collector cars" are a calling! A person "feels them" in their heart and their soul. It is something that cannot really be explained. Whether most people "get it" or not, HISTORY is very important to everybody on the planet! It is where we came from, it is what we are! Our antique automobiles are "touchstones" that help us connect to our pasts.
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As said, the bottom part, the oil (kerosene) bowl and burner are missing. The important detail on this lamp is the chimney! What amounts to the top portion of the lamp. The bottom of the chimney has holes punched all around the base of the chimney. That detail was only used from the early 1915 brass trimmed lamps into the late 1915 steel trimmed lamps and continued through 1916 and at least much of 1917 when those holes were deleted from the design. All such lamps from 1917 till the end of model T production had chimneys without those holes.
Because the lens bezel (rim) and the top cap (actually a screw that holds the chimney on and can be removed for cleaning) are steel, the lamp would be considered a late 1915, 1916, or early 1917.
A detail you do not show is the shape of the reflector inside the lamp. Early versions (1915 through 1917ish, but maybe as late as 1919 on some lamps?) had "round" shaped reflectors inside, sometimes referred to as "diving bell helmets" because of their appearance when removed from the lamp. The much more common later sidelamps had cube-like shaped reflectors inside. The main body of the lamps were so much alike, that the reflectors and the chimneys as well as nearly all pieces from early to late can interchange, so it is not uncommon at all to find mixes of early and late details on lamps.
Part of the problem, and the history, of these lamps is that they were manufactured to Ford's exacting designs by several companies. Parts across the years and the manufacturers generally are interchangeable! While they will fit and work, I can tell you from experience that they do not always fit well. Most of the pieces are not marked or identified as to manufacturer (the top/cap and the burners were about the only sidelamp pieces ever marked with a manufacturer's name, and most of those were not). Trying to make several good lamps from a pile of bad lamps and pieces can get interesting when trying to fit them together. One set of lamps I put together, I ended up not using the nicest main body I had because the fit of various pieces just wasn't right enough (it would have looked and worked just fine, but I would have never been happy with the way the chimney and bezel didn't set together just right). Another fairly nice main body, all those pieces fit perfectly.
The number of rivets used on the bezel's (lens rim) hinge and the thumb tab varies, with no apparent consistency. It does not appear to be about when the lamp was made (earlier versus later?) so much as who made it as well as when. Ford was building automobiles faster than anyone had ever done before! The many companies manufacturing parts for Ford were struggling to keep up with the demands. Sometimes they cut corners (one or no rivets instead of two?) in order to get parts finished and shipped out.
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Really interesting! I have never seen anything like it. However I really like having and driving cars that used the Stewart vacuum tank. They are a wonderful piece of automotive history that solved fuel tank location problems for many years until materials technology eventually made the mechanical diaphragm fuel pump practical and reliable.
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4 hours ago, lump said:
Yet I am haunted by the memory of a post or two I read on AACA forums a year ago or so, when someone made a comment something like, "...of course we're ALL searching for spark plug brand ____ number ____, the holy grail of spark plugs." Since then I've been frustrated in my efforts to find that old post, and to try and memorize that number.
Pretty much all specialty collectables have such "Holy Grail" items. And the reverse is also true. The item that everyone "thinks" should be in extreme demand? But it isn't. Over the years, I have collected many different things, coins, books, phonograph records (I have over 2000 78 rpm records!), and almost anything that goes well with my antique automobiles.
Over the years, I have had a few different 1915 automobiles that I liked to tour with, and often used for club picnics. Because Coca Cola's iconic shapely bottle was first used in 1915, I wanted a couple of the first series issued bottles to use at picnics and shows. That first series, for only a very few years, the bottle and script was slightly different. A subtle difference, not usually noticed. However, in spite of that, that first year series issued bottles in good condition are not terribly rare. Nor are they very expensive. Unless of course the city name on the bottom makes it especially valuable.
Bottle collectors (years ago at least?), especially Coca Cola bottle collectors, it was all about the city name on the bottom of the bottle. For a bit over half a century, Coca Cola franchise arrangements had different bottling plants owning their own bottles, and nearly all of them had the city and state they belonged to on the bottom of the bottle! Serious collectors knew what cities were valuable and what ones were not. Over the decades those bottles were returned and reused, they got transported all over the country and scattered. When I would take a few minutes and look through Coke bottles for the 1915 series, I would also check a lot of them for cities I was familiar with or cared about.
My wife and I lived in Livermore California for about 25 years. Just over the hill from us, was a little town of Tracy California, and Tracy had had a bottling plant for a few decades. In my hunt for Coke bottles I wanted, I met several serious collectors, and heard this story several times. Apparently, Tracy bottles didn't usually wander very far. The plant was shut down in the 1960s, and dump trucks hauled away everything loose in the bottling plant, to an undisclosed location. Bottle collectors had been searching for that location for years! I don't know about now? But 25 years ago, I had four different bottle collectors gave me standing offers if I found a nice "Tracy Calif" Coke bottle of $1000 for one bottle! They told me that only a handful of the thousands made were known to exist to serious collectors.
Maybe since then? Maybe someone found the burial site? Maybe now there are a thousand of them floating around? But 25 to 30 years ago? That Tracy Coke bottle was one of the "Holy Grail" collector items.
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Now, THAT is funny!
Rental cars get abused in so many ways. But using one to transport an engine on the back seat has got to be unusual? Although that engine looks more clean than I do, and probably weighs less than do half the people reading this.
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22 minutes ago, 1935Packard said:
Don’t kno how many fans of early Porsches there are here, but I’ve never seen a Gmund coupe this close up (one of the first 50 or so of the make).
I may make it known often that I begin losing interest in collector cars after around the late 1920s? And I have commented several times that I much prefer the Duesenberg model "A" over anything in the "J" series! However, even I do appreciate significant landmark models of popular cars throughout automotive history. So, in spite of the fact I will likely never own any Porsche (although I am sure I would enjoy driving one if I had one?), mainly because I would never spend that much money for a car I don't really want? I do find that car interesting to look at and do appreciate its significance.
Thank you for posting those photos! Also thank you for posting the other semi-modern collector car (1930s!) photos from Pebble.
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5 hours ago, edinmass said:
We managed a pretty nice trophy.
Best Rolls Royce. Fun day on the green.
Congratulations! Considering some of the other RRs seen in photos, that sounds like quite an accomplishment.
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If I recall correctly what I read years ago? California's statewide speed limit during the 1930s was 35 mph. California, especially in those days, had great distances between major cities. Many people in those days still remembered the time when the fastest they ever traveled was on the back of a horse! In those prewar years, the majority of drivers never ever went over 30 mph. It is just how it was in those days.
Bragging about a car being capable of sustained sixty plus may have made for some compelling advertising? However it meant little in the real world of most people.
There was nothing new about that either? Ford, in 1908, practically guaranteed their model K 6-40 roadster capable of 70 mph! Again, not that most people would ever find a road they would be willing to try it on.
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Where's the front????
😁
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AJ, Ed, et al, Allow me to add my "Thank You" for the wonderful photos and insightful commentaries over these events and the cars that make the big show so special!
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I, am impressed! Rarely do I find a model T fire truck impressive!
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6 minutes ago, Robert G. Smits said:
My 2003 just turned 242,000 miles with only basic maintaince. If my EMF history is correct Studebaker took over EMF sometime in 1912 and rebranded the remaining cars as Studebaker 20 and 30. Also didn't Flanders produce a big 6 cylinder car in 1912 of which there are no survivors.
I have been a bit more curious about the evolution of the early Studebaker six cylinder engine lately. I sort of lost interest when I had to sell the 1915 built series 16 Studebaker six that I had had. However, lately, one of the big antique automobile dealers has had a 1912 Everitt six cylinder touring car for sale. I believe one of the lesser known of the EMF/Studebaker group. Photos of the engine were very interesting, in that it resembled the EMF and early Studebaker four cylinder engines, and I couldn't be sure, but it appeared to be a mono-block six?. Studebaker is generally considered to have been the first mass production mono-block six. I find the relationship between Studebaker and that 1912 Everitt to be interesting.
As for Flanders building a six? Again, I am not sure, but I seem to recall reading something about it years ago?
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I was thinking I saw a bunch of great RRs scattered through all the photos. Best of luck!
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Looks like a door sill plate. I know a lot of early Maxwell models had such things. I have seen a lot of nice reproductions of the originals at swap meets over the years, and suspect this might be a repro.
Different models used different sizes of sill plates. Early Maxwell forums might help identify which model they would fit.
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I am sure that proper "water pump" grease is the best way to go. If you can get it.
About twenty years ago, I emptied the last of my old can of water pump grease. A couple quick phone calls found the model A suppliers out of stock at the time, with no recommendations.
So I bought a tube of boat trailer wheel bearing grease at the local auto parts supplier. It seamed to work just fine. It is specially formulated to withstand water getting into it, lubricated the water pump shaft quite well, and didn't leak.
In case you can't get the real thing.
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3 hours ago, alsancle said:
With the exception of this. Which brought 1.7 million.
I don't even know what that was? However, IF the serial number tag was worth that much? I would certainly think that the car was of special historic interest and that nearly every scrap of original metal remaining would actually be resurrected and used on the completed automobile!
I have restored worse myself. I resurrected an original era model T boat-tail roadster that had been totaled in a rollover wreck decades earlier, and then stripped of anything usable. One half of the tail section was torn loose, smashed inside out and stuffed into the other side! It took more than fourteen linear feet of crack and tear welding to put the main body alone back together! I used every ounce of original metal remaining, straightened, and welded, and reshaped back to original form. Being a model T Ford of course all the missing parts were easily sourced.
After I had bought the wreckage, a dozen people that saw it told me that "it could not be restored!" I wanted an original after-market bodied model T speedster. I restored it. And I very much enjoyed driving it for several years before I had to sell it in order to buy our first home.
If that car's serial number plate is worth that much? That car deserves no less.
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Looking for an original balloon tire (and a Fisk Red Top)
in Parts For Sale
Posted
No Fisk tires here.
How early a balloon tire do you want? And what sort of condition?
I have a few that are probably pre WWII replacements for late 1920s cars. A couple came off my 1927 Paige 6-45 sedan which had a 20 inch rim size. A couple others came off the 1925 series 80 Pierce Arrow I used to have, which had a 22 inch rim size.
Earliest balloon tires when they came out about 1923 were originally sized by the outer diameter of the tires by tire profile requiring a bit of mathematics to figure the rim size, as were the high pressure tires before them. By the end of the 1920s, manufacturers switched to the more sensible "rim size by tire profile" method of measuring tires.
I doubt any of the balloon tires I have would have that earliest method of measuring on them. But I would have to check them to know for sure, and a couple of them aren't easy to get to where I have them stashed. The couple I have from the Pierce Arrow, I wrapped in paper and some sort of plastic ribbon when I removed them from the car over thirty years ago. At that time, they were still soft enough that I drove the car on a few club tours while waiting for my new tires. Ever since, they have been kept in a cool dark space.
The ones that came off the Paige were still holding air and supporting the car when my dad bought it over fifty years ago. He buried the car in his garage and it never did get restored, although I did begin work on it about thirty years ago. The last of its old tires was removed from the car only a few years ago. The rubber was rather hard, and I didn't want to destroy them by rolling the car around on them any more. At least two (I think three?) of them still hold air. At least one of them still with a red rubber innertube.
I would guess they aren't quite as early as you would like to get. However, if you are interested? I do not have any spare rims to go with them.