1938 Buick front spings mid year change?

I have an original low millage 1938 Buick Special Series 40 5 passenger trunk back that needed springs and shocks. When I first drove it home it was like a worn out old hay wagon and a challenge to keep on the road. When I replaced the springs and shocks the project morphed into replace and rebuild everything from the floor down while I was in there!

This took years, but when it was all done and back down off the jack stands it was obvious that the front end was way too high by a few inches. The tops of the A arms are touching the rubber frame snubbers and hanging down almost as much as they were on the jack stands. I drove it to Iola two years ago hoping the springs would settle in but they did not. Hearing everyone ask 'Why is the front end so high?' became annoying.

I figured this was another case of non spec parts so I ordered up another set of front coil springs from Kanter that came from Eaton. The new springs have the same problem - too high and too stiff. The Eaton web site says the springs I have are for frame numbers to 13226185 and have a spring rate of 369. My frame is 13343856 which is after this range. The site says after frame 13226185 uses a spring rate of 249. Great, but it also says they are unavailable.

I called Eaton to see why they are unavailable and they said they don't have a blue print for this spring. They said I could send in an original and they could try to copy it, but unfortunately I recycled the original springs years ago. See, that's why you should never get rid of old parts even if they are worn out! My recollection is that the originals looked just like the replacements. I could order lowered versions of what I have but the spring rate would still be too stiff.

Has anyone encountered this apparent 1938 mid year spring redesign? If so, what changed on the frame? And most important, where can I find the right springs?

My 1939 is sitting pretty high right now too. I have rebuilt the front and and even used the original shocks. My arms are touching the rubber stops also. I have some weight to still add to the car in various parts, but so far it looks too high. I bring this up because many of my "original" front end parts were actually 1938 style. I need to order a different set of lower inner bushings because the ones I was sent are not correct for my car, though I have see other 1939's with that setup. I wonder if there is indeed some suspension design overlap from 1938-39.

Thanks for the reply Billy. I should clarify that my lever action shocks are original too, and I had them rebuilt.

I should have also mentioned the other frame numbers listed on the Eaton web site for this spring. The frame number is on the firewall tag. Does anyone else have a 1938 Series 40 with frame numbers after these?

Regular After Frame 1-3226185 Flint; 2-3242131 Cal.; 3-3246767 Linden

John,

If you have the shop manual, the spring specifications and details are on page 68. That may be of some help.

You may have been given Century springs. Tiny little difference in dimensions but rate at nearly 150lbs more load carry.

Special wire diameter is .648 & Century is .660. Not that easy to pick up by eye.

Try sitting someone of 150Lbs on the bumper and see if the curb height goes down to specs. :)

Danny

Danny,

Thanks much for the manual reference. I do have a manual and just missed seeing that. I measured the first set of springs with a good dial caliper and the wire diameter is .670. The springs from Eaton came in at .700. These are so stiff that putting 150 pounds on the bumper just bulges the tire, the spring doesn't move at all.

I will talk with Eaton on Monday about the wire diameter. When I talked with them before they said the information about the different spring rate after certain frame numbers came from some old parts listing. He was not certain of the authenticity of this information so that's why I'm trying to see if anyone else has a 1938 Buick 40 with frame numbers after these.

After Frame 1-3226185 Flint; 2-3242131 Cal.; 3-3246767 Linden

If someone has one it would be interesting to see what the spring wire diameter is on an original spring. Or even a replacement that works well. If we can get enough information Eaton should be able to make a correct spring. So far at least two of us need a pair. (of springs that is )

John,

The coil spring wire diameter measurement on my 38 Special (frame number is 33359564) is 6.52 - 6.53.

As you can see from the photo below, it sits pretty level front to back.

Thanks Mark! That puts your springs pretty close to factory specs. If these have been replaced, where did you get them?

I talked to Eaton and gave them the complete spring specifications from the manual, but they said they can't make them. He said they could not get that wire diameter. None of this makes sense because the springs I got from them for the 'before frame number' range measure .700 and a length of 15.5". Too stiff and too high on both accounts by the factory manual. The 'after frame number' springs they say are unavailable specify a much stiffer spring.

I'm starting to doubt that there was such a drastic spring change mid year. From a rate of 356 to 249 doesn't make sense. Maybe a misprint and should have been 356 to 349.

I found a place called Coil Spring Specialties which others on this board have recommended in other threads. They had all of the factory specs that matched the manual and said they can make a pair. He said if the wire diameter available is not exact they adjust the height to compensate. This sounds reasonable so a pair is on order and hoping the third pair is the charm.

Has anyone else found a good source for a 1938 Buick Special front spring?

Hi Art - -

Another factor to keep in mind is that Buick made different coil springs for sidemounted versions than non-sidemounted cars. From what you are describing as happening with your Buick may be the result of having sidemount springs installed. I think one or two coils are added to compensate for the added weight of the sidemounts (about 100 pounds.) I am not near my information, but I think it is referenced in the salesman's guide book. I have a sidemounted '38 model 61. Hope that helps.

Since you have the springs, try cutting them down to give the correct ride height and see how it rides after. I have seen this before on reproduction springs. They are made too tall.

My one is equipped with 6.69 wire diameter springs. My Car was also stand too high and have clamp it down one ring of the spring.

My Tag # is :,23325857

My 38 Special is original and does not have side mounts.

Greetings,

I checked three '38s - all model 41. Two have spring wire of .650. Those two do NOT have sidemounts. Both cars sit level.

Their chassis numbers are - 13263802 and 13263052.

The third car has sidemounts. Its springwire is .670. Its chassis number is 13230543. That car is much too high.

I suspect the springs have been reset because all the front suspension has been reconditioned. I can't confirm the springs

have been reset because the car is a "deceased estate" car and the present custodian can't tell me what has ben done.

In the '39 manual there is a ride height (gauge) measurement of 4" given. There is a picture too but I don't know how to get that

in here. (perhaps another reader can / will if you haven't access to a '39 manual). The rideheight measurement is taken adjacent

to the rubber bumpstop. The '38 and '39 front ends look very similar and both the '38s (above) show a ride height of 4" +- 1/8"

The 'too high' car measurement is 5 1/2" - obviously something is awry there.

It seems a large tolerence but the '39 manual says of the (4") gauge measurement - "Front springs are considered too high or too

low when front spring height gauges are too long or too short by 3/8" "See Fig. 3-7." (it's on page 27).

Perhaps this will be of interest even if it not of any help. !

Regards. Owen.

Thanks to all who helped with this dilemma! The new springs from Coil Spring Specialties did the trick after two previous failures from two vendors. I have learned three things from this thread.

1. The members on this board are great! You're measurements and experiences helped guide me to find the solution. I hope to pay this forward and help others if I can.

2. I don't believe there was such a drastic mid year change as the Eaton web site indicates. There may have been a very minor change to soften the ride, but the numbers they indicate can not be right. I suspect a typo in this old 'information'.

3. Obviously others besides me have this same problem of front springs that sit too high. Coil Spring Specialties is your answer. I have no affiliation with them, this is only my happy recommendation after two failed attempts to find the right springs. They were the only ones who had the correct factory specs and said they would adjust the spring height to compensate for coil size to give factory ride height.

Good to hear you got it all sorted. The question of ride quality brought to mind an old problem I ran across years ago.

Nothing to do with but in the same area as springs, the shockies.

I had a mate with a '39 that had what he thought was "His" shockies rebuilt but was given an exchange pair from a later year.

The valveing was different and gave a harsh ride.

The things you learn along the way. :)

Danny