Voltage Regulator 38 Limited

Folks,

The auto electrician mentioned that my Voltage regulator is on its last legs and ought to be replaced. He made it very clear that this is something <span style="font-weight: bold">I </span>need to source for him given age and rarity of car.

Whats the scoop for such a situation? Will a second hand one on ebay do the job? Does the regulator for a Special suit a Limited? Can I order a brand new replica off the web somewhere?

Regards

David

You can pick these up easily. If you have your original regulator, they are reasonably cheap to have rebuilt. If you don't have one, they are easy to find. I know that Kanter (kanter.com) sells them, and I believe Bob's Automobilia (bobsautomobilia.com) sells them as well.

Grant - thanks and sure enough it looks like I am spoilt for choice. Too much choice.

There seems to be a number available for the car I can get:

1.A 3-PRONG. DELCO FACTORY REBUILT or

2.GENUINE DELCO REPLACEMENT. 4 TERMNINALS

Replica or rebuild? [and why the extra terminals?]

Regards

David

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DBT</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Replica or rebuild? [and why the extra terminals?]

Regards

David </div></div>

David,

I'm no expert, but I'd guess the extra terminal on the replacement is to make it a bit more universal so that it can work for more applications.

As for the replica vs. rebuild question, there's a couple of things you want to consider. One is cost, which likely isn't an issue for something like this. Another is originality. If you are trying to keep the car absolutely pristine from an originality viewpoint, you would want the rebuilt one.

Good luck. At least you are making more progress than I am.

Thanks Derek,

I've gone with the rebuild - its a little dearer but will look original as you say.

Regards

No problem...glad I could help, if help is what you call it. Every now and again I need to think about similar things - I prefer originality, but at what cost.

If I recall correctly the 38 had a FIVE terminal voltage regulater that was superceded by a 4 terminal reguator the following year. (the extra terminals had something to do with powering the starting switch)

In 1940 the 3 terminal regulator came out but also the charging system was re-designed and the regulating system changed.

DBT look in your shop manual, or if you don't have one GET ONE! There is a chance that your charging system may have been modified.

Bill

My 48 Special has three terminals and the 53 has 4 terminals. The fourth on the 53 is simply a ground. I suppose this was done to insure a good ground in case the frame doesn't ground correctly.

Joe, BCA 33493

Bill

No worries - I'm fast becoming unusually familar with these things! Its the bog standard regulator with three terminals on one side

rather like this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=150165282334&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:PIC&ih=005

or this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=320160987424&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:PIC&ih=011

Regards

David

According to my Delco Original Equipment Electrical Service Parts Catalog all four series 1938 Buicks used 5807 as the original generator control unit. This voltage regulator had five terminals.

The terminals on my 1937 Buick are wired in the following way: Field (connected to field terminal on generator), Generator (connected to "A" terminal on generator), Ignition (connected to offside of ignition switch), Ground (connected to starter motor solenoid relay)and one terminal to battery (connected to charge indicator on instrument cluster).

Frequently as these five terminal regulators went bad they were replaced with the four terminal type which works fine and was more readily available.

Hope this helps to clarify things.

Carl

Carl is right. The 5 terminals were OEM but were replaced in the field by the 4 terminal type. The instructions included with the unit showed how to connect the wires from the five to the four. 1939 used a three terminal unit for the Field lead, Generator lead, and the Cut out lead as the regulator controlled only voltage output and used a cut out for charging the battery. 1940 used a 3 terminal also but Buick now added current regulation, so this regulator is a totally different animal and would be more akin to that used on Joe's 48 Buick. How is the rebuild working for you?

Electrical rebuilding would seem like a lost art.

I love the info this forum brings in. Fantastic!

Can't give any update yet folks as my little regulator is somewhere over the pacific ocean right now winging its way to Singapore.

When it arrives I'll drop a post once its fitted and tested.

Regards

David

Horrors!

It arrived today and the bugger is exactly 3 terminals [ie only 3 terminals..] whilst the incumbant is the original 5 terminal item.

Its Delco Remy part number 1118213-R. [i had hoped also this would come with the instructions for conversion but no].

Carl / Dave ... ideas? Can I use this one?

I'll bet that "R" stands for rebuilt. What number is stamped on the base of the regulator? Was it in the original sealed box or could a different regulator have been placed in this box? Don't mean to cast doubt but....

Electrics are not my strong point, will keep checking if a 3 terminal was ever issued for these cars.

DBT:

Found my copy of instructions dated 4-11-47 that came with a Delco 3 terminal replacement regulator for my 39 Buick. A picture of these instructions is shown in one of the Ebay items you referenced in your post of 10/01/2007. Let me quote. "The three terminal regulator will not replace the five terminal regulator on Pontiac 6 or 8. It cannot be used on Buick and certain other applications without splicing leads. Use Model 1118213 Regulator on these applications."

What number did you find on the base of your replacement unit? Will keep checking for other possible units to use.

Dave

Checked the unit over and found no number stamped on it. It does have written in pencil on the bottom the number 1118203.

The box was not sealed and looked much worse for wear than the regulator.

There is a paper job tag in the box as well with the number "203" on it as well as "job 31391".

So just maybe its a 203 rather than a 213?

I'm afraid I'm not that knowledgeable on voltage regulators and there wiring, but I believe you are correct. I think you have a 1118203 and not a 1118213. By 1941, Chiltons manuals listed the 1118213 for 1937 and 1938 Buicks. The same manual lists the 1118203 for the 1939s. I'm fairly sure the 1118213 was a four terminal regulator.

My Hollander does not list them as being interchangeable. I have an old installation paper that agrees with Dave's paper. The three terminal regulator will not replace the five terminal regulator on the Pontiac 6 or 8. It cannot be used on Buick without splicing leads.

It does give the following information on replacing four or five terminal regulators with a three terminal regulator. Remove the IGN terminal to ignition switch lead. Cut off as close to harness as possible (I wouldn't). Connect the lead from the starting motor solenoid relay (originally connected to the GRD terminal of the replaced regulator) to the GEN terminal of the new regulator, in addition to the GEN lead. I repeat this instruction paper does say use the 5808 regulator on Buick applications, so I don't know if you can adapt the 1118203 to your 1938.

I've never dealt with him, but there is an advertiser in Hemmings that advertises restoring relays and solenoids. You might try and contact him at jpinto@gtcinternet.com .

Good luck. Hey can I get that tour of Singapore?

Carl

The more I think about my last post, the more I think you would be better off restoring your regulator or replacing it with at least a four terminal regulator.

Hope this doesn't cost me that tour.

Carl

Not if you bring a 5 terminal regulator with you ...

David

Hello everyone

My 38 special 40 series, wearing a Delco remy 5 terminals. Please can you explain to someone how to make connections to replace it with one of four terminals?

Manuel

Hi Manuel,

Here is a link to an old Torque Tube that should explain everything to you; http://www.1937and1938buicks.com/The-Torque-Tube/Volume%20XVII%20Issue%205%20%28May-June%201999%29.pdf .

When you get the chance play around on the site as there is a Tech Tip index and a LOT of information in those old Torque Tubes. By the way I wouldn't throw that old 5 terminal one out as they can be rebuilt and are scarce.

Carl

Hi Carl

Thanks you've been very kind.

My buick has always been Delco remy five terminals, and can not find. It seems that you can work with 4 terminals. But I get to know how. Luckily my Delco remy 5 terminals, still works and I will not throw it.

Kind tegards,

Manuel

Hi Manuel

Did you click on the above link and scroll down to pages 20-21? That will show you how to connect the 4 terminal regulator. Unfortunately the 3 and 4 terminal replacements don't work as a back up to the vacuum starter switch to prevent the starter from engaging while driving like the 5 terminal does.

Carl

Hi Carl

TODAY I HAVE BEEN ABLE TO SHOW YESTERDAY not download. THANKS Carl!

I UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS JUST CUT THE WIRE IGNITION and isolate it, right?

Hi,

Yes, that was their solution back in the day and was what was done on my car. I would suggest just disconnecting it and isolating it instead of cutting in case you ever want to put a 5 terminal regulator back on. Removing the ignition wire is why the 3 and 4 terminal regulators won't work as a back up in the starting circuit.

Carl