Transaxles

[Guest joeworf]

Okay, bear with me and I'll try to be as exact and concise as possible

Based on a clunking noise I was getting (usually in turns) I suspected the CV joints were toast. So I took my 1991 TC to a shop and had them throw it up on a lift after a road test and they confirmed my suspicion. They ordered the parts (left and right joints, one inner and one outer). Had an appointment Saturday morning and was settling in for the 2 1/2 hour wait when I saw "discussions" going on between the mechanic and the shop manager and I knew exactly where this was headed. Wrong parts. Apparently I needed a passenger side axle with ????? (Can't read my own writing) shaft (with some sort of bearing) that runs from the transaxle to the hub. No one stocked them, not even the local Chrysler dealers. I told him to my understanding that the transaxles were standard LeBaron issue parts and shouldn't be a big deal. He said the 2nd part sent over seems to be the right length but lacked some sort of bearing as the old one and he wasn't sure if was an upgraded replacement or just plain wrong. He said maybe a part from an Acclaim might work but couldn't get a straight answer from MOPAR. Only other option seems to have the old one removed and sent out to be rebuilt. Anybody else had this big a hassle over this and have any suggestions as where to look or options on interchangeable parts... or just go with the rebuild?? Thanks for any help in advance.

Edited November 4, 2013 by joeworf (see edit history)

[Digger914]

Okay, bear with me and I'll try to be as exact and concise as possible

Based on a clunking noise I was getting (usually in turns) I suspected the CV joints were toast. So I took my 1991 TC to a shop and had them throw it up on a lift after a road test and they confirmed my suspicion. They ordered the parts (left and right joints, one inner and one outer). Had an appointment Saturday morning and was settling in for the 2 1/2 hour wait when I saw "discussions" going on between the mechanic and the shop manager and I knew exactly where this was headed. Wrong parts. Apparently I needed a passenger side axle with ????? (Can't read my own writing) shaft (with some sort of bearing) that runs from the transaxle to the hub. No one stocked them, not even the local Chrysler dealers. I told him to my understanding that the transaxles were standard LeBaron issue parts and shouldn't be a big deal. He said the 2nd part sent over seems to be the right length but lacked some sort of bearing as the old one and he wasn't sure if was an upgraded replacement or just plain wrong. He sais maybe a part fronm ans Acclaim might work but couldn't get a staright answer from MOPAR. Only other option seems to have the old one removed and sent out to be rebuilt. Anybody else had this big a hassle over this and have any suggestions as where to look or options on interchangaeble parts... or just go with the rebuild?? Thanks for any help in advance.

Took me three days to get the right back-up light neutral safety switch for my 90TC, something about the part number and Chrysler software between old and new where TC wasn't updated or converts wrong.

The TC needs to have the ABS ring on the axle shaft and that really limits new shaft selection. rockauto.com has 2 left and 1 right remans available $96 ea, $50 of that is core charge and comes back when you return the old part. Or you can go with a local rebuild, part options are limited.

[Guest joeworf]

Took me three days to get the right back-up light neutral safety switch for my 90TC, something about the part number and Chrysler software between old and new where TC wasn't updated or converts wrong.

The TC needs to have the ABS ring on the axle shaft and that really limits new shaft selection. rockauto.com has 2 left and 1 right remans available $96 ea, $50 of that is core charge and comes back when you return the old part. Or you can go with a local rebuild, part options are limited.

Well, first of all, thanks Digger for your invaluable help to this community! I called my mechanic and passed on the info about Rock Auto, but he had just checked with them and after some back and forth, realized that what they have in stock is the wrong part, too. To compound matters the shop that he was going to have rebuild the axles doesn't do those parts as part of their services. I'm beginning to think I was hoodwinked and got the ol' okey doke when they sold me the TC knowing the true difficulty entailed with this repair. Gotta ask, though... any other ideas?? Thanks.

[Digger914]

Well, first of all, thanks Digger for your invaluable help to this community! I called my mechanic and passed on the info about Rock Auto, but he had just checked with them and after some back and forth, realized that what they have in stock is the wrong part, too. To compound matters the shop that he was going to have rebuild the axles doesn't do those parts as part of their services. I'm beginning to think I was hoodwinked and got the ol' okey doke when they sold me the TC knowing the true difficulty entailed with this repair. Gotta ask, though... any other ideas?? Thanks.

Think your mechanic might be having you on, see post 3 weeks ago Bill Reichert got his axle shaft from NAPA and I bet he kept the receipt with the NAPA part number. Give him a holler, I'm sure he would be glad to share it.

[Guest joeworf]

Think your mechanic might be having you on, see post 3 weeks ago Bill Reichert got his axle shaft from NAPA and I bet he kept the receipt with the NAPA part number. Give him a holler, I'm sure he would be glad to share it.

Hmmm.... Okay, calling Bill Reichart!! (Didn't see any contact info for you) As Digger said, would you happen to have the part number for the shaft you got fron NAPA (I'm assuming that it was correct)? Getting a tad desperate at this point. I found one place relatively nearby that does axle rebuilds, but I think they only do large commercial vehicles. Bill, if you read this post let me know, please? JOE

[Digger914]

I see that you are almost brand new to this site so here's the scoop, at the present moment Bill has the posting just below this one, log on, click on Bill and send a private message,

[Bill Reichert]

The TC came with a two part axle on the right. and a bearing and mount for in between the 2 sections. I guess the parts supplier is substituting the longer one piece right side axle. It will work but my give more torque steer or pull to the right when accelerating hard. I got a rebuilt original axle from Napa a couple weeks ago. They are getting scarce because the bearing between the 2 part axles are hard to find. I got the bearing a long time ago and it was labeled "not authorized for aviation use" So I'm guessing that bearing is used in some small aircraft.

I would not worry about lack of parts in the future because the members of a couple forums are making new parts as they become unavailable. One person actually bought a 3D printer for replicating plastic parts!

[Bill Reichert]

Locate a NAPA store and call. They just looked up 89 TC right front axle and found one in the North East. They are still around. I'm on here about 5x per day as I take a break working on my cars. Cardone parts are also good. Car Quest didn't have one.

[Digger914]

So you need new CV joints on both drive axle's and a hanger bearing? not a new U joint, but the hanger (AKA carrier) bearing that supports the short shaft? and are you sure and positive the problem is the bearing and not the U joint?

[Guest joeworf]

Um... I spoke again with the mechanic and the issue we're both confused on is whether the NAPA part is the single piece substitution shaft or the two-piece original design ala factory? He was concerned over safety (and torque steer) issues as to whether the part was acceptable. He had a call into a Chrysler guru of sorts, but he never returned the message. Like I said before, one place no longer does rebuilds on the part and the other only works on commercial truck parts. Not sure on the U-joint question without getting it re-evaluated or going to another shop.

[Bill Reichert]

Aaaa, the pm I sent is wrong I got the left side drive shaft. See if he can tap off the tone wheel on your old axle. If so, it can be installed on a new 2 piece axle for any of the Dodge turbo cars of the right vintage.

[Digger914]

Um... I spoke again with the mechanic and the issue we're both confused on is whether the NAPA part is the single piece substitution shaft or the two-piece original design ala factory? He was concerned over safety (and torque steer) issues as to whether the part was acceptable. He had a call into a Chrysler guru of sorts, but he never returned the message. Like I said before, one place no longer does rebuilds on the part and the other only works on commercial truck parts. Not sure on the U-joint question without getting it re-evaluated or going to another shop.

Getting a new CV on an old shaft, even a new bearing should not be such a problem. When you can't trust the part number to get you what you need, trust the part, knowing how to ask the question is the biggest part of finding the answer.

See attachments from MOTOR 85 to 90 Front End & Brake Service, a book that educated old mechanics on new things from back in the day before computers took over. Intermediate Shaft.pdf What you need to know to identify & measure Chrysler drive axle. Also attached the intermediate shaft assembly.

You didn't mention scream, scrape or whine with trans axle noise and odds are against needing the bearing, a bad U joint will give you a clunk.

Trans Axle Identification.pdf

[Guest BarelyFit]

This is some advise Hemi gave me some years ago:

It is true that mechanics don't want to do just boots any more.

The reasons are many, 1- They don't know how, 2- They make more money selling you the complete shaft, 3- They are not responsible for any subsequent boot failure, 4- They can't find the correct boot for the application, especially a TC.

It would be my personal advice to you to just get the whole shaft as your problems later would be fewer. Order 1- NCV12539 Axle Shaft.

[Guest joeworf]

Thank you gentlemen for the assist. Although, what may have gotten lost in all this (and I'm not sure if it's relevant actually) is that my car is a '91 with the 3.0 Six not a turbo 4, so not sure if the part numbers apply across all models, engines and trans???? Guess, the best I can do at this point is direct the mechanic to this site or print off the thread and see if he can make sense of it all.

[Guest joeworf]

"You didn't mention scream, scrape or whine with trans axle noise and odds are against needing the bearing, a bad U joint will give you a clunk."

All I heard was the clunking (sounded like both sides intermittently). No whining, screaming (except my nerves) or scraping. Did observe the underside and the boots were torn and fluid was visible.

[Digger914]

"You didn't mention scream, scrape or whine with trans axle noise and odds are against needing the bearing, a bad U joint will give you a clunk."

All I heard was the clunking (sounded like both sides intermittently). No whining, screaming (except my nerves) or scraping. Did observe the underside and the boots were torn and fluid was visible.

Because superseded part numbers got in the way it took me three days to get a neutral safety back up lamp switch for my 90 V6 auto, the new Chrysler part will fit the tranny but not the wire harness, the other number fits the wire harness but not the tranny, taking the part to the warehouse was how I found the part and amazingly, it's a standard stock part no special order required. Just in case someone else might need one it's made by BDW # NS38054.

The turbo with automatic tranny should use the same axle shafts, auto tranny sits in the same spot with same distance wheels, same splines, you can check by phone if you know the axle type, length, splines and diameters, if you need to make sure for yourself carry the old part to the store that sells new and compare.

One of the great benefits of this site is that after spending several days chasing after a part that's readily available, people are glad to tell their story and help you save some time.

[Guest BREWCITY72]

Mine is a 89 2.2t2 auto it had the short pass side shaft set up,went with long shaft some torque steer but no big deal,shafts from a J,G, BODY WORK FINE,there is a couple places that make a better bearing setup for the short shaft set up. most all have tone rings BUT THE Q BODY USES WIERD TONE RINGS ON THE SHAFTS,SO WHEN YOU USE THE J,G SHAFTS YOU HAVE TO ADJUST THE DEPTH OF THE SENSOR TO THE TONE WHEEL OR YOU WILL WIPE OUT THE SENSOR,THEN YOU WILL BE FUBAR-ED....

[89TC-16V]

the tone rings can be removed from the cv axles and used on the new ones if you purchase one that has the incorrect ones. the equal length set up on these cars uses a "jack shaft" or intermediate axles assembly to compensate for the distance between the passenger side short shaft and the cv axle. right and left cv axles are the same. the jack shaft is no longer made by to my knowledge. we did a group by back about 3 years ago because the bearing itself on the jack shaft goes bad so a member cut off the holder and made a holder for a replaceable bearing. i have one of these new units in my daytona. the Jackshaft itself usually doesnt go bad, just the bearing does. any lebaron or daytona possibly sundance,, duster turbo car should have a usuable jack shaft to replace yours wit to retain your equal length axle assembly. i have one, but its going into a project to be complete this weekend or i would sell it to you for cheap. to have your axles rebuilt if you have the correct tone rings on them isnt a bad idea. i have a set at home im going to have done because they are the 16V ones that are impossible to find let alone replace with new.

[Hemi Dude]

Okay, bear with me.

Based on a clunking noise I was getting (usually in turns) I suspected the CV joints were toast. So I took my 1991 TC to a shop and had them throw it up on a lift after a road test and they confirmed my suspicion.

Gentlemen, based on what you wrote to begin with, I suspect that there may indeed be NOTHING wrong with your CV joints, the U-Joint in the intermediate shaft or the support bearing. These things would give you more than a 'CLUNK' when making a turn.

A bad CV joint would make a continuous click-clack type of a noise, the U-Joint would make a noise every time you reverse directions and a bad bearing would be noisy at all times driving forward at speed, getting respectively faster as the car increases in speed.

So, I suspect a suspension problem. Possibly in the control arm bushings. Even one of the 4 sub-frame mounting nuts could be loose. It sounds as something is shifting position due to the load of turning.

As for the axle shafts, left and right short shafts are interchangeable. The long right side shaft can replace the 2 on that side with NO PROBLEM at all. Other FWD Chrysler cars use them without any torque steer. I have the short/long shaft setup on my Voyager Van with a 3.0L engine and find no problem or torque-steer even on hard acceleration.

I don't know if you are still stuck in this predicament so the information is for everyone to digest.

[Guest joeworf]

I don't know if you are still stuck in this predicament so the information is for everyone to digest.

Heh... still stuck in the predicament. Took the TC to another shop and advised them of what you said and all the previous dialogue and evaluations. They obviously found the torn boots and transaxle situation, but drew a negative on the mounts and control arm bushings. They did note that one motor mount was loose and had a worn bushing, but not broken. They said this might cause some flex and torque the transaxles somewhat on acceleration. Oddly enough I didn't notice the clunking noise after the previous shop had it up on the lift and the new repair shop couldn't replicate the "clunk" either. Did being hoisted on the lift temporarily realign/relieve something (reduce load)?? Anyway, still looks like transaxle is an issue. The fluctuating temp gauge came down to a bad thermostat and may resolve the restart problem (stumbles after a subsequent restart for a few moments and then levels off). Radiator was leaking as well. I'll tackle the clunking issue once I get it to resume making noise. Thanks Hemi, Digger, et al for the input and wisdom. I'll check back as the the matter evolves.

Edited November 13, 2013 by joeworf (see edit history)

[Guest joeworf]

Phase II: Picked the car up from the shop with my new thermostat and radiator just before closing. Paid for it and took it for a spin. Same problem. No change. Temperature gauge still subject to wide swings from low to medium. Gauge goes from lower registers to mid range depending upon whether the car is in motion or not and sometimes just idling. I'm getting annoyed. What? sensors? sending unit? faulty gauge? I really hate paying for repairs that are ineffective and it has become a more frequent problem in recent years.

Edited November 14, 2013 by joeworf (see edit history)

[Guest BarelyFit]

The temp gauge fluctuations are NORMAL. I know it is not like other cars you've driven but the TC is not like other cars you have driven. Be at peace my brother.

[Guest joeworf]

The temp gauge fluctuations are NORMAL. I know it is not like other cars you've driven but the TC is not like other cars you have driven. Be at peace my brother.

Thank you, Jedi Master. This humble Padawan shall accept the ways of the Farce. Just got off the horn with the mechanic and he confirms that the operating temperature is steady and normal, despite what the $#@& gauge indicates. Short of ripping out the dash gauge cluster and doing detective work, I'll just learn to live with it. My paranoia stems from past bad experiences with two other cars (a Dodge and a Kia) that flipped out like this. One was a bad thermostat and the other a gauge issue. Just wasn't too eager to find out the hard way stranded on the side of the road with a blown head gasket. All is good. Ooooooooooooooommmmmmmmm. Ooooooommmmmmmmmm.

[Guest Butch91]

Joe, not sure if this may help or not. we have 3 tc's and the temp gauge does not swing much at all on any of the 3 if anything the gauge reads on the low side typically. But it does work as i did notice high temp. on the gauge when one of the hoses developed a pinhole and caused water to leak out slowly causing a low water situation.

But, a few years ago i did have a ford mini-van that did exhibit temp gauge swings. i did not pay much attention as it did not overheat. but then the water pump started to leak slightly. when i replaced the water pump the temp swing went away. and the old water pump had very little of the 'pump vanes' left, all were eaten away over the years. the lack of vanes within the water pump caused the temp gauge to swing as the water flow was very uneven depending upon the engine rpm at any given time. not to say that is your situation, but it may be something for you to look at now or in future. take care.