1927 WAGNER STARTER ISSUE

[Guest TomB]

Happy New Year to my Forum Family:

Anyone have suggestions as to why the Wagner starter bendix does not engage with the flywheel? The manual I have says it needs to be free of dirt, grease and oil. Beyond that, I'm open to any and all suggestions. My Wagner starter works fine except for the fact that the bendix does not engage the starter gear with the flywheel. Thanks!

Respectfully,

TomB

[oldford]

two thoughts come to mind. 1. the bendix is not being thrown out when the starter turns. Maybe dirty on the 'threads' that spiral on the shaft. That area needs to be very clean. Try some brake clean on it. Second, the ring gear may be worn in the spot where the engine stops. Try rocking the car in gear to move the ring gear, or crank it over a bit by hand. Let us know...

Frank

[studerex]

One of our friends had this problem on the Glidden tour. He had used brake clean and it stopped working. It went from intermitant to not working a all. He then soaked it with penatrating oil - pb blaster and it has worked since.

[startergenrebuilder]

Good suggestions, but I have a couple thoughts to add. It would actually be a good idea to do the brake clean first to clean any grime from the splines and then follow with a light lubricant. If you use to heavy of a grease, it will actually cause too much resistance. For now, just hit it with some WD-40 and work the gear in and out to see if thats the issue. You might also check for a broken drive spring. Another option is if the starter is tired, you have a low battery or bad connection in the wiring. Any of these will cause the starter to slow down and possibly not turn fast enough to kick the gear out. Feel free to contact me with any questions. Good Luck!

[dictator27]

When you say the starter works fine, do you mean in the car or on the bench? If it is in the car, does it sound like the starter drive briefly engages the flywheel and then immediately kicks out? That indicates a broken spring in the starter drive because the purpose of that spring is to keep the starter gear engaged with the flywheel until the engine starts. Testing it on the bench won't identify that problem unless you can actually see a break in the spring because the drive will still kick out when you juice the starter.

Terry

[Guest TomB]

Thanks to all who replied! To answer Terry's question, the starter is currently on the bench. It spins (quite fast) on the bench and the starter gear moves freely by hand. However, when bench testing the starter, it appears the bendix is not working. Neither the starter gear nor the spring move into position to engage the gear with the flywheel. Is the spring supposed to move also? Could the spring be the problem?

Thanks again,

TomB

[dictator27]

I think there are three possibilities. The most common is a broken bendix spring. Second is a broken or missing bendix bolt - the one closest to the armature. Thirdly a sheared off woodruff key which keys the bendix sleeve to the armature shaft. I'm leaning toward the latter because you say the starter gear does not move out when the starter is rotating. If that key is broken, the bendix sleeve will not rotate on the armature shaft and won't give the necessary rotation to the bendix to move it out.

Terry

[Guest TomB]

Thanks Terry. I think I'll tear it down and explore all three possibilities. Do you know if the bendix spring is supposed to move when voltage is applied?

Thanks again,

TomB

[dictator27]

I'm still trying to wrap my mind around why the bendix won't move out when the starter is energized. There is a counterweight on the bendix which resists armature rotation just enough to cause the gear to move into engagement with the ring gear. The weight is an integral part of the gear. If the starter is turning rapidly and the spiral spline is clean and dry, it has to move. The spring has no influence on that part of starter operation. It's there to keep the gear engaged with the ring gear and doesn't move with the bendix.

Terry

[startergenrebuilder]

The large coil spring is in fact how the bendix gear is attached to the armature. It is not there to keep the gear engaged. If the spring is broken, the gear may not engage. It sounds like your dealing with a broken spring or a spring bolt that has backed out, but that should make a grinding sound unless its gone all together. Hope this helps.

Jason

[startergenrebuilder]

One quick question after re-reading your post. When you test it on the bench, is the gear spinning? If it does spin, does it appear to be spinning as fast as the starter motor (armature shaft)?

[dictator27]

One quick question after re-reading your post. When you test it on the bench, is the gear spinning? If it does spin, does it appear to be spinning as fast as the starter motor (armature shaft)?

I think it is safe to say Jason knows what he is talking out Tom, so I will gladly defer to him. I agree with his question and would like to ask this: You say the starter gear moves freely when you spin it by hand, but does it also move out when you do that? I guess I'm just asking Jason's question in a different way, but I think that is the part of your description that I'm questioning.

Terry

[Guest TomB]

You guys are the best. Thanks to all who replied to this thread, I now have a working starter!

Kudos,

TomB