Market conditions on 1963, 64 and 65 Riviera

[lrlforfun]

OK Riviera people: I track these cars and I'm finding that it seems like (I don't really know) not much is selling for the past several months. Besides looking at adds the only personal experience I have had is that I looked at a 64 Riviera in Castro Valley, CA for $9750. It was nice looking and needed a ton spent on it to really make it a high #3 car. It still is available on Craig's List and the ebay.

My question is, does any body have personal experience tracking and trying to purchase or sell either a car or parts and can you share that experience? There is always an ample supply of overpriced cars all over the place. I'm trying to see what the real market is from people or people who know others who have traded in the market place. Thanks, Mitch.

[Guest 63 rivenge]

Mitch,

From what I see, these Rivs that are priced right move 13K -15K.....a car that you can drive now and enjoy then add to as you go along......The 63 thru 65 are some of the best looking.I have a 63 and with all the cars I have owned ....this car gets the most attention at the shows......you never see them.......both the young and old can relate to them in one way or the other.I am always searching the web for a good driver to do over.......I feel these 63 thru 65s go up in price the next few years People enjoy them at the shows,they are tired of looking at those Camaros nd Chevells ( Not they are not nice), but the Riv is just one Class Act

My opinion only

Regards

Bob

[Guest 63 rivenge]

Mitch, take a look what I am talking about, thats my 63 I lowered it 2" inches and put a set of Vintique Supremes on her

[Guest cia]

Mitch, I have three vintage car wholesalers that come into my shop and not one of them will touch a Riviera as a investment, or even a flip car. If they steal the car, thats another story. All of them say the same thing ( its not a muscle car) they dont sell fast and perform poorly at the block. But on the up side the wholesalers are very savy about the cost of restoration i.e -paint-chrome-upholstery and are willing to pay up for a quailty car, and the buyer also knows that a $38,000. 63 riv. is a better buy than restoring one himself.That being said ( there is a --- for every seat), at any price but quailty is everything!!

[Guest Steeleco]

I have been watching the Riviera market for the last year or so. Here are some thoughts:

1. It seems like there are poor condition or parts cars for a $2500.00 or so,

2. Cars in better condition seem to sell fairly well for $9,000.00 or so,

3. Properly resotored cars may be harder to sell because as my dad used to say (it's easy to buy stuff but hard to sell stuff).

Can anybody qualify what you would expect to get for a certain price? ie. 2.5K, 5K, 10k, 20k or 30k?

Thanks

[JZRIV]

I not sure there is a "real" market anymore. The problem is there are so many variables between cars and rarely are there two cars identical so you can compare apples to apples to get a feel for the market. I have seen cars in the right color combo can add 20% to the value and/or make a difference of selling the car or not selling. Options, body condition in reality (not whats advertised), geographic location (primarily proximity to a large population) and time of year just a few factors in the equation.

A while back for two years I tracked all car sales on ebay on a spreadsheet for a different make and model. Boy did that ever take discipline!. I included location, color combo, mileage, options, selling price or highest bid if it didn't sell, specific notes on cosmetic condition or defects mentioned in the listing and how many times the car was relisted and what the result was. After 2 years of data it was very enlightneing to see what factors made the most difference in price. Being armed with this hard data took all the wind out of the speculators sails, so unless someone does the same thing with Rivs, all we can go on is gut feel from watching online auctions and speculate for our amusement.

Generally speaking though you can get somewhat of a feel just by watching ebay and applying good judgement. An example of bad judgement is when folks see their model car sale on Barrett Jackson and suddenly think there rusty POS is worth 1000s.

On average I don't think anyone will disagree the classic car market is in a slump right now and its a buyers market but that doesn't mean the right car in the right color won't bring top dollar on any given day.

[lrlforfun]

OK Riviera People: So far some fantastic feedback. Jason's spread sheet project was beyond the call of duty. And...there are so many variables, wow.

I answered a wanted 63-4-5 Riviera add on Craig's list recently. The man posting the add said I was his only call. He wanted something in his price range of about 3K that he could drive and fix up. He also stated that he found one for $3500 that was about what he was looking for but there wasn't much out there to compare and now that he had the money he is ready to buy. After talking to him he was leaning towards that $3500 car. Mitch

[60FlatTop]

Two types of buyers bought new Rivieras. One had the have the newest most stylish car on the block the others were as conservative as the style. The first traded their car in about 2 years and they started spiraling downward through the hands of owners in sequence. Generally those were the primary colored cars. The second group kept those sea foam green and Sahara tan cars for 10 or 15 years. In 1971 I got out of the service and bought a 1968 Riviera for about $1600. I always liked the first generation but the older ones were getting pretty rough by that time and it was hard to find a good one. Up in this area they were stock cars for the bar hopping red neck crowd. That took its toll as well.

The growing interest in collector cars affected the Riviera and the Studebaker Avanti more than any cars in history. Those two models had the greatest used car to collectible value cycle of any cars prior to them in history.

I bought my '64 in the spring of 1978 just as values were returning. My car was the darling of a local used car dealer and I paid twice the going rate at the time; about $2,000. The car had been fully refurbished and no deferred maintenance was required. It had a fresh recoat of Sahara tan and had been well maintained. He sold it because he was redoing a '65 Cadillac convertible, another of the cars that escalated in the late '70's and early '80's. Most buyers of those conservatively kept Rivieras became long term keepers like myself. In the 1980's and 1990's resales were not common, the cars were undervalued, and not transferred often.

Around 2000 the auctions, media, and internet brought a lot of first gen's out into the light. Many had a lot of wear and a lot of deferred maintenance. The cars that had been stashed away and not used much needed work. Those started changing hands to those with rose colored glasses. At 40 years of age even Buicks need a lot so dream cars needing engine and transmission rebuilds or expensive interior redo's ended up doing the flip shuffles. Strained budgets and unhappy spouses either put the cars into longer storage or on the market. Those who invested in repairs found they had keepers because they couldn't get their money back.

Today there appear to be real nice ones and real needy ones. A good shopper might find a "fire sale". A money pit would be more likely. Basically the dynamics of the car hobby have created a situation where I wouldn't want to buy one today.

I have a sickness that makes me buy cars, ones "I" like. Last year faced with the gnawing pains to have another car I did the same thing I did when I bought the Riviera. I bought a real nice 15 year old car in good shape that had a little "Wow" factor. It is a black '94 Impala SS. I paid $9,000 for it and put $1,000 worth of tires on it. I bet that is real close to the out of pocket value of the Riviera in '78. This is an adaptable hobby. Learn to adapt and you will always be happy.

In 1984 I was walking around a second rate used car lot in the Quad Cities in Iowa. I had owned old cars since I was 12 and always strove for the 100 point restoration. I had an epiphany while looking at a sharp black Mercury Marquis- I really like a well maintained, clean 15 year old car. Since that night my goal with every car I owned was to have it in that condition. The number one reason is that it is achievable for me. The restorations were not. I still dream about it and I have been looking at '40's Packards, big ones. But reality and adaptability are the keywords today. And I expect to be real happy I bought the Impala when it is 49 years old.

Maybe someone can glean a thought or two from that.

Bernie

[Guest 1963 Riviera]

1964 Buick Riviera Hardtop for sale by Mecum Auction

Here is a link to a 64 hitting the block at Mecum on Friday 16 November. In Anaheim at about 6.50pm local time.

Should be interesting.

I will be there, so I will give you guys a report in case you miss it

Nick