63 Avanti R1 - Garage Find

[Guest BobSpin]

After months of searching all over the U.S., I found this car about 3 miles from my home. 1963 Avanti R1 #R3430. It is a one owner car. It has not been registered since 1969. It sat in the garage until the mid-1980's when the owner decided to restore it. He pulled everything out from under the hood and rebuilt the engine. He had the car repainted Avanti White - original color. Before he could finish the engine and install it he passed away so the car sat for another 15 years or so. Essentially this car has sat in a garage for the past 31 years. After buying it and towing it home the fun began.

[Guest BobSpin]

Now that I have started my post, I should update where I am. Going Nuts! - The body of this Avanti is almost perfect. A couple of scratches that I am told can be fixed, from sitting in the garage for so many years with stuff piled all around it. The car is all original - except in the pictures of towing it home you can see some pretty bad wide and rusted chrome rims on it. It has 36k original miles on it. The interior is original fawn and tourqoise. The main problem with the interior is the headliner. It has shrunk and will need to be replaced. The seats, door panels, console, and dash are in great shape - with the exception of some fading on the dash. Since towing it home I have had the transmission rebuilt, the alternator and starter rebuilt, bought a new carburator - Edelbrock. I also bought a converted (electronic) distributor from Dave T. And I also had to buy a new radiator from Dave because the original was missing. I absolutely hated the chrome rims on the car, so I jumped right in and bought new Crager SS Classic Rims. Since this is going to be a driver, for now I put some decent radials on it.

I went back and looked through the garage again and found the original carburator and distributor - too late, but at least I have them. Many small parts seem to be missing too and I am finding those out as I go. A new dual master cylinder is now installed and new front brakes are also ready to go. I am waiting for parking brake levers to arrive which were also missing. As soon as the rest of the brake parts are here, it will be time to start putting the engine back together. Other items I know are coming up will be all new suspension rubber, all new exhaust - front to back, and, since most of the parts are missing, a whole bunch of air conditioning parts. The fun just keeps comin.

[unimogjohn]

Bob, glad that you have started posting. It will be a great read. The car looks great. You will have it on the road real soon.

Re the headliner. Jon Meyer has a fiberglass reproduction that folks are using. The old card paper liner is no longer available. I still have mine, but the previous owner peeled off a couple of layers of the paper, but you can still see the pattern in the paper.

Give us an update on what you are doing with the suspension. That is something on my future "to do" list.

Looking forward to many more posts. And where are you located?

Edited September 28, 2010 by unimogjohn
added question on location (see edit history)

[Guest BobSpin]

Today is going to be a bust. I have to deal with a rental property instead of the Avanti. So before I take off I figured I would add to my history.

I have always been a car nut. My first car was a 1960 Lark with the 259 and 3sp on the column. Fixed it up to my taste and then sold it to buy a 1959 Austin Healy 3000 with a Ford Cobra 289. Dangerous car for a 17 year old. I next went to a 63 Impala SS 327 4sp and then a 68 Mustang California Special with the 390 and a C6 Automatic. Other cars along the way that had some significance to me were a 69 MGC, 66 Lincoln Town Car, and a 65 Stude Commander that I dropped a heavily modified 327 and muncie 4sp in. The cam was so radical it sounded and felt like it would shake the car apart. My girl friend (we have been together now 40 years - so at least it didn't run her off) hated that car due to the headers and loud exhaust - but it was pretty darn quick and fun. Over the years she would occassionally recount the number of cars I have had, especially when car fever was coming on. I always told her changing cars was cheaper than changing wives. Seems like it has worked out.

Well, I have always wanted an Avanti from the day they first appeared in the showrooms. I almost bought one in 1966. It was a 63 R2 with a 4sp. I found it sitting on a car lot almost pushed aside. The salesman told me the car was $1995.00. I immediately told him I would take it. Unfortunately, as I was just starting to sign my name on the contract, the manager came by and corrected the price - it was $3995.00. The paper was snatched up before I finished signing and, since I couldn't afford the additional money I drove off.

Here I am many years later and I finally got the car. It's not the R2 I really wanted, but maybe next time?

.

Edited September 28, 2010 by BobSpin (see edit history)

[Guest BobSpin]

This is a posting about my progress on getting my classic car back on the road. Invading it with an advertisement is inappropriate.

[Guest bofusmosby]

Great looking car! I am a bit confused though. I know that from what you have stated, the car has been sitting for many many years, but if the car truely has only 36K miles, I can't understand why the original owner had rebuilt the engine. It would seem that the car had just gotten broken in.

Keep us posted as to your progress. I look forward to reading about it.

[Guest BobSpin]

Yea, it's a bit weird. I bought the car from a widow who only could remember parts of what went on. The reason it got parked in 1969 isn't one of those memories. I suspect that the car was probably raced sometime during the 6 years it was registered. I base this on the fact that the engine was rebuilt (although he might have rebuilt it because it sat from 1969 to 1986/88) and it doesn't have the original rear end and I know this because when it was being put on the tow truck we found that all of the lines to the rear end had been cut. When I got it home, found that the car came from the factory with a higher ratio rear end and this one is a 3.54. Only reason I can think of to replace an entire rear end would be if you blew the one in the car and it was cheaper/easier to replace the whole thing than to fix what you broke.

[Guest Silverghost]

Congratsulations on your great project~

I always liked these cars !

In high school in the early 70s a kids dad I knew had one in the barn that was 100% complete and in fine shape but not running.

I offered to get it up and running~ They were not interested !

The barn is still there~

I often wonder if the car is still asleep there ?

There is still another 10 min from my home under a carport that is gong down-hill

The owner won't sell !

Owned it since new .

How many horsepower versions were built ?

What was your car's original horsepower ?

What options were offered ?

Didn't they also offer a supercharged option ?

I always thought that thease cars were way ahead of their time !

How many were built in 63 ?

Edited November 6, 2010 by Silverghost (see edit history)

[Guest BobSpin]

There were 5 versions of the Avanti. R1 with a 289 Studebaker engine w/carburator-240hp, R2 - 289w/supercharger-290hp, R3 - 304.5 W/supercharger-335hp, R4 - 304.5 w/2 carbs-280hp, & R5 - dual superchargers-575hp. The R4&R5 weren't sold to the public. You could order one with a variety of options - air cond., power steering, power windows, regular or quiet exhaust, a little fancier interior and different differential ratios. There were 2418 actual 1963s built.

[Guest BobSpin]

Got the parking brake levers from Dave T. yesterday. Picked up all new brake lines that need to be installed. But I now have all the brake parts and can get the rear brakes put on, get them adjusted front and rear and then the rims and tires go back on. Should be off the stands by next weekend - at least my fingers are crossed for that to come true.

[Guest BobSpin]

Well, as I have read in other posts, one step forward and two back. I got the chance to get the new brake lines installed on the Avanti. Front brakes are bled and ready to be adjusted. The rear brakes are another story. A friend was putting them together prior to mounting on the rear axle. I heard an uh-oh and thought he broke something. Instead it turns out the new parking brake levers don't fit the brake shoes. The mounting pin is too big. So, the car gets to sit longer on the blocks until this situation is remedied. Maybe I will go to sleep tonight and the brake fairy will come, bring the parts and finish the job for me.

I really envy Avanti buffs who can go to the swap meets in the Eastern part of the US. I haven't found one on the West coast yet, but I hope to. I would think taking my shopping list to a used parts supermarket would be a lot easier, and a heck of a lot more fun, than trying to figure out all of the little bits and pieces in the Parts Catalog. But it is really fun when you go into an auto parts store and tell them you need a part and the young guy behind the counter get a glazed-over look in his eyes and says that either the part doesn't exist or he has never heard of it. They act like I am speaking a foreign language. I am getting used to asking if they have a guy 50 or older working in the back - they still speak classic. Spent 10 minutes in a local parts store trying to explain to a 20 something that I needed a brake line clip to axle housing.

[Guest bofusmosby]

I know what you mean about the "surprises" that come with having an old car. I also undertsand about the parts guys that haven't any idea what you really need. I went into an auto parts store to buy a fanbelt for my car. The guy goes into the back, and brings back a belt for a lawnmower. Come to find out, the belt that is supposed to fit, doesn't. It took me 3 trips to finally find one that would fit.

I too was hoping for that "brake fairy" when I was rebuilding my brakes. That *@!*+!@#* never showed up!

Keep the faith. You'll get it done.

[Guest BobSpin]

Today I have two issues - both complaints. One about classic car restoration and the other about spouses. First, the classic car - ahh the Avanti. No one ever told me that if I actually bought one that needed some work - any amount of work - that I would have to mortgage my house. At this point it looks like every bolt, nut, washer and spring in the car will be brand new. How can a bag full of bolts, nuts and washers cost so much? Second, my lovely wife of almost 35 years was dead set against me buying an Avanti. Her thought process was that my mid-life crisis could be settled by travel or grandkids. Obviously she just didn't get it. So, when I went out and bought the car, I had it holed up in a self storage garage for a couple of months until I got her to calm down enough to let me put it in our own garage. It has been in there for about 4 months now and she had not so much as looked at it - until the other day. Now all of a sudden the car is "cute." And, yesterday she announces that she wishes I would hurry up and get the car done so she can sell her car and drive my Avanti. Has hell frozen over or something? I must have missed the apocalypse. She must be possessed. The 180 caught me so off guard I almost passed out. After I settled down, I let the subject slip away and got a movie out to distract her. But, today she is at it again. "Don't you have a bunch of nuts and bolts for your car to go buy? You should go and get them before the parts store closes." I can see it now. Somehow I am going to have to end up with 2 of these cars if I want one to drive myself. I am going to need a bigger garage.

The only issue about the car today is that the brake fairy still hasn't delivered the rest of the parts or put the brakes on the back axle of the car. Bummer!

[Guest BobSpin]

I still don't have the parking brake levers, but expect them soon. I finally received some of the last important parts for the engine and it is now ready to be installed. As soon as some laborers become available it will be dropped in, bolted up, and ready for the extras. Which also means finding some more missing parts in Avantiland. I did take a moment to have some fun and make the car more official looking. I obtained a rear license plate mount and it is now installed on the car. Original black California plates with tags that show the car has not been registered since 1969. Unfortunately a Studebaker dealer license frame that was to go on as well, snapped in half. The two halves fit together perfectly with almost no cracks showing so I hope to be able to get them put back together. It would be a shame not to be able to use the frame.

[NCReatta]

There were 5 versions of the Avanti. R1 with a 289 Studebaker engine w/carburator-240hp, R2 - 289w/supercharger-290hp, R3 - 304.5 W/supercharger-335hp, R4 - 304.5 w/2 carbs-280hp, & R5 - dual superchargers-575hp. The R4&R5 weren't sold to the public. You could order one with a variety of options - air cond., power steering, power windows, regular or quiet exhaust, a little fancier interior and different differential ratios. There were 2418 actual 1963s built.

I'm almost positive they never made an R-5. You could make one yourself, but they never came from the factory that way. Sold to the public or otherwise.

On the other hand, with the R-4, they only made 12 of these. Ever.

My grandfather (an Avanti nut. Currently 2 '63 R-3 supercharged, one '69, and a '88 vert. and formerly a '63 with the R-4.)

Has an R-4 that he put back together (it had been taken apart, and it's various components put in other Stude engines.).

BUt like I said, they never made an R-5. and R-4s are extremely rare.

[unimogjohn]

Bob, it has been a couple of weeks. How is the Avanti reconstruction going? Making any progress on the brakes?

[Guest Double M]

Always loved the Avanti. Since I was a little marble. I pass a stripped down one sitting at a gas station out on Long Island every week and hope it gets its day someday.

[Guest BobSpin]

Actually there was an R5 - it was an experimental car. See Avanti Technical Specifications - R3 Engines and from Avanti Media - Hot Cars / Dream Machine - There are five versions in all. Firstly, there is the basic 240-bhp R1 and the 290-bhp R2 fitted with a Paxton supercharger. The 335-bhp R3 has a supercharger and a higher compression ratio, the 280-bhp R4 is a twin-carb, four-barrel version and the experimental R5 has twin blowers and fuel injection to produce 575 bhp. The post-Studebaker Avanti IIs use Chevrolet engines. A google search for the R5 will give you more info.

[Guest BobSpin]

Sorry about not posting. I finally got the correct brake parts just in time to go out of town for some R&R. Sat in a chair on the Pacific Ocean for a week. I hope to have the brakes finished in the next couple of days and the car on the ground. I have some help coming over to do my heavy work - I have a bad back, so when it gets to moving or lifting heavier items, I end up on a help needed waiting list. Once the brakes are on I expect the engine and transmission to be installed. Then comes the real fun. There are lots and lots of little parts, brackets, etc. that are missing and finding those is going to be a real scavenger hunt. The fuel tank is out and I had hoped that it could be cleaned at home. Wrong - too much dried fuel. It will soon be off to a shop for a boil out and sealing. Even though the body is in perfect condition outside where it shows, there are a couple of areas under the hood that need to be touched up before the engine goes in. I found an automotive paint shop locally that can match the paint - if I pull off something as large as the fuel door and take it to them for their computer to read. I hope to get that done this weekend.

[NCReatta]

Actually there was an R5 - it was an experimental car. See Avanti Technical Specifications - R3 Engines and from Avanti Media - Hot Cars / Dream Machine - There are five versions in all. Firstly, there is the basic 240-bhp R1 and the 290-bhp R2 fitted with a Paxton supercharger. The 335-bhp R3 has a supercharger and a higher compression ratio, the 280-bhp R4 is a twin-carb, four-barrel version and the experimental R5 has twin blowers and fuel injection to produce 575 bhp. The post-Studebaker Avanti IIs use Chevrolet engines. A google search for the R5 will give you more info.

But there wasn't a production R-5, and there's probably only one, and the chance that it still exists is slim to none. And the hp the R-4 can be tuned to is good enough for anyone to handle. OTOH, the R-3 is the real power house. one of the '63 R-3s my grandfather owns was the fastest car in NC at one point. At one of the Studebaker National meets in South Bend, it ran a few sprints with the Plain Brown Wrapper down main street. PBW won by a bit, only because it was a lighter car. The R-4 was an option in '64, but it was never put into any production Avantis due to the shut down of the company.

The Avanti II's used the Chevy 327 Corvette engine, which later evolved to the 350, the 400 then the 305. They used original Studebaker chassis until 1987. Then they started placing the bodies on Monte Carlo chassis and running gear. These had the 305.

With the AVX, they used late model Mustang chassis and running gear.

Edited November 6, 2010 by NCReatta (see edit history)

[Guest BobSpin]

Won't be much progress for some time. :mad: Help is not available for the unforseeable future which means that anything heavy won't get done. Injuries to my spine restrict my ability to do as much of the work as I want to do. So I will concentrate on touch ups of the interior - the fawn spray touch up I bought from Studebaker Int. matches perfectly so I can do the light weight stuff until the cavalry arrives. Took the gas door to an automotive paint specialty shop today for a computerized paint match can of spray and bottle of brush touch up. Should be ready by Monday. Can't wait to see if they are as good as they claim.

[Guest BobSpin]

Boy was I surprised this week. The calvary came and installed the engine in my Avanti. It is sitting in place for the first time for at least 25 years. Feels good to have it installed. Automatic transmission is all bolted up and the crossmember is in place. This was a major milestone, because I really hadn't expected to be able to get the engine installed for a couple more months. Now that the guys are gone though, I am looking at the way the engine sits and something is wrong. The left side is sitting too close to the brake booster which keeps the valve cover from going on. Must be an alignment problem of some sort, but I haven't found anything in the literature or on the web about it. The front mounts are sitting in the outside holes and the rear mounts are correct with the spacer on the left side so I don't understand the problem. The only thing that looks out of order are the front mounts. They seem to be leaning outward like they should have gone into the inside holes on the frame mount. Got to figure this one out and get the rescue team back to straighten it out.

[Roger Zimmermann]

I suppose you have the shop manual; it says: "The (front) supports are always mounted in the rear set of holes in the braket"

According to one of your pictures, the shop manual is wrong as the holes are not front/rear located, but sidewise...

While doing my Avanti model, I noticed that the space between the booster and LH stud for the valve cover is a tight fit. As it is a model, I could "arrange" the situation. For a real car, you may be forced to remove or loose the booster to install the valve cover.

When I was doing the Avanti model, I had many difficulties to find decent pictures from the engine bay or other details. Now, the model is completed since 8 months and I find plenty of Avantis under restoration!

I'm building now a Continental Mark II; even if I have the possibility to look at cars not far away from home, they are dirty and assembled, hiding many details. I'm sure, when I will be ready some years from now, I will see many Mark II under restoration!

[Guest BobSpin]

You are right about the shop manual. I have found that it leaves a lot to be desired. The best source of information has been people who are doing the same thing (restoring an Avanti) or those who sell the parts. I probably have over a hundred photos I have downloaded from the internet showing various parts on the car. It helps, but as you found, since the cars are assembled, you don't always get a good look. I found a reference on the internet about the front mounts. It talks about left hand and right hand drive cars and which side the engine mounts go in. Dave T. was also a big help with this. With the engine now sitting in the right side holes on the front mounts, there is just enough room to squeeze the valve cover in - but the brake booster does have to be pulled a little to the side. It can be done without taking any parts off - thank goodness. Doesn't take much effort, but it works. Now that I have had time to think about it, when I was 16 my first car was a Lark with the 259. I had the same problem with that side valve cover.

[Roger Zimmermann]

Now that I have had time to think about it, when I was 16 my first car was a Lark with the 259. I had the same problem with that side valve cover.

It's no surprise: the Lark frame is, with the exception of a few details, the same as the one of the Avanti.

Glad you solved this problem!

[Guest BobSpin]

Boy, it's been a while. Too little time for everthing. But progress has been made. A couple of weeks ago I started the beast after it sleeping since 1969. What an experience. It didn't take long. I had to figure out whether I had an early or late model with a jumper between the starter solenoid and the ballast resistor, but once I figured that out, it started on the first turn of the key. I ran it for about 20 to 30 seconds and shut it down. Then checked the oil. I had put 4 qts of transmission fluid in to start filling the torque converter as the rebuilder had suggested. I added a couple of more quarts and fired it up again. I ran it through the gears and felt it try to move when I put it in gear. I haven't been this excited about a car since I was a teenager and put a 289 Cobra in an Austin Healy 3000 - but that's another story. After letting the car get used to it's new status as one that can actually start, I tried to move it forward. I started out of the garage and got to the edge where the driveway starts a pretty good downhill and stopped. I was thinking that I better try reverse before I go down the hill. Glad I did. The car acted like it was going to move but no-go. I shut it down and called the transmission shop. I ended up actually driving it to their shop a week and a half ago. They pulled parts, tested and called me and said that even after they replaced some parts it failed a road test. What a bummer. Getting it started was almost too easy. Now it's in a shop and looking a some level of another rebuild in the transmission. Hope to get it back soon. When I do, there are only two things preventing me from a good test drive in the country. I need to install the power steering pump and get the power windows working. The later being the real problem. The circuitry under the hood for the power window lift motor relay and circuit breaker is all missing. I have been looking all over for the parts and no one seems to have them. Anyone have any ideas or have any extras they want to part with?

[sambarn]

Congratulations on the car starting.Trannys are a bear and I am completely unable to do anything on an automatic so I feel your pain. As far as the window hardware, the Avanti should share much with the other Studes but there is also a hotrod accessory power window kit out there that allows you to put power windows in any car. I've heard great things about their function but am completely ignorant as to who makes them etc.. An old friend of my father drove an R2 for years and I always loved that car so I've enjoyed watching your progress and vicariously reliving that car. Good Luck.

[Guest BobSpin]

What a week. Up and down every day. After almost 3 months of looking I found the power window lift relay and some other small under the hood parts I have been looking for. That's the good part. The bad part - the Avanti still sits at the transmission shop. Apparently the valve body was no good and they have had a heck of a time finding one. I gave them a copy of the SI Transmission parts section and about 20 phone numbers. They ordered two different valve bodies and neither was the right one, so after I gave them the phone numbers they say they found one in Massachusetts. Since that's were Dave T. is I am guess he is the one that had the part. They tell me I should get the car back toward the end of next week. I am keeping my fingers crossed that they don't need any more hard to come by parts. It's summer and I am missing some drive time now that the car is running.

[Guest BobSpin]

What a bummer. The Avanti has now been at the transmission shop for 3 weeks. I have had to cancel other appointments to have some work done and I am really bummed about missing some prime drive time. If the shop doesn't get the tranny working soon I think I might have to rethink the stock approach and just have it converted to a new 5 speed manual.

[Guest BobSpin]

I still have a heck of a long way to go, but I finally got the Avanti back on Friday evening from the transmission shop working great. I took it to a small pcnic and classic car show the next morning. Even though it still needs interior work and a new suspension, it was a blast. The engine purred. I am really glad I ordered the medium tone mufflers when I go the new stainless steel exhaust, because as I pulled up it was obvious everyone could hear me coming. The day was great and the Avanti drew a lot of lookers and comments. Then came time to put it back in the garage. When I pulled up to the house I started getting noise from the tranny and, although it works, it makes a lot of noise forward and backward - so it is going back to the shop again. It was a lot of fun while it lasted. Hopefully it will be a small fix and I will be off and running again. I am attaching some pictures taken at the show.

[unimogjohn]

Bob, your Avanti looks great. Glad that you have it moving again. Hope that your transmission woes are behind you.

I did see one thing incorrect in your engine bay. Your throttle rod is hooked up incorrectly. Should be under the rear plate rather than over it. Also the gap must be adjusted. I have attached a couple of pics. One is my engine with the correct position of the rod and then the page out of the repair manual that shows how to measure the gap. There is a screw for the adjustment. Let me know if you need anything else from the manual.

[Guest BobSpin]

John, Thank you for pointing out my linkage error. It was one of those, I'm so glad to be almost ready to start it, I overlooked the manual. I am using the Edelbrock 1406 and still have some fine tuning to do on it. But I have the original Carter AFB and the original distributor. Got a converted electronic distributor from Dave T. and love how easily the car starts.

[Guest BobSpin]

The Avanti has been back and forth to the transmission shop. Apparently the valve body had been flattened out a bit and that's why there was no reverse. It works great now, except the speedometer quit working. The drive gear got stripped some time during the workout. Since they have offered to replace it, I will take them up on it. New issue is power steering. I have been looking at the parts blowup and the service manual and I thought I had it figured out. Except one problem. When installed, the pump will sit too far forward by about 3/4" nto 1". When I bought the car, the pump was in a box and had a "Rebuilt" tag on it. There were no hoses or other mounts. I ordering the missing hoses, mount and bolts from SI, but something just isn't right. The pump doesn't measure for a correct fit. Anyone have a good close up photo of their installed pump? Maybe I am missing something in laying out the parts. It will soon be off to the shop again, but I don't want to pay a mechanic to try and figure out the correct installation.

[unimogjohn]

Bob, will run out to the Avanti tomorrow/Tuesday and take some pic for you.

[Guest BobSpin]

John,

Thank you. I figure I must be either missing a part or I have too many. Things just don't line up. I look forward to the pictures.

[unimogjohn]

Bob, here you go. Let me know if you need any other views. I can run it up on ramps to get better pics of the steering box.

[Guest BobSpin]

Thanks for the photos John. Unfortunately according to the pictures, my pump is correctly mounted. With the adjustment bolts/nuts loose it won't move to tighten up the belt. There is even room in the mount slots for it to move. And when I start the engine it makes a horrible loud scream. Right now I don't know if it's because the belt won't tighten correctly or if the pump rebuild was bad. Everything else seems to work - steering gets a lot easier when I have tried it. Even though adjustment doesn't seem to be possible I am wondering if I have the correct belt. I have a Napa 7380 - which they told me is the same as a Gates 7380. The belt is 38 5/8" on the outside dianmeter. A listing at RockAuto has a belt for a 63 Avanti but says it's 37.5" on the outside diameter. I am lost once again.

[Guest bofusmosby]

Bob

For what its worth, when I went down to get a fan belt for my 37 Pontiac, they sold me the one that they said crossed from the original number. Well, it didn't fit. It took me 3 tries to finally get a belt that was corrcet for my car.

[unimogjohn]

Bob, here are some numbers for you.

Power Steering Belt

OE #1548513:

GATES 7380

DAYCO 13375

GOODYEAR 13371

[D Yaros]

Would you Avanti gurus educate me with respect to the RI, R3 thing when it comes to Avantis? Is there such a thing as an R2? I never see it mentioned. What does R_ represent? Thanks.