Trying again, help

[Owen_Dyneto]

Thanks for the confirmation about the 4-speed synchro in 1932, and that it's synchro on the top 2, not the top 3 as I'd heard. Is you car an early car?

As to why the 4 speed was dropped, it's pretty simple, it simply wasn't needed. The "low" was so low as to be unnecessary (as witnessed by most folks not even knowing it was there) and as engine power increased, it became even more unnecessary.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Yes, I guess most of the Mud-puddles, they called roads back then, were being filled in by '32. And probably few people that could afford a Packard, would be using it to pull tree-stumps.

Except here in the southwest, where there were mostly wagon-trails, cow-paths, big bolders and a lot of Stumps.

Ah, the 'Good ol' Days'.

[Owen_Dyneto]

This has been a pretty interesting exchange on the transmission history. I had always been a bit dubious about the short-lived 4-speed synchro, despite the article on it in PAC many years ago (I'd love to have one in my 34 Eight along with a high speed rear) but am convinced now. Since the Light Eight introduction brochure which was printed well in advance of the actual production specified a 3-speed synchro transmission, I guess the obvious conclusion must be that initial production capacity for the new 3-speed wasn't enough for all the 32 cars and the Eights, Super Eights and perhaps the 12s soldiered on with one of the 2 4-speed units until such time as production caught up to need.

[tbirdman]

What I had always thought was the 3 speed was introduced halfway through the model year but the light 8 and the twin six came out from the beginning with only a 3 speed.

Not sure if mine is an early or late car though it was delivered late in the model year per the data plate.

The three speed also was quieter.

[Guest BillP]

Owen, what is the axle ratio on your Eight? My car was originally sold into hilly Pittsburgh. I don't know if the customer had the opportunity to specify a number or if it was a dealer order, but in any event, the car was built with 4.69:1 gears. It was also supplied with a HC head.

With a 4.69, I sure don't need a granny gear!

[Owen_Dyneto]

My 34 Eight was sold new in Brooklyn, New York and has the 4.69 rear axle, as did the vast majority of closed car Eights. Most of the open bodied style Eights were 4.36 with an occasional 4.07. Ratios for the Super 8 and Twelve were 4.06, 4.41, 4.69 and 5.07. In my opinion based on driving many of these cars, the Super 8s and Twelves more easily accomodate a high speed rear than the Eight; in the latter case you spend a lot of time downshifting on modest grades. Though a bit of a chore and highly non-authentic, an overdrive is a better option on an Eight for a more roadworthy car than a high speed rear. I've owned this car for nearly 45 years and have put close to 50,000 miles on it, but try to avoid Interstates and generally drive no faster than 55 mph, 50 preferred.

[Guest BillP]

Thanks, Owen; as usual very informative and of interest. Not to highjack Cooter's thread here, but we're mostly talking sedans and maybe that's OK.

I'm not prying but just curious; over 45 years and 50,000 miles, what sort of major repairs have been required? Engine apart, radiator recored, clutch, brakes, all that stuff. Any parts chasing nightmares or triumphs? What condition was the car when you got it?

BTW, here's a pic of mine:

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Hello Bill, Is that You?

(I was Hopein' there was a Good-lookin' Woman, sitting in your car, but 'No Such Luck')

[Owen_Dyneto]

BillP: I bought it from the original owner in 1964 with about 40,000 miles. It was in superb original condition and to this day still shows well (2nd in Touring at a recent CCCA Grand Classic) and still 75% original and unmolested.

I've given the car meticulous maintenance over the years, and usually each winter season I pick one or two items to check over. For example, last year I serviced the B-K power brake units, the year before I checked out the generator, starter and distributor, replacing brushes and cleaning.

In terms of major work I did some upper end engine service at about 45,000 miles including a valve grind, new rings on expanded pistons, and rod babbitt. At 90,000 I finally went for a full engine rebuild, rebore w/new pistons, mains and rods repoured and well as timing chain, cam follower rollers, new clutch, etc. I did one brake job at about 65,000 miles. The car has been utterly reliable with only one breakdown, broke a rear axle shaft just after coming home from the Centennial in Warren OH in 1999. I've driven many, many bona-fide Classics and this is one of the sweetest to drive, reasonably snappy, agile, terrific brakes, etc. Send me a PM with your email if you want to exchange more info, I always like hearing from others with similar cars. I'll attach a recent photo if I can figure out how.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Owen, looks like you were also at the Same Lake, Bill was.

Are you two sure you don't really have the same car, and don't Know it ???

Oops, No, I see some different Pin-stripes.

[cooter9]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jjohnb</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cooter,

I haven't had too much time to check in lately, did you happen to hear why the seller ended the auction early on the 1930 726? I'm assuming someone made him an offer outside of Ebay? I am curious about the amount he accepted. The phateon he was selling sold for a little less than I expected also. </div></div>

Not sure about the 1930 but it sure was nice and I love that model. But my personal opinion is it's valued around $45K. I've been reading this thread and have some questions. I've only driven a 39 Packard as far as pre-war Packards and have much too learn on these cars. Anyway, I know the 30 was the 4 speed with super low next to 1st gear. But my question is: Can you down-shift in these cars when coming to stop or slowing down? Can you down-shift to 1st gear and let the clutch out while still slowing down or do you need to be completely stopped?

[Owen_Dyneto]

Downshifting a crash box takes LOTS and LOTS of practice, matching engine (transmission input) speed to the speed of the gear your selecting. But to downshift into 1st, which as previously noted is very low, you'd need a lot of engine rpm and still probably have to be under 5 mph, so what's the benefit even if you could do it?

[cooter9]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Owen_Dyneto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Downshifting a crash box takes LOTS and LOTS of practice, matching engine (transmission input) speed to the speed of the gear your selecting. But to downshift into 1st, which as previously noted is very low, you'd need a lot of engine rpm and still probably have to be under 5 mph, so what's the benefit even if you could do it? </div></div>

OK let me try to clarify what I meant. I'm not talking about very low 1st gear but regular 1st gear. I mean if I'm cruising at 50 and have to slow down can I simply down-shift to the necessary gear for whatever speed I've slowed down to? I thought if you if you down-shifted to normal 1st gear and simply let out clutch that it would damage the tranny. Am I amking sense with this question? Just trying to learn.

[R W Burgess]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">........let out clutch that it would damage the tranny.... </div></div>

It would drag the rear wheels the first few times you did it , before it actually ruined the transmission.

Racing/revving the engine would prevent that, but what's the point. Generally speaking, your engine has enough torque to just "chug" around turns in second gear.

Wayne

[Guest imported_Speedster]

My Method for shifting Gears Is:

Only shift gears when you absolutely Need to,

And sometimes not even Then. LOL

Cause I hate that Grinding Sound.

[tbirdman]

If you are doing 50, you should be in 4th gear, so you can downshift to 3rd because of the synchros. I never downshift to 2nd unless I'm at a stop. I only use 2nd thru 4th and get to 4th rather quickly after stating from a stop.

[cooter9]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tbirdman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you are doing 50, you should be in 4th gear, so you can downshift to 3rd because of the synchros. I never downshift to 2nd unless I'm at a stop. I only use 2nd thru 4th and get to 4th rather quickly after stating from a stop. </div></div>

OK so technically 1st is super low, 2nd is next to 1st on bottom left of H pattern. Then 3rd is top right of H pattern and 4th is bottom right of H pattern. I only should shift down from 4th to 3rd and never anything else, right? I should only go down to 2nd if I have to stop?

[Guest imported_Speedster]

You can also go directly from 2nd (low) to 4th (high) (lower left to lower right of H), when upshifting, if on level ground. Much easier that way. (can also shift from High to Low when downshifting) This is definitely the best way if in traffic, with a lot of starts and stops.

Listening to the sound of engine is the best way of knowing when you need to shift up or down.

The main one you forget to do, is shifting to low (2nd on 4-speed) when stopping. At least it is for me, after driving automatics for a while. And the sound of engine will tell you Real Quick.