carmover

Leon, I am planning to pull start the car pretty soon I have got to get the winch on my trailer wired and me and a friend are going to take it to an abandoned grocery store and try to pull start it.I live in a rural area and it would be too dangerous to do it on these roads.This should clear it up for as to whether it is too tight or starter system issues once and for all.

Leon the shop didn't do a torque test they did a test of the brushes and the armature.The starter was completely remanufactured less than 2 years ago. Ronnie

Here is the pictures of the brush in contact and the gears all the way back and meshing with the flywheel and the meter shows 6 volts at the starter brushes.

Rod the 20 is easier to see the flywheel than the 25 but I know I had it meshed manually when I put the pry bar and moved it over because it came all the way to the back of the housing and the brushes were in contact to the commutator everything is assembled properly.the water pump and the shaft turns perfectly.The only thing that I took out of the starter gear box was the fork and the tapered shaft which I reassembled perfectly and as said in earlier post is the starter/gen was tested at a shop and so was the battery.When you turn on the switch the armature starts rotating as it should but when it meshes it stops and does nothing else.It doesn't even try to start the engine.the gears are spinning and sliding like they should.I have tried it with the battery cables and the jumper cables and even tried it with both cables[ battery cables and jumper cables] and tested the start brushes with a meter and am getting 6 volts.As far as the engine being too tight with the plugs out I can crank it round and round about 4 turns before I tire out but with the plugs in I have to lift the crank and push it down with all my muscle.

When I said the starter was hot I meant that it was getting the right voltage.There is nothing wrong with the starter.I also stated that the brushes are in contact with the commutator and the gears are meshed with the flywheel and still nothing is happening. and it starting to make me drift back to the engine being too tight or something and the clutch is not down and it is in neutral and the clutch and transmission has nothing to do with it.From What I see is it has everything that it is supposed to have and still does not work and it is very frustrating.

Rod,when I said armature I meant comutaters and the brushes were in contact .when it was at the shop it ran but it won't run on the car with the same configuration as it did at the shop.and it is getting 6 volts at the brushes.The start /gen had a complete rebuild less than 2 years ago which included a rewound armature and new comutaters and brushes and also new bushings and a machined roller.this was a $2500.00 complete rebuild and when I tore the car down 4 months ago the whole start system was working perfectly and I have done nothing but remove it and reinstall it.

Rod, I already know that,but the problem that I am speaking of is the brushes are correctly on the armature and the armature is hot and nothing is happening.I put a meter on the armature and it shows a full 6 volts.I removed the start pedal and with a pry bar I manually pulled the shaft back and nothing happened after the brushes dropped and contacted the armature.I thought that would make the starter come alive but nothing happened.I know something is wrong on the pedal assembly but shouldn't it start manually as I have described ? The shaft was all of the way back and the brushes were on the hot armature.

Well I fixed the bad ground connection and stepped on the pedal and it did not turn the motor.When the shop manually worked the brushes it spun the starter real fast so everything was working like it should.I decided to get my Wife to push the starter while I watched the brushes and when she pushed the pedal the brushes did not come all the way down to the armature.I thought that I finally found the problem so I removed the starter pedal and manually worked the gears into mesh and the brushes appear to be touching the armature as best as I can tell.When I put power to it it did nothing.What is going on ?This is driving me crazy!

Here are some rare pictures of my 25A with the real glass windows installed.I don't put them in very often.

I converted mine to electric a couple of years ago and I have been real happy with it.I kept the canister plumbed up to look original. The old carb Doc rebuilt the carb and upgraded the needle and seat to a rochester which can stand up to 3 pounds of pressure.I used a delco pump and a holley drag racing regulator.The car so far is real happy with this set up and I am too.

Don that's a real nice Roadster,I love the top it gives an elegant look to it! Ronnie

Brian, That is a Beautiful car,I 've got cabin fever too.I have been waiting on the weather up north to thaw out so I can get up there and bring my 23 Buick sedan home.

Gary that is a beautiful car,I wish you luck on getting it back on the road Ronnie

You are right about that Brian,I love how people go about solving problems on these old cars and how everybody jumps in with sugestions and input on how to fix them.And I know we are all in the same boat and these cars can really be a challenge.

Gary, good luck on your first startup and please get us some pictures , I would love to see it! Ronnie

I finally figured it out today and as all of you have heard the statement live and learn I am ashamed to say that I should have checked the small stuff first.This morning I went to the machine shop that built my engine and brought him to my shop to check and see if the engine was too tight.He tried it and said it was just like it should be and like all of the rest of us thought it was in the starting system. I took out the battery and we went by a shop that has been in business since the stone age and works on anything that is electric from automobiles to train engines.The tested the battery and it checked out perfect even when they put a load on it.The told me to go and get the start/gen and bring it back to them and they would check it out.They tested it and showed me how it works and they energized it and the starter came alive when the the 6 volts was put to it.They gave it a clean bill of health also but they had on thing the wanted me to do.They said to go back and install the start gen but not to hook up any wires or or the battery leads.They said to hook up the hot lead of a jumper cable to the hot post on the s/gen and the ground lead to the bolt on the bottom and try the starter.It turned out to be a bad ground cable end on the battery ground lead.I am sitting here happy but embarassed !

The starter was completely rebuilt by Jason Smith less than 2 years ago.This was a complete rebuild New bushings ,rewound armature a new commutator and new brushes and a new machined roller for the brushes.When I removed the start gen about 5 months ago the starter was turning the motor perfectly.Everything in the start system has been checked and rechecked and all gears and shaft is working perfectly The starter was bench tested and works fine.I feel the same as everybody else does that the starter should at least turn the engine over with the plugs out.There is one other thing that could be happening is the battery.I use a n Optima gel 6 volt battery and have the proper battery maintainer.When I put the battery back in the car for the restart I bent the ground post and bent it back using a small hammer.I was pretty sure that I damaged the battery so I hooked up the maintainer up and it annilized the battery and gave it a clean bill of health and I let it charge to a full charge and it is now in the monitoring mode.i ran another test on the hot post and I am getting a full 6 volts.I hate to buy a 6 volt battery unless I need too but I might buy a cheap lead/acid one to try.I put a compression guage on one of the cyllinders And tried to turn it with the crank and when it reached the top of it's stroke it would stop me for a second and I was unable to crank it round and round,but all of the cyllinders open with the plugs out I can crank it around three or four times before it wears me out.

The starter won't turn it over at all even with the plugs out.When the starter meshes it stops.

Well I checked and repaired any starter possible problems and everything checks out fine but the car still won't turn over.I am thinking you guys are right about the engine being too tight.I talked with my engine builder today and he wan'ts me to do a compression test with the hand crank on one cyllinder.He thinks that the cam is advanced too much causing too much compression.If that turns out not to be the case he said he could come to my shop and check the mains and rods and do whatever is needed to get the old girl up and running again.I will keep everyone posted.I can turn the crank round and round like an ice cream freezer with the plugs out but it is tight enough to wear me out after about for revolutions.With the plugs in you can't hardly turn it.

JFranklin, I am sorry about that I thought I answered your question.The starter motor is not turning at all and I have determined that the pedal has some freeplay in it as I explained in the earlier post that is causing the shaft to not com back far enough to allow the brushes to contact the armature so the starter can't energise and turn the motor.I have since my last post removed the start gen combination and removed the fork and cone shaft and have carefully removed all of the slack from the starter pedal.This also gave me a chance to check out the gears that mesh to the flywheel and they are all free spinning and easily sliding back and meshing

Terry, It is not all that tight and it can be turned by the hand crank.The start gears were sticky feeling and I cleaned them and lubricated them and now they slide and spin freely like the should.At some point in this cars life the little casting that the starter pedal lever sits down in broke off and somebody made a repair using a small medal strip that they brazed one end and and used 2 small screws to mount it .The last time I had this same problem it was from to much freeplay in the starter pedal that wouldn't let the shaft com back far enough to mesh or let the brushes contact the armature.I took the piece out and carefully bent the end up taking all of the freeplay out and that fixed it . After checking it this morning I found an inch of freeplay in the starter pedal and the brushes not coming in contact with the armature.I think that in tearing the car down for the rebuild the heavy spring pressure on the starter pedal bent the piece a little bit as I was removing the pedal assembly.I think this will fix it I will keep everyone posted.One other thing on the engine being to tight I had a profesional racecar engine builder build me up a shortblock and he used a lot of assembly lube and I have lubed everythng real good before I put the pan on so I am hoping everything is going to be ok. With the plugs out I can turn the engine easily but with the plugs in it is more difficult like you would expect from the new compression.

The starter won't turn it at all.I can turn it over with the crank with the plugs out easily but harder with the plugs in. The gears for the starter can be turned by hand but feel real sticky and it has been discussed on this forum before that those gears must slide and turn freely.

It will turn over with the hand crank with the spark plugs out but is pretty tight with the plugs in.it is in perfect timing and firing order.I have an optima 6 volt gel battery and it annalized at 95%charge and I charged it up to 100% still no luck.All connections are clean and tight and all lights and both horns work perfectly

I have my freshly rebuilt engine in my 25 Buick Standard.Today I was ready to start it for the first time and when I stepped on the start pedal pedal did not turn the engine.I have checked to wiring and all wiring is hooked up correctly and tight.I took the cover off of the start /gen and the cover plate off of the start gears and when you turn on switch the start /gen armature starts to turn but when it meshes the starter armature stops.I can see the brushes are raising and lowering like they should.The one thing that I did notice was the start gears are a little tight feeling.I can turn them but they have a little drag to them.I notice a little primer overspray on them.I am wondering if I can remove the gears and clean and lubricate them and polish the shaft with out too much trouble.