1937 Special charging drop

[dibarlaw]

After my 37 came back from the shop doing the driver restoration it was found that there was a battery drain. They had to know about it since after it was pulled into my garage the father told the son to be shure to disconnect the battery. After the final payment they left and I took it for a short drive. All seemed well about a 3 mile trip had my wife join me and took off again for a little further drive. This time on the return trip while waiting at a red light I noticed that the ammeter was swinging wildly and the engine stopped. I tried to restart but the battery barely growled...DEAD. Thank God for some good semeritans to help push us out of the busiest intersection during rush hour. When I towed it back home and after calming down,(that took about a week)! I checked battery ..GOOD but manny connections were loose. They installed New complete wiring harness from Road Island Wiring. The cable to starter nut I could remove with my fingers! I did an all around checking schematics/wiring diagrams and retightening. I thought I would try again. Takes about 6 pumps to get enough fuel to start. But it starts right up without excessive starter work. They were reluctant to do any further work on the carb (a "MARVEL") since Jim Alexandro rebuilt it 20 years ago and was just put on. Citing throttle shaft leakage and accelerator pump seals as them not able to get it to run any smoother. The starter and generator were rebuild 20 years ago also and were just put into service.

This is what it's doing.

At start up, fast idle, the ammeter shows full charge. Within 2 min meter flutters and drops to 0.

What I have done

I replaced the 30 year plus old plug wires. Several were pinched badly in the cover.

Saw that the coil polarity was reversed. Fixed.

Also starter leads incorrectly placed. Fixed.

Adjusted points to .015 they were about .019.

Removed the original 5 terminal voltage regulator and cleaned contacts. Insulated selonoid lead (showed burned) was touching resistor. Repaired.

I reinstalled the regulator and is still doin the same thing. No inprovement in running

I have annother similar NOS 5 terminal Delco regulator just about identical except mounting is 90 deg off. When I removed the resistor on my original unit it checks at aprox 13 ohms same as the NOS one. When resistor is remounted in unit it shows 1-2 ohms. The NOS still shows 13 ohms.

Could this be the problem or possibly the coil ?

Larry

[Daves1940Buick56S]

Larry

I assume you polarized the gen, or the shop did

You could check the coil - across the primary, primary to ground, secondary to 1 of the pri terms, and sec to ground

You could swap out the voltage reg temporarily and just rig it in place - make sure it has a good connx to ground

You need to find out if there is a heavy drain on the batt or the gen is not putting out anything - I have a wicked cool shunt device that you put on the pos term - you close the shunt, start, then open the shunt - there is a 0.01 ohm manyWatt resistor and you basically read the voltage drop and use Ohm's law to calculate current in or out. I bought this many yrs ago, maybe Ebay will have something like this?

Cheers, Dave

[Guest Grant Magrath]

If it were me, I'd be looking for something that reacts to heat. Something's getting warm, expanding, and making contact with something it shouldn't.

Cheers

Grant

[jeff]

I hate to suggest this, but I am beginning to believe that batteries sometimes have some flakey failure modes. They may seem to take a charge from your garage charger, but could still have some internal issues. (high resistance, partial shorts, sulfation, whatever) Especially in old cars when they don't get used too often. You might want to try a new battery. I have chased a few gremlins, then later found out a new battery makes the whole system work well. We all tend to pass over the first step in the diagnostic procedure, which is: "make sure battery is in good condition and fully charged".

Jeff

[dibarlaw]

Jeff:

The shop also put in a new Interstate battery. Now 5 months old. Specific gravity about 1300 and reads full charge. It is hard to tell if there is a short as the ammeter shows a slight discharge even with the battery disconnected. Just below the zero point.

I know about Gremblins!! My 1987 S-10 right side turn signals went out. The first thing I checked were the operation of all the light bulbs. All stops, park and flashers worked. So both filaments on the 1157s were OK?? I invested in a new switch. then spent a day making up pullers etc to tear apart the steering column. Replaced..what a nightmare! STILL DID NOT WORK!! Re checked the rear tail again.. BAD BULB! Then this past week my 1925-25 Buick's combination switch was throwing the breaker on the lighting side. I had rebuilt the switch last spring. So again checked the bulbs all showed ok. Tore out switch again took off one lead at a time on the switch till the breaker stopped tripping. Lead #4 Tail light! Pulled out the bulb which cheked ok. Replaced with new one and problem solved!!. Both defective bulbs would light on both filaments when voltage applied. But there was a high resistance short within the bulb itself.

GREMBLINS!

larry

[dibarlaw]

Well this is what I have done to the 37 to locate the trouble this week. I made up an adapter for a NOS Delco Remy regulator #5592. 90 deg off from my #5807. It has the same specs as shown in the Jan 1937 Delco Remy service manual. And is for negative ground. I hooked it up and the ammeter then pegged discharge...So I quickly disconnected then reinstalled my #5807. Same reaction... pegs charge for about 1min then starts to swing wildly then lands on 0 for a while then pegs discharge then 0. I removed the engine groundstrap, cleaned all contact points and reinstalled. I tried another coil. All same reaction.

Could the vacuum starter switch be a cause? I have had to jiggle the lever on top at times when it did not make good contact. to engage the starter. My next stop will be the generator. There were some issues noted in the 37 Buick service buletins. Again it was "rebuilt "20 years ago an only put back into service in Aug. Don't know if it was ever repolarized.

Larry

[dibarlaw]

Thought I would try a more basic solution to my non charging situation on my 37. After cleaning and tightening all the loose connections and redoing the incorrectly placed ones on the new wiring harness (as installed by the "restoration shop"). Then cleaning and checking the regulator. Same problem. My next step was to remove the generator and have the place that rebuilt it 20 years ago recheck.(It was just installed for the first time in Aug.) Before I fought to take it off again I checked the fan belt. I could move the generator pulley easily and the bracket adjustment was at its limit. I had included an older NOS belt to be installed when the other work was done. They put the old cracked, stretched and glased one that was on the car when I drove it home in 1987. I went to "Central Tractor" and bought a new belt and installed. It is now showing charge more uniformly. Since Sept I was afraid to try to drive it out of the garage after the break-down when it was first delivered home to me from the "restoration shop". So I got brave and took it out yesterday and did drive about 5 miles with no problem. The carb will still need attention. After I brought the 37 home I took "Beulah" (our 1925) out for some exercize also. (Still dealing with sticking clutch and oil leaking on to fan belt.) Today I thought we would drive the 37 to church then to grocery store which we did. On the way home it quit at the intersection near our home. I did get it restarted but there are still fuel issues. It sat for about an hour in front of the house. It started ok but when I turned it into the drive it started bucking and quit. I pumped the accelerator pump at the carb to get it restarted and it ran ok afterward to be able to back into garage. After warming up the ammeter is still hovering close to 0. But at least this time there was not a dead battery after 4 miles of driving.

Larry

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