Help identify my Grandfather's car!

[Guest ARhodes]

I have a photo dated 1918, showing my (then 16 year old) grandfather with his first car. He apparently got it in pieces and reassembled it himself. He later owned a garage with his brother. He sure looks ready to go racing.

I have no other information about the car other than it is supposedly a 1916 model year. It looks like a great car! Much more sporting appearing than most of the cars of 1916-1918. He did not have much money, so I am sure he did not spend much on its purchase.

Please help me identify the car and tell me where I can find modern photos of similar ones.

Here is a link to the photo:

http://tinyurl.com/2dp7gf7

I have since re-scanned the photo and enhanced it somewhat, so if anyone were interested, I can supply a somewhat better photo.

Tony Rhodes

Horsham, PA

Edited November 16, 2010 by ARhodes
update photo (see edit history)

[hddennis]

Tony, Thanks for posting your neat photo. Grandpa looks proud of his handy work, as well he should be. He sure put his own style on it and didn't leave us much of the original car to work with. From the firewall back is all his creation. That leaves us the hood, latches, radiator and maybe the headlights to work with. It's a big car and the only other feature I see is the rear spring style may help pin this down. I'm leaning toward Cadillac Or Buick but am only guessing and still need to find pictures to back up my guess. Someone here will know, good luck.

Howard Dennis

[Guest ARhodes]

Howard,

Thanks for the reply. I will check out some of the Cadillac pictures. Please do let me know if you have further ideas of the ID. I WISH I had more photos of this car, but this is the only one I have found in a pretty extensive archive of picturesd taken by his shutterbug brother, who was his partner in the garage business a few years after this photo was taken.

Now that you mention it, I seem to recall that my grandfather assembled the car at a relative's blacksmith shop. I did not think that he had fabricated any of his parts, just assembled readymade parts, but it makes total sense that he could have used the shop's fabrication facilities for custom work.

Now that I look a little harder at the photo, the sheetmetal cut behind the A pillar looks a little irregular, could be hand-made. I like the fit of the rear end to the seat.

He may have used his body fabrication skills in converting 1 or 2 sedans to be wreckers. I can upload some pictures of these in other threads. one of them was apparently made from a Packard

-Tony

[hddennis]

Tony, yes please do post those photos of his trucks. Some of these conversions were simply stunning and paved the way for the custom bodied service vehicles that came later.

Howard Dennis

[Guest ARhodes]

Howard,

I looked at some Cadillac photos. It could be a good match for the 1916 Type 53 roadster. But the vents on my GF's car seem slightly inclined and a little taller than the 53. But this may be an artifact of the perspective and wide angle view.

It looks as if he modified everything from the back of the hood to behind the seat. Maybe kept the rear end, though. The wheels seem to be a good match.

How did the performance of the Type 53 compare to most cars of the day? At a list price of $2080, it was quite a bit more expensive than a model T!

-Tony

[nzcarnerd]

Going from the style of hood louvres and the rear springs it is not Buick or Cadillac. Those rear springs look to be quarter elliptics. Cadillac used semi-elliptics and Buick used long cantilevers. Regarding the hood louvres - there appear to be only five and on a slight slope, that would be the clue. A pity we can't see the radiator. From what little we can see of it - rounded top and painted - the date of around 1915-16 for the car could be right. Are you sure the photo is 1918? That drum headlight looks more like something from 1922-23.

[Guest ARhodes]

Howard, I just look a look at some Buick photos. The hood is a better match to the Buick D44 roadster than the Cadillac. I also found some pix of a 1917 D44 "Raceabout". It seems as if my grandfather may have been trying to a similar look.

-Tony

Edited November 9, 2010 by ARhodes (see edit history)

[Layden B]

I don't think Buick used a quarter eliptic rear spring. Overland?

[Guest ARhodes]

Are you sure the photo is 1918? That drum headlight looks more like something from 1922-23.

I double checked the snapshot. I was a little mistaken about the date. It is listed as having been taken in 1919. Indicating that it was his 1916 hotrod. I doubt that the info was written in 1919. I presume it was written after 1940 possibly as late as about 1950. So I guess it is entirely possible that it was taken as late as 1922 but I would doubt much later. But I can't be sure of much other that what is written on the photo.

I agree that the louvers look slightly slanted. I had presumed there were more louvers hidden in the shadow in front of the visible louvers. The wheels look like a good match to those fitted in the photos of the 1916 caddy but I guess the same wheels were fitted to many makes. I will look hard at what little can be seen of the rear springs. I had assumed they were half elliptical types but I an definitely no expert in any way!

-Tony

[Layden B]

Chevrolet 490 with a headlamp update?

[Guest ARhodes]

Chevrolet 490 with a headlamp update?

OH Ho! Now that may be an idea!! I do have another shot of what I had thought was a different car, but now I see some distinct similarities! Your saying "Chevrolet" made me think of this photo. This might be the same car later on after a repaint, and apparently also after some engine problems.

I don't have a date for this photo, but it appears to be some time in the 20's

I can't identify the other cars in the photo. Note the unusual white paint on the "hotrod". All the rest of the cars are black! I will look for other photos of this car from other angles.

-Tony

EDIT: I looked at 490 photos and the slant on the louvers looks correct. It almost seems as if the height of the "hotrod" steering wheel is a little low. Maybe is got repositioned?

-T

Edited November 10, 2010 by ARhodes (see edit history)

[nzcarnerd]

There is a pic of a hotrodded 490 on this page where you can see the rear springs. Chevrolet 490 and Superior Photo Gallery page The frame of the car is too lightly built to be anything bigger. The tourer in your second picture is mid 1920s - and as usual there is always at least one Model T Ford in the background. All cars have some distinguishing feature - this car has the side lights in the base of the windshield. Pity we can't see the radiator!

[Guest ARhodes]

I just did a little checking to verify my recollection. I believe that my grandfather did the work on his "hotrod" at his own grandfather's blacksmith's shop! That means that my great-greatgrandfather had a hand in that car too!

-Tony

EDIT:

Here is the only other photo of the car I could find....

Edited November 16, 2010 by ARhodes
Add a photo (see edit history)

[Larry Schramm]

According to the license plate it looks like the picture is from 1923 or 1924.

[Guest ARhodes]

According to the license plate it looks like the picture is from 1923 or 1924.

I am pretty sure it says 1924. So he had the car for at least 5 years after he built it. Not bad for something he made from a junker.

-Tony