lrlforfun
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Posts posted by lrlforfun
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OK Riviera People: Not so critical but i thought I'd mention it. For some reason 64 Riviera steel rims were painted an extra shiny gloss black. I also believe the rims were all black and if there was another color it might have been a particular customer. Mitch
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OK Chris: 63 and 64. These are fastened to the seam with clips. Mitch
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OK Chris: I have asked the question on this forum many times. The question, again, is, "would anyone know if there is a formula statisticians use that may shed some light on how many of a particular vehicle survive"? So far, nothing.
I'd need as many sources as possible to gather data and that is still inconclusive. DMV data bases from every country would give a certain factor to the equation, a poll perhaps like Harris or Gallup, and the universal guess as to what % of a particular year or time period. There is always the un-calculateable too. This includes vehicles laying in a field or ravine as well as vehicles who's records have long dropped off any data base and vehicles that have gotten da squish a very long time ago.
I'm going to guess that due to these car's popularity since new there might be 15% survival.
It's just a number i drew out of my hat. Can anyone do better? Mitch
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OK Joe: I like it at $3,500. Add another couple grand if it can drive to the store and back. It's been spammed everywhere for a long time and I'm thinking the seller's not ready to cry uncle. This car is desirable at a price. Mitch
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OK Riviera People: A couple things here to add....
As a very long term owner of a 65 Riv GS I remember mine worn out with under 100K. It's no wonder. That 3:42 rear end has the engine revving higher all the time. Add a large dousing of gasoline to the crankcase through the carbs and the fact that the 425 has a little less meat on it than a 401 all add up to a somewhat shorter engine life. Still, even though most these were purchased by more mature people who actually gave their cars good care and did not let their Rivieras suffer indignities like peeling out off the show room floor, they didn't last that long.
At the time I first got my car I was on a budget so I purchased a lo mileage wrecked 64 Riv from a junk yard. I transferred the motor as well as many of the other good parts to my car that were fatigued. I could also see where many original motors were removed and sent to the scrap heap. I also remember a few 65 GS's that had a single 4 barrel most likely due to the problems with the dual quads that many lousy mechanics couldn't overcome. Also, who would really remember (or actually document) all the other full size D-Q Buicks that had original motors which played out.
That said, out of all the 3,000 or so dual quad 65 Rivieras (not to mention 64 65 and 66 Le Sabre wagons, Wildcats, Electras and Rivs) probably the lions share had transplants after that 7-10 year old period. At the time the original motor didn't matter. It STILL DOESN'T. I believe that most owners got junk yard motors to keep their cars going because the cars were important to them!
BTW, In many Western States where cars didn't suffer like in the Torture Belt states there were several chain outfits like Automotive Engineering who had an assembly line type machine shop that removed and replaced the klunked out engines with an exchange (depending on the application) rebuilt engine. This phenomenon was also enhanced by a myriad of production enamel paint shops that could scuff and shoot a fresh good looking paint job with synthetic enamel lickety-split!
Back to the turquoise heap. This is what's out there now. GS, no GS, ZS, AS, BS, any S. Most are going to need a motor rebuild, most are going to be rusted to beat the band, (even in the Western States Father Time is watching with vigilance) most are going to need the full meal deal anyway. Seeing the rise in their popularity I'm predicting and again saying that the boat's sailin' and if y'all want a 65 Riv, the departures on the boat schedule are less and less.
Mitch
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OK Buick People: My favorite....they missed it completely...New Old Stock, the biggest hoax in the old car hobby. (Next is patina).
It ain't new because it was made 50 years ago.
It may never have been used but that's no guarantee the part is in mint condition.
Perhaps y'all can use the term "Unused old stock"?
It's not used, it's old and may have been in inventory .
Mitch
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OK Riviera People: In my opinion any complete and somewhat not that damaged or that rusted a 65 Riviera IS FAR FROM A PARTS CAR. A Barney car of course is a different story.
Remember in the 80s when guys were partin' 59 4867 converts, 59 cad converts? 59 Chev converts? Skylark converts? I believe the 65 Riviera with a production of 30K+ units is headed for that category.
The 65 Riv is a sleeping giant that is in the process of waking up. There are several rough examples for sale for cheep and I'm thinkin' this ship is gonna set sail sooner than later. The GS is more popular because of the muscle car trend, never the less a 65 Riviera is a top contender for one of the sexiest Buicks of all time as well as cars of that entire era too.
I personally am almost constitutionally incapable of parting a 65 Riv (or almost any other First-Gen Riv) out so perhaps I am biased
Mitch
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OK Mr. Earl: A parts car in my opinion is a bad investment for collision repair. I suggest dismantling the damaged areas and then look for the parts on an individual basis.
1. You can hunt for cherry parts
2. You can shop for price.
3. If you do buy a parts car you ultimately won't save a dime. You'll have the purchase price, towing, storage and you'll need to face the facts that some parts may also un-useable.
4. There may be a storage issue as well as a disposal issue.
Unless your friend is into First-gen Rivs heavy I believe it's much more energy than it's worth. Me? I don't think like a normal person and I like makin' mud pies. Mitch
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OK Winston: Several things here. One, that police officer could have ruined his career because blackmail (extortion) is illegal. Next...
I know I might preachin' to deaf ears but this matching numbers game really sucks the life out of the hobby for me. I'm hoping by voicing my opinion that I can wake up a group of people who I consider a silent majority and consider the matching numbers mythology meaningless like I do.
Again, a 65 Riv is still a 65 Riv. I believe it's value (how supply and demand are determined), like any old car is by condition and "personality".
Mitch
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OK Pete: The guys on the HAMB have been complaining about dynamat because of it's high costs. Apparently there are several products out there that are comparable. Anyone want to chime in with that?
I've done a pair of interiors so far. The upholstery shop pout their stock type mat in underneath the Clarks carpets and it's a very good fit. Mitch
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OK Fuzz: I would NEVER part a rust free 65 Riv...especially with your skill set. Floors and trunk pans perhaps don't grow on trees, never the less they are available. Mitch
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OK Riviera People: I still am not feeling the love from matching numbers mythology. Again, I hope I represent the majority of people out there who don't care.
A 65 Riv is still a 65 Riv ....even if it's just drug outta da river bed. if it were the best 64 in the Universe you still wouldn't want it. For the Corvette people, please tell than that it's still a Vette...even if it's a 6. Mitch
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OK Dan: I got Portola red for a 64 Riv I have. It was really the square peg in the square hole. It matched beautifully. BTW, that SEM "Sailcloth White" is another winner for touching up a white 63 and 64 interior. (65 has a slight pearlescent tint to the standard interior). Mitch
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OK Tom: My pet peeve is cars with clear glass. I have seen a few First-Gen Rivs, mostly povertys, with all clear glass. Some with factory tinted windshield only, again, mostly povertys....of which many could have been changed to tint after they were cracked and replaced.
I have done a full tint swap out on a dark green/white standard interior 65 Riv and it really helped a lot.
I believe the lion's share of First-gens had full tint. Personally I think full tint adds so much to a cars appearance.....even a 53 Plaza which is as unexciting as it gets looks better with full tint.
Now, for a personal observation. I have many old cars and the interiors of cars with full tint have fared so much better than their identical counterparts with clear glass. I also have a white/black custom leather 63 with almost all options and clear glass. A mystery?
Finally, a B-60 friend has a convert with fresh clear windshield. I asked him why he went with tint rather than the clear it originally had and he explained that being 6-6 his vision was somewhat obstructed by that shaded area on top. A reasonable explanation.
Finally, the 65 is now getting the respect it has always deserved. This is evidenced by the scarcity of units for sale, the dramatically higher asking price over 63 and 64 models, the number of builds going on and the much greater exposure they are receiving in media and at shows.
Mitch
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OK 64 Riv Person: Clarks HANDS DOWN!!!
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OK Buick People: I'm with Dale. If one wants a car that bad here's the drill.......as I see it
Contact the seller.
Ask pertinent questions.
If you're out of the area get decent pictures.
Re-contact the seller and discuss the car and logistics.
Settle on an approximate price, one the seller would say work and you would be happy with, with out making an offer.
Go and physically look at the car, put it in the air, take a test drive (what ever is appropriate for the application), check it's paperwork status, check on the logistics, how much to transport, who's gonna transport, ask when it can be picked up, ask how long before it can be picked up, ask to physically see the seller's ID, the title and registration, ACTUALLY CHECK on it's DMV status.
If a car looks too good to be true in the add chances are it may be a scam but nothing is guaranteed. I remember looking at a car way below market and didn't call because I thought it was a scam. It wasn't. The seller was legit and just needed his car to sell. When I did call it had been sold that day. I saw it for sale later on for much more from a legit flipper.
Bottom line? If we slow down and do our homework we will be so much better off. If we fear that "deal" won't be around for too much longer it REALLY is time for us to re-evaluate things. Mitch
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OK Buick People: I have a bunch of parts cars. I have a bunch of excellent builders. I have a small bunch of decent drivers. I have excellent storage area. That said, I was going to dismantle a few cars, take the carcasses to the metal place, get a few bucks and get my numbers down by a few cars.
Things I'm dealing with, in no particular order......
1. Mama says , "NO MORE CARS". Now that the cars (junkers) I like are hardly worth anything it would be easy and of course more fun than a barrel of monkeys to accumulate another 25 or so cars for heck-a-cheep. I can't do it or I'll be sleepin' in the back seat of a 60 Le Sabre sedan Happy wife, happy life? Yeah.....
2. If I were to bust up a few cars I would have no place to warehouse the parts. I have the land area but not the storage area. That is a similar story I've heard from many others. The cars are much tidier together lined up in neat rows and I know where most everything is. I've taken hundreds of pictures of everything and they are an easy reference when I need something. I also love looking at the pictures.
3. I suffer from the "can't cut loose syndrome". My particular strain is , I can't cut loose with the categories of cars I collect. A B-60? I'm not choppin' that one up unless it's a Barney (like Rubble) car. A B-59? I'm sendin' it down the road with no regrets no matter what model or what condition it is in. A friend of mine has a similar strain of this disease. He's into Japanese motorcycles of the late 60-mid 70s.
4. To cut loose? Now, even if I could......my stuff is worthless. Mitch
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OK Rich: I have a deep cycle marine battery I use in several of my old heaps. I keep it on that 2 amp float charge. I start my cars as often as possible and let them warm up. Not too big a waste of fuel, I don't think. The Stabil fuel stuff is fine with a full tank...make sure the gas cap is new too.
Always bleed the brakes and keep fresh oil in the crankcase along with a quart of Marvel's Mystery Oil before anything...including winter storage. Eventually in time you're going to loose things (muffs, carbs, batteries, fuel pumps, etc) but this is the most reasonable insurance to preserve long term storage. Mitch.
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OK Bill: Glad you were able to keep that and the 4739 too. Mitch
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OK Bruk: What model and body style? Is the transmission Twin Turbine or Tripple Turbine? Location? This info will help greatly. Mitch
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OK Ed: I believe it's 65. Short chrome piece with the cig lighter and....the ribbed rear heat vents. Mitch
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OK Riviera People: These are mine. Hit me up with something! Thanks, Mitch
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OK D: Back in the day before I knew anything about anything (I'm still in the dark for the most part) I'd take that dead Buick floor mat and cut off a 2 X 4" section and use it as a squeegee when color sanding. I also remember having a pile of them almost a foot high. Then, who knew? Mitch
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OK Healy: Do not replace anything yet. First diagnose why it's running hot. I'm not a mechanic so perhaps a qualified tech can chime in with the correct diagnostic process. It can be so many things including a combination of problems. Mitch
'65 console restoration
in Buick Riviera
Posted
OK Drew: Ditto on that SEM black. Don't be stingy with the coats either. Mitch