Gunsmoke
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Posts posted by Gunsmoke
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More pictures of 2015-2018. Engine that turned out cracked, wood sub-chassis, good inside for driver door and assembled roughly for consideration of cycle style front fenders.
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More pictures of 2015-2018. Rough front showing dasdh chopped out by PO, rough pattern for new dash, original Plymouth door handles that came with car, and correct headlights found on eBay in 2015.
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Having bought this "barnfind" in late 2014, I spent about 3 years into mid 2018 trying to gather parts suitable for a rebuild, picked up correct headlights ($500), cowl lights ($400), door handles and gauges ($500) and planned a wood sub-chassis rebuild in the absence of any photos, info or details on how these roadsters were originally built. I initially had a lead on a 1931 CD8 Sedan in Minnesota as a potential donor car, advertized in Hemmings, but asking price was too high. So I found a CD8 Deluxe engine (short block but 3.25" pistons etc) at $1000, a DC8 Dodge rearend and transmission and started on a wood subframe (similar to early 30's Dodge Roadster). At this point I was only half heartedly moving along. Block turned into a bust, had internal cracks in valve train area, impossible to fix. In 2019, I was alerted to a rough, but mostly complete CD8 Sedan in Virginia, which I eventually bought and transported home. Made decision to use that rolling chassis for the roadster and put Sedan body on the original roadster chassis and sell the Sedan as a project for someone else. Finally I had 95% of a 1931 CD8 car and could proceed knowing the finished job would be as close to original as I could afford and accomplish as a DIY project. a few photos to follow of these interim somewhat wasted steps.
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Not unusual to have cowl area and rear tub slightly off kilter during a re-fit. As a starting point, I make sure steel frame/chassis is on 4 solid jack stands (and not sitting on tires or springs for example) and is perfectly level across at base of cowl and at rear cross member where shim/bolts are (may require fine shimming of jack stands). Once this is established, ensure as you have that the vertical measurements at cowl side to side and at rear posts both side are identical. If all clear, then re-shimming of the 4 key mounting points (or 6 or 8 if necessary) will straighten out any "twist", which can be caused by many factors. Typically these cars had 1/8"-3/16" firm canvas pads (not rubber which will compress over time) and then steel U-shaped shims of 1/16" thickness were added as needed to square everything up. Mounting bolts were only snugged down, not cranked. Biggest subsequent issue after squaring is door alignment/gaps. In your car's case, it appears you need about 1/8"-3/16" extra shim at passenger side cowl mount, and another 1/8" shim at driver side rear. Then check visual alignment as per your photo. I've faced this issue on several restoration jobs, and a little patience can usually sort it out. As a further check, setting up a "batter line" from front to back also works. Clamp a vertical bar at both ends of car at centerline, pull a string tight end to end, and mark centerline of cowl and points on rear tub. Use a plumb bob to see if all major components are centered.
Finally, the aim is not perfection, but only satisfactory fit. Any abnormal amount of twist or mis-alignment will usually show up when doors close. When I restored my '31 Chev Coach (2 door), I probably spent 2 days tweaking the shims (4 points each side) to get doors to fit properly. There are instructions on doing this in my owners manual.
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I'm puzzled by this thread's somewhat wondering nature. The interlocking letters in the logo of the original posted photos are clearly ALCO, suggesting the manufacturer of that piece of casting. Not sure where the ACME connection comes in (see rcr comment of May 2014 above), I know ACME was a large multi-product manufacturing operation way back, even supplied products for Wile E Coyote for use on Road Runners! Regardless, great looking machinery, whether automotive or industrial. Quite possible ACME and ALCO were partners at some point.
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I'm guessing very sought after items by Hudson owners 1930-1950.
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Curious why you would bother doing anything except painting it, it will never be seen. Any attempt at repair is likely to leave it worse.
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How about Elcar? This I think is 1928 or 1929, side sheet metal is similar, rad shell looks similar.
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The sheet metal suggests to me a "mash-up". Note clean lines of hood/cowl and the sweeping curve on top of cowl, reminiscent of late 20's LaSalle and some others circa 1930. However, that door and partial rear quarter panel seems to come from something else, and there appears to be a golf club door. The curved molding detail at front edge of door is unusual. 2 part windshield suggest it is not much later than 1925/26.
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Let's face it, they're all Carbage! (a term I just coined). Why anyone over 14 years of age would want one, let alone pay big bucks for one amazes me. Yawn......
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A little sleuthing should narrow it down. 6 cyl engine in 2 blocks of 6, unusual front engine gear driven water pump, perhaps magnito, interesting "over-flywheel" crossmember, chassis very robust, interesting inward sloping body mounting brackets, very high mounted steering wheel, Michelin tires (passenger side looks new, driver side used). I'm guessing circa 1905-1910, likely Italian, Fiat, Itala, etc.
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As for model year, likely a 1926 based on engine date. Manufacturers typically set up their plants for the production of next years models in about August/September of preceding year. So an Engine manufactured in Dec 1925 would normally be for a 1926 Model. Looks like a greast project, pretty complete and good sheet metal. Good Luck.
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I would think any period updraft carb of same general size and with same flange dimensions would work subject to modifying linkage to suit. Carb sometimes has to be reversed in order for throttle and choke hookups to work. Similarly, air cleaner might need changing or elimination. This Zenith look pretty rough, I'm sure for a few bucks you could find a decent working carb. My 1931 Chev called for a Carter, but they were troublesome, I found a NOS in period Tillotson JR on eBay that works perfectly, needed only minor modification to linkage.
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I suspect the car in original photo, if it is a Chevrolet, is a 1927, based on apparent hood length. As some may know, Chevrolet planned for their 1928 models to use the new stovebolt 6 cyl engine, and lengthened the hood accordingly by about 3" or 4" to accommodate the longer engine block (see oldfords '28 Coupe photo above). When manufacturing timetables for the engine became problematic, they opted to install the 4cyl engines instead and installed a shroud between rad and engine to accommodate proper cooling. The first 6's began in 1929. So the OP car may have originally been a 1927 model cabriolet (based on hood length)(convertible but not roadster) with some 1928 bits, and the gentleman may in fact have a used car with some modifications, such as a driver's door replacement. The car also appears to have a "greyhound" or similar hood ornament, while Chevrolet by that time had started using the "Viking". I think we have some work to do to nail down this "mashup", including the interesting door handle issue.
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The needle is secured to the other end of the copper spiral tube, which as you know expands a bit under pressure causing the needle to move. Easiest solution may be to carefully apply some pressure to tube causing it to change it's shape slightly (making it slightly smaller in diameter) thus causing arrow/pointer to move towards O on gauge. Carefully is key word!
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For shipping/moving around/working at it, Ideally you want a 4-wheeled stand that has mounting points in same locations as on car frame and high enough for ease of work. Can be made up of properly braced wood/plywood, or steel angle. However for working on engine internals, a stand that allows rotation of crankcase etc is ideal. If only for rolling about and shipping (not for doing any work on), you can stand engine on end after removing bell housing, and bolt it to a simple 2'x2' wood platform (or smaller if suitable) on 4 casters. On end they take up very little space.
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Now that looks like a fun car to have in your stable! And so easy to build and maintain. Good luck with the hunt for a good head, there should be some around. I have an excellent 1931 Chrysler CD8 Deluxe head if anyone is in need of one.
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Here are the pair I purchased, 2 years ago, seller advertised them as NOS, note card lists vehicles they fit. 16.5" long, no signs of any stiffening or cracking of rubber. I'll consider $50 + shipping for anyone who wants them.
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I have a pair of NOS flex hoses I bought on eBay 2 years ago for my 1931 Chrysler project, mint, and rubber appears fine. Since I needed 3, I bought a set of new repo ones, so these 2 are now surplus. If interested, let me know. Cost me $65 to land them here, so....
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I probably have an extra switch and coil, same items were used on several MOPAR products at the time. I know I have 2 from 1930/31 Dodges. What year/model are you looking for? Switches were usually common, except some had a face plate mounted at front face of dash.
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Last post for today. Bringing home an old car is always a mix of excitement and trepidation. A few pictures of the day of pickup and it's arrival 200 miles later at my property. To say it was rough and partially incomplete would be an understatement, confirmed later on as I began to realize just how many alterations had been made. The first decision was deciding to actually keep it and make it into something. The second was a choice between rebuilding it the way Walter had in the 1950's as an historic "modified", or try to return it close to 1931 specifications. Having decided on the latter, the Caddy V8 had no value, nor did the LaSalle tranny so I donated them to a hodrod friend for use in one of his eventual builds (they are now the power plant of a 1930 Ford Coupe hotrod, very cool old school). The Auburn rear-end (which was in perfect condition) fetched a good dollar (about 1/3 of what I paid for the whole car) at Hershey in late 2015. And those Electroline 1950's headlights fetched $600 on ebay! Sold the bumper and the Plymouth Goddess hood ornament that also came with it and by the time the financial dust settled, I was into a starter project for under $1700USD. But a long and expensive road remained.
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As part of my effort to learn more about the Chrysler Roadster, I contacted one of Walter's sons who told me his Dad had sold the car to a good friend, who could tell me it's history. I met the guy in 2015 (he was then 92) and he told me of Walter's passion for cars, that Walter had rescued the roadster body from a scrap yard in about 1953, and that in 1957 Walter had bought a rare 1941 Packard 4 door convertible and sold him the roadster. He gave me pictures he had of the car taken in 1957. Another friend of mine had pictures of the car taken at a car show in 1966, and the widow had a photo take in about 1969, last time car was on the road. In all the photos, the car wears proudly the same front bumper, which I think is from a 1935 era International truck! As can be seen, none of the cars original brightwork survived and even the lovely dash had been cut from the car at some point.
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A brief trip down memory lane. When my Dad realized in the 80's that I had a passion for pre-war cars, he talked about only 2 cars. His 1936 Auburn he owned before the war, and his friend Walter Keys "Big Black Chrysler Roadster". Dad and Walter were both mechanics, loved getting cars working better than factory, and enjoyed stock car racing at the local 1/4 mile ovals. He told me Walter had modified the Chrysler Roadster in 1954 using a 40's Caddy Flathead V8, LaSalle tranny and Auburn dual ratio rear-end, and it was such a "cool car". By then, he had not seen the car since the 60's and figured it had been sold out of the area. Up to time of his passing in 1999 he regularly mentioned his old friend Walter's car.
I never thought about the car after his passing. But on a trip back home (about 200 miles) in 2014, I asked an old car friend if there were any interesting old cars lurking around. After initially saying NO, everything has been found, he told me an old gent who lived 4 miles away had died a couple years earlier, and in the 80's the guy had a couple of old cars in a shed on his property but would never sell them. I went to visit his 85 yr old widow who confirmed the 2 old cars were still in the shed, "go have a look"! My jaw dropped when I opened the overhead door to find a "Big Chrysler Roadster" staring me in the eye, rough shape, loosely assembled, with a Cadillac flathead V8 sitting along side. I returned to the house and asked if it was for sale. "My son was here yesterday and we decided it was time to sell it". I put a deposit on it and closed the sale the next day. These were taken the day I found it. And the journey began.
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A clamp of some sort, perhaps to go on squarish tubing, not likely automotive.
1931 Chrysler CD8 Roadster Rebuild Diary
in Chrysler Products - General
Posted
So March 2018 decision is made to buy this sad looking ticket!. But other than one running board and one wheel, it was complete and price was right. Dragged it home and eventually set roadster rough body on Sedan chassis