1955 Packard clipper Custom Constellation

[Ronney]

Alright folks,

I just discover this forum tonight and I have some questions concerning my 55 Clipper Custom Constellation.

I bought her about a year ago as a project car for me and my daughter. We thought this would be a safe and reliable car for her to drive back and forth from college. It would be if everything worked well and mechanincs were avaialable to work on the car when needed. I do all my work when possible.

Enough whining, My transmission sticks in Park.

It does not shift through the gears well at all, I must do it manually at times.

Worst of all it has a vibration that is driving me simply nuts!!!!

When I start the car the engine has medium frequency vibration. Tooling around at low speeds the vibe seems little to non-existant. As I reach speeds between 30 to 60 the vibration increase and at some speeds it disappears then she is the smoothest riding car ever. The guys at the base call her the marshmallow.

I have been told by the local mechanics in San Antoino that it could be the balancer or the torque converter. Ooops, the engine is the 352 and the trany the Ultramatic. I have had the homemade driveshaft, (previous restorer)balanced as best they could without being able to spin the shaft. There seemed to be neglagible change after that. Remember it vibrates while idling or simply reving the engine.

You can actually see the mirrors on the fenders vibrate then smooth out as the frequency resinates/ transfers through the car.

I'm desperately searching for help to unstick the shift lever from sticking in park.

I'm desperate to eliminate the vibration.

If I do those things and stiffen the braking up my wife will let me keep the car. I hate to dump it on her but she has a point.

I'm military and don't have the luxary of being home or sending the daughter in an unsafe car. I don't want to see it fall apart. I'm sure you know what I mean. I will say this, my daughter can pick a well engineered car in my opinon.

After reading many posts, I don't think I could convert the eng and trany to chebbie stuff for peace of mind.

Signed Desperate to keep her.

[Pontiac59]

Seems to me, you want a safe reliable car for a college kid to go to school in, get her a '90's Caprice or something. A car this old is going to be tempermental - I drove a '60 Pontiac as my only car for three years, but I also carried a tool box, spare parts, and could fix pretty much any of it's ills. I went to school with it, but I also went for auto tech. For the most part it was reliable, but it had a number of recurring, frustrating issues too. I get something like the last two late model cars I've had - a freebie towaway and a $50 truck - and they're pretty reliable once I fix their ills.

Take the driveshaft off and have it balanced, or get another. These Packards are still common enough no one on this board seems to care if I find a batch that either need homes or will be crushed. Some engines are externally balanced, so you may want to remove the inspection cover and check for any missing welded-on pieces on the converter, which could contribute to the vibration. But the fact that the shaft is homemade, I would look to that first.

My truck vibrates at speed because one of the disc brake calipers doesn't slide properly, and that varies with speed ranges and with turning as well. So there can be other causes to check in addition to the drivetrain issues. That '60 Pontiac would literally wallow at low speeds. May have been the tie rod ends, had to change those out. But once you got over 10 MPH you didn't notice it, so I never did chase it out.

My kickdown sticks, too, it varies speeds when cold or hot. Considered a fluid and filter change on the trans? Is the linkage binding? These are a pushbutton if I remember right, perhaps something is out of alignment there.

[6219_Rules]

Welcome Ronnie!

Glad to have you on the forum! If you have not already done so, check out the Packard Forum.

It is just down the list a bit. I know these folk well, and they can answer all of your questions concerning Packards. Good luck with your '55!!

[Guest Albert]

The transmission in the 55 have a problem with the parking pawl unside the transmission. The gear that pawl goes into can get a little chew and it hard to release as well as the gear itself. Or the input selector shaft and the roller lever the pushes on the pawl. Check with www.ultramaticdynamics.com for the tranni parts and more information, Sometimes a link adjustment can help too. As for the viberation remove the lower part of the bell housing and check for a missing nut on the torque converter or loose nut or a place where a weight may have been on the flywheel, also may be an idea to do a compression test on the motor & sparkplugs and the harmonic balancer and see how that is as they can also cause viberation. The ultramatic transmission does not do a low to high shift on its own, if you look on the gear shift indicator you will notice on eather side of the "D" two little triangles that is where the gear is suppose to line up. The left triangle is the normal driving range at reduced engine speeds, the right triangle is provided for faster acceleration.

[Ronney]

Thanks for the information. I do have teeth missing from the fly wheel but the vibration seems excessive to this. I'm taking it to our military auto hobby shop. I will do a compression check there.

I'm also putting her on the lift and removing the trans from the engine then starting her to see if the problem still exists. If not, it should be in the troque converter.

As for it sticking in park I will work it real time as well while under the car.

I read the replys under the packard forum. I guess I need to learn where to post this stuff as well.

I heard the Packard had a history of power brake problems, but was it that bad? Are there modern fixes?

P.S. I have e-mailed Pete at ultradynamics a few weeks ago to see if there were any pictures of the parts each of you have discribed. No reply. I guess I'll just keep pluggin at. I'll post pictures soon.

P.S.S. My front window is leaking. I found no buttle seal installed. the wondow is set in crooked by a 3/8" tilt to the right, the chrome is not installed properly... Could this mean someone shoved a chevy window in it?

Is it as easy to remove and replace the front windows as my manual describes? Where can I get the tool or cord?

V/R

Ron

[Ronney]

Thanks for the information. As for the shifter it sticks in Park and when in drive, it is not aligned properly. I do not have push button shifting, thank God.

No one here in San Antonio can even balance the drive shaft, they do not have the adapter. It vibrates at idle and when reving it up or increasing in speed. Funny, it is real smooth when assending long hillS.

Ron

[Ronney]

Thanks,

It was late and I thought I was under the Packard Forum. I have alot to learn about forums.

I definatel have to fix the car by December or mom says she is gone...

Ron Isham

[Ronney]

Thanks Brain,

I'm working al those issue every chance I get. the carburator is a bit suspect especially since it and the diributor have JB weld on them to seal some leaks.

I'm taking it in to our military hobby shop to give it the once over for two days. I'm removing the trans form the engine then starting it to see if she stil vibrates. If so then a compression check.

Also I am readjusting the carb as described in the manual then checking the trans linkage while running on the lift.

I found the timing off by about 20 degrees after I first got her...

A lot of work involved.

[Guest imported_Speedster]

I had a '65 Chevy that developed a vibration like that after I had the transmission overhauled. I took it back to repair shop and they rotated the torque converter on the flex-plate (flywheel) by one bolt and the vib went away. I don't know if there was an imbalance caused by the position of t-converter in relation to flexplate or maybe it was that the bolts were not torqued properly, warping flexplate.

It may also be caused by the flexplate being bent or cracked.

[Ronney]

Brian,

Thanks for the advice, I took my car to the military auto hobby shop and messed with the carb.

We base-lined the linkage adjustments however, she was a little hot and the choke was a little hard to set. After we were finished she wouldn?t run at all. We stuck a timer on her got her started; reset the timing and so on.

Bottom line, when running, it actually ran better with my hand over the secondary valves. I took my hand off and we sprayed carb cleaner on every hose imaginable and all around carb. No change, she was still rough and now seamed to be missing.

I unplugged the vacuum line from the distributor and then readjusted the timing. She ran better but still missed and surged a little. I pulled it out of the shop and she kept dieing. I re-plugged the distributor vacuum line and then she surged even more but I got her home.

An amazing thing happened, she had power to spare and did not hesitate in the least when I gave it the gas. Right now I feel I need to either rebuild the carb (cheapest) or replace the distributor (still convincing my wife this is fun)...

The damn thing still sticks in Park, this kills me.

P.S. I just went out to start her the following day. I adjusted the choke to the index center and she started on the first lick with no pumping, priming or anything. Bad news, as she warmed up then the choke opened up more and more till finally she died out and stopped running. Scratch, Scratch???????

Ron

[Ronney]

Brian,

Thanks, I'll order up a rebuild kit. NAPA Auto Parts actually carries one as well. Any thoughts?

As far as leaks go; I can hear the vacuum leak when I push on the brakes, it has hissing noise. The noise sounds like a modern power steering pump at the turn limit. However, the brakes are not applied when at idle, does this make sense or should a get out my carb cleaner and spray around under the dash as well?

As I mentioned in an earlier string, the vacuum advance is caked with JB weld or some type of epoxy.

My thoughts are to rebuild the carb, reset everything, and then see what happens. If she still doesn't work then purchase a rebuilt distributor and lastly work the brakes.

BTW, some older gentleman had me take off the vacuum line to the reservoir inside the fender and she had very little vacuum. The gentleman said it should be very strong and it wasn't...

Got to Work, the Air Force may yell at me.

Ron

[WCraigH]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">As far as leaks go; I can hear the vacuum leak when I push on the brakes, it has hissing noise. The noise sounds like a modern power steering pump at the turn limit. However, the brakes are not applied when at idle, does this make sense or should a get out my carb cleaner and spray around under the dash as well?

As I mentioned in an earlier string, the vacuum advance is caked with JB weld or some type of epoxy.

BTW, some older gentleman had me take off the vacuum line to the reservoir inside the fender and she had very little vacuum. The gentleman said it should be very strong and it wasn't...</div></div>

When you o'haul the carb, remove and plug the distributor vacuum line [color:"red"] AND the brake check valve (at the back of the throttle plate) with solid pipe thread plugs. This will totally eliminate any vacuum leaks in those two systems when you run the engine. Later, when the engine is idling and responding to throttle movements properly, reinstall the distributor line and the brake line one at a time to isolate the problem.

You may also have a problem with worn (loose) linkage between the throttle lever and accelerator pump. I had this problem on my 55 Pat. When you move the throttle, the accelerator pump lever should move in sync. If you can move the throttle lever off idle somewhat and the accel pump lever does [color:"red"] NOT move, then this will cause a big hesitation in engine acceleration. The fix is to fill the worn (oversize) hole(s) with JBWeld and redrill.

Good luck and keep us informed!

[pac400]

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[Ronney]

Brian,

Ooops, As far as the comment "Any Thoughts", I was referring to a Kanter carburetor rebuild kit or a NAPA kit. I don't want to spend more money than necessary/ pay for a cheap rebuild kit then buy another later.

Ron

[Ronney]

Brain,

I initially felt like the brakes worked real well then they seemed a little less responsive. I'll check the fittings and hoses again, especially to the brakes. I think I'll try the NAPA kit, it may be from the same source as KANTER's.

It's $21.00 compared to $55.00. I know, what cheap-skate...

Thanks, I'l keep you posted.

Ron

[Constellation]

Ronney,

Sounds like you have a multitude of problems. I know I have been there. I have a 55 Clipper Custom Constellation and do all the work on it myself and on my brother's 53 Packard Clipper as well.

First off the carburator on your car needs work. However, I will advise you not to use the needles and seats if the needles have neoprene like points on them. I bought a rebuild kit from Kanter's that had them and with in 6 months had more grief than I want to know. The neoprene on the needles became gummy and litterally glued themselves to the seats, shutting off all gas flow. It drove me nuts. The car would run fine for two miles after it was hot and die in the road like it ran out of gas. I finally figured it out after taking the inspection plug out of the side of the primary fuel bowl. The float was hung up. I then took apart the top of the carburator.

It seems the MBTE in the new gas attacked the neoprene on the needles. The needles even stuck to my finger. I have a witness. He didn't believe it either. Luckily another friend gave me some old Rochester 4GC's and I salvaged a nice set of Brass needles and seats out of one and replaced them. I also upped the size of the jets to accomodate the enviornmentally friendly gas that they sell here in Mass. That helped too. The car runs fine and has since 1997.

By the way, I called Kanter's and told them about their SO CALLED Rochester 4GC rebuild kit. The response I got was less than what I would have expected, as they were indifferent.

Secondly, your Distributor. Delco-Remy still has the Vacuume Advance units on the shelf in Chicago. Periodically they are on e-bay as well. It sounds to me like the Vacuume Advace Diaphram is gone. You should replace it as the engine has no vaccume advance from the sound of it. Its relying on centrifugal advance. By rights you should take the distributor out of the car and have it checked, if they have a test stand at the base or take it to someone who has one. This way you can get it all calibrated to spec or rebuilt if need be.

Thirdly, for your Bendix Treadle Vac (Easamatic) booster on your master cylinder. It sounds like you have a major Vacuume leak there. There is a hose inside of it on the toe board side of the booster that can get damaged if its old and rotted, it may be the problem. However, vacuume could be leaking past the seal on the Vacuume piston or in the vacuume valve. I know Craig will take a major exception to this. However, I'm a traditionalist and like original equipment. Ed Strain down in Florida can rebuild your unit with less than a weeks turn around. Its worth it. He did mine and I've never had a problem since in over 4 years. I do drive this car regularly too.

Bob

[Constellation]

Brian,

You are probably right about the Carburator Rebuild Kit being inferior. However, the person at the Packard Dept. desk at Kanter's was less than enthusiastic about what had happened. I was very disappointed with the response to say the least.

All I know is that the needles actually were so sticky they were like glued to the seats. I actually had one sticking to my finger and hanging from it when I took it apart on the desk at work. My helper was a witness. He never saw anything like it either. As well as the teacher in the Auto Shop that rebuilt the carburator for me in the first place. He never saw anything like it in 30 years of working on carburators.

Brass needles are the best if you can get them. This newer formulated Gas with MBTE will not attack them.

Delco Remy's parts warehouse in Chicago has the Vacuume Advance unit on the shelf. Any Delco distibutor can get the part if they want to chase it. Mine was flown in with the salesman in his suitcase and hand delivered to C. E Beckman's in New Bedford by him the next day as he was coming here anyway. That was right nice of him to do it. Thats how I know they have them. I reused my spring and washers. I know some of the Brand X ones you see on e-bay are not original equipment. I have 2 of them as spares. One for the '53 if it ever needs it. However, if you re-use your spring and washers with it, it should be OK. From what I read about Ronney's distributor it certainly needs some work and by the sounds of things I suspect the Vacuume Advance Unit is gone.

His Easamatic (Bendix Treadle Vac) Booster worries me more. For what its worth Ed Strain can rebuild it and he will be better off in the end.

Bob

[Ronney]

All,

Thanks for the inputs fella's. I purchased a rebuild kit from NAPA yesterday and it will be here in a few days. I'll rebuild, then attack each hose with conviction and the inspection procedures I'm know for in the military.

Anything that is suspicious will be repaired or replaced. Unfortunately in San Antonio no one I have contacted works on these.

As for the vibration mentioned, it did get worse when we messed with the carb but as drove it, it was far less. It may be combination of things but carb first, distributor next, then brakes, and finally vibrations if they still occur.

I can't thank you guys enough for the advice.

Ron

[Ronney]

Brain,

Thanks for the words. The computer crumpled on me and I just took awhile getting it fixed.

I got the carburetor rebuilt for my 55 Packard Clipper Custom Constellation. She runs much better now. I have one lifter ticking and I still have pretty good vibration in the engine when idling. When on the road, she gets a pretty good harmonic vibe going. Drive shaft is balanced.

My thinking is to rotate the torque converter 90 degrees. Also to run it without the trany connected. All these were previous bits of advice.

Any advice on adjusting the trans linkages so she shifts on her own. Right now I take her to third manually. Also when in third and I go to stop she wants to die out like it can?t down shift??????????

Ron

[Ronney]

Vacuum check valve,

BTW...When I rebuilt the Carb, the vacuum check valve was previously drilled out. there was no ball and spring that I am use to seeing in typical check valves. Any clues on where I can get one?

Ron

[Guest Albert]

The idea is great trying to disconnect the tranni from the motor to ckeck for bad vibs, but you have two problems. one the starter has to be removed to remove the lower shield to get axcess to the flywheel/converter, second you can not unbolt the torque converter as it has welded studs on the front. You would have to remove the tranni completly and reinstall the lower part of the bell housing to install the starter. May be an idea to check the nuts on the torque converter/flywheel to make sure they are all there and the type/same weight.

[Ronney]

Sorry it took so long to get back to you folks helping me with the Clipper.

I will try the oil for the lifters before I replace any of them. Funny thing, I met an older gentleman that said Packard?s love 20W motor oil and anything else makes them sick. He suggested I try straight 20w before I do anything else. I heard 318 lifters will fit the 352 engine?

As for the vibration, it occurs in park at idle and while driving. The guys who balanced my drive shaft first clued me in. It is more noticeable at speeds above 40 mph. However, it will shake your teeth out at idle when rev?d up as well as above 40.

I was reading my manual and I believe your correct, its probably the governor. I was contemplating a flush instead of filter change...Any recommendations between the two since she is older?

Another question, would you recommend any of the Kanter reupholstery kits for this car?

Ron

[Guest Albert]

If you have a viberation when in park you problem is not in the driveshaft or non rotating parts of the transmission, look motor, flywheel, torque converter. You may have to disconnect the transmission and slide it back out of the way then reinstall the starter, and try running the motor, less the transmission, may be an idea to remove the fan belt while running and support the rear of the motor so mothing will hit the rad. Had a friend that lost one of the flywheel weights and did the same sort of thing.

[bernardi]

I'll expose my ignorance again. I understand how to drain the ultramatic converter, but how do you refill it? I haven't dropped the pan so I haven't actually seen the two plugs. Is the top hole exposed sufficiently to pump in the ATF? (My spell checker is ignorant, too. It says there is no such word as "ultramatic".)

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Access to the 2 plugs in converter is thru the small cover on bottom of bellhousing, not in pan. ATF is pumped into converter from pan.

I have drained ATF from converter by only removing one plug, didn't loosen the other, and it drained fine (just a little slower). Much less work that way, since you only have to get to one plug.

[Guest Albert]

as in the previous post there is two plugs in the converter, you have to remove the lower flywheel cover. 55-56 is a little more work to get at these plugs. you can also remove the lines at the transmission and blow out the remaining fluid in there and the cooler too. Refilling you add 7quarts start the car, this will refill the converter then add the remaining, from empty the transmission in 51-54 takes 12 quarts, and I think the 55-56 is about the same. Just make sure you DO NOT over fill, this will damage an automatic, best to add the last couple of quarts slowly watching the dipstick carefully, and the fluid should be warm as well. The 54 gearstart & 55-56's you will have to wait for a few min between fills for the fluid to clear out of the dipstick tube or you will get a false reading, check on park with the engine running then go through the gears and recheck.

[bernardi]

B.H., Rick L. and Albert -

Many thanks for your help. I think I can handle that OK. When I originally bought the car (last year), I had the transmission drained and refilled. The mechanic did not drain the converter. A week later when I had the car inspected, I specifically instructed the station to drain the converter and change the fluid. They couldn't find the converter drain or some such excuse, and merely dropped the pan, replaced the fluid and adjusted the bands - for $80 and I furnished the transmission fluid. If I read the manual correctly (I loaned it to the station), adjusting the bands is a very quick job. From memory, adjustment consists of- Back off a lock nut, tighten to a specific torque and retighten the lock nut on two bolts.

Am I overly price conscious or was that an overcharge?

The point of all this is - if the non-converter fluid were replaced twice at short intervals, wouldn't that pretty well flush out the converter?

Another question - The 400 I've stored for 20 years is about to be fired up. The transmission worked with no problems before I put it away. With 70,000 miles of use, it probably should be rebuilt. The rebuilder I hope to use is a couple hundred miles away. Would any one care to hazard a guess as to whether a change of fluid and a little local useage would be enough "break-in" to take it on the Interstate for a couple hundred miles?

Again, thanks for your help.

[bernardi]

B.H. -

Thanks for the advice. As I put the last 50,000 on the 70,000 mile car, I know the transmission was not rebuilt in that time. The newer (to me) car has 50,000 and does not shift as I would like. It goes almost directly to direct drive at the 20+ mile speed. On long hills it goes in and out of direct drive as if the clutches just won't hold it in direct. When it comes out of storage, I'll change again the fluid and put some local miles on it. Perhaps some transmedic or something similar will help, but I don't have high hopes.

As for brake hoses, brakes, radiator, etc on the other - absolutely. Everything gets oiled and greased and repacked before it moves under its own power. The one item I hadn't counted on is the front drive shaft universal. That must be disassembled to adequate service. I believe the Clipper uses a different type, or maybe the 56.

[Guest Randy Berger]

Bernardi, both Clippers and Seniors use same style front universal if they are ultramatics, but they are different sizes. You can drop the driveshaft and clean and repack both the front and rear universal. I did that again a couple of years ago. I can't remember what the time frame is but it would be a good idea to clean out all the old grease and pack in fresh. Just be careful and don't lose any needle bearings, front or rear(lol).

YFAM, Randy Berger

[bernardi]

B.H. and Randy -

Thanks.

[Ronney]

All,

Thanks for the advise again. While I changed the oil to a 20w the tapping lifter still persists. I have ordered lifters for it.

I will probably take it and drop the trany and inspect it. Especially after I went through the manual and readjusted all carburator and tramsission linkages.

Now I get no Park...the car will roll down hill, while off and in Park. I hear little clicking. I can't find nuetral and reverse is now harder than ever to find.

PLAN of ATTACK:

Check flywheel and Torque converter

Clean the filters and adjust anything I can with the pan off.

It had a new converter from Kanter installed by the previous owner. Unfortunately there are so many little things wrong with it it's scary.

I was checking the brakes and the rt rear wheel cylinder push rod was totally off. I'm just venting becuase I like the car and good help in San Antonio is nearly impossible to find.

I'll keep you all posted as I go.

Ron

[Guest imported_Speedster]

Ron,

Do you happen to know Clem Gates, in San Antonio?

He's the one I purchased my '29 Packard from.

He had a small restoration shop there.

If you could locate him, he may be able to help find the information and help you need.

I tryed to call him about 3 months ago but the number I have was nolonger a good one. So he has moved or changed phone numbers recently.

[55PackardGuy]

If you hear "clicking" when the car moves in park, it's probably the sound of the parking pawl not quite engaging fully. Sounds like the linkage needs to be adjusted.

[Ronney]

All,

I went through the brakes and they all need to be re-padded.

After I adjusted the transmission, according to the manual I heard a snap when I pulled it home and put it in park. Now I have drive and reverse only. As I accelerate it makes whining sound now. Anyway I'll tackle that later.

I pulled everything off today to attack the horrid lifter tapping. The lifter was frozen and it tore the upper end of the rod up pretty good. Now I have to order one from Kanter. I'm hopeful this fixes the noise. We?ll find out Tuesday.

I'll try to work the trany next month or in July. What I'll do is separate it from the engine and see if it?s vibrating there. Lets back up...I?ll drop the pan first and look over the linkage.

Standby for updates and keep the advice coming, it?s much needed.

Ron

[Ronney]

Rick,

I'm sorry I don't know Clem. I pretty much work on my Clipper with only the help of all the forum folks like you.

I wish I could get some of those service bulletings the others speak of.

Take care

Ron

[Ronney]

All,

This is Ron, back with an update on my 55 Clipper. Sorry for the delay (military. I fixed the lifter as mentioned, a little pricey on the delivery fees but worth it. The car sounds smooth and quiet.

I got with Mr. Fitch a www.ultramaticdynamics.com, I ordered the parts and installed them. Oh! I forgot to mention when I dropped the pan the parts just fell off into the pan.

I dropped the trany, cleaned everything I could then installed the Parking Stop Kit I purchased...what a great kit. The car shifts better than ever. I drained the converter and rotated the flywheel 180 out for the vibration. I renistalled the whole mess and she ran extremely well. I had to do all this on my lunch brakes so time was limited.

I did not reinstall the starter and check for isolated engine vibrations.

Anyway she gets moving very quickly but does not like to shift very smoothly if accelaration is too abrubt. I may need to re-adjust the linkage again.

I wanted to say thanks to all for the advise.

NOW, my wonderful daughter launched the battery into the radiator and put a huge hole in it. (I know it should be strapped in) She's an okay driver but this one had me stumped. Anybody know of an inexpensive core replacement for a 55' Clipper Custom Constellation?

Ron

[Guest dave327]

I have a radiator for you if you are interested.

[Guest Albert]

I had a new core made for my 54 Patrician, after an orange cone was placed in front of my car while shopping, when i drove off it went upinto the fan, and bent the fan blade into the rad. The shop replace the 2 core rad and made a 3 core completly from scratch, the car runs much cooler than it ever did with the old one, and it cost me $475cdn, and the even fixed up tha tanks.