engine treatments - friction reduction

[JUSTIN]

my brother in law swears that he gets 2 extra mpgs and his cars run smoother... when he put this stuff in his oil (dont know which one). my question is has anybody had any good experiences with these modern miracles? these big V8s should be perfect candidates for friction reduction.

[The Old Guy]

The only additive I use is "engine oil supplement" put out by GM. It has anti scuffing additives for engine break in. The rest are "snake oil "

[our51super]

I have tried two items like that (but not in my old cars). I used Slick 50 in a 1987 Honda Hurricane motorcycle and I honestly did see a drop in engine temp. The other product I used was Prolong (in a 1995 Oldsmobile Aurora). It seemed to both myself and Teresa that the car started smelling funny after I added that stuff. Can't tell you the long term effects as we traded it in.<BR>Frankly, I'm scared to put anything in my old cars - I just change the oil and filter religiously. If anyone has had luck with any additive I would like to know which one also. Thank you.

[BuickNut]

I also tried Slik-50 before it was hit by the gov't for false advertising - used it in my ''86 Ranger 4x4 (yesss....THAT thing again...it really IS a test bed for all things before it gets tried on the rest of my fleet )....used it very 50kmiles as prescribed. Never really noticed an appreciable gain in mpg - though went on a different route than I am now...so the gains might have been small at best. It took the engine out to 178kmiles before needing a rebuild (..now remember...old cars/trucks need to have the oil checked every 2-3 weeks for oil leaks !....my bad and learned that the hard way..), but I think the religious every 3kmiles oil changes probably had more to do with the longevity. Would really like to know if anybody has tried "Z tec" (or Z something...) ??? with linkite (??) thats supposed to be aerospace snake oil...aerospace has some pretty neat stuff before it hits automotive - ABS and I believe synthetic oil to begin with, that really does work. Has anybody done a cost effectiveness check for improvements using Systhetic oil (on not so older cars...) to see if its worth the extra dinero over conventional oils ?

[Guest John Chapman]

Justin,<P>If you can say, polytetrafluoroethylene (aka: PTFE and Teflon,) then you know what's in most of these wonder additives. Rather than type it all myself, see the following link for a discussion of the goods and bads of this stuff (pay particular attention to the part about increased metal contamination in the oil after miracle product use):<BR> <BR> <A HREF="http://www.dcn.davis.ca.us/~btcarrol/skeptic/slick50.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.dcn.davis.ca.us/~btcarrol/skeptic/slick50.html</A> <P><BR>BuickNut: IMHO, money spent on synthetic oil for autos is wasted for the following reasons:<P>1. The process of internal combustion forces contaminates into the crankcase and the oil. These will not be removed by the filter and the sulfur-based fuel wastes will combine with water to form acid. Frequent oil changes are the only way to get these out of the system. The older and looser the engine, the more acute the problem.<P>2. The strength of synthetic oils is that they maintian full lubricating capacity for a long time. Frequent oil changes with 'real' oil will maintain the same lubrication capability at substantially less expense. The longevity is a benefit in turbine engines, because under normal contitions, the oil is never contaminated by internal combusion processes and in theory will last forever. I've seen turbine oil used for thousands of hours of engine time without change, but with a stringent oil-analysis program to watch for various metal contaminates.<P>Just my thoughts.<P>JMC

[Jyrki]

What comes to additives, stay away from Teflon-based additives. On the other hand, X1R additive is one that really works (no teflon). I know a lot of racers who use it, and can tell the difference is measurable - less power loss and less wear.<P>What comes to synthetics, I have to disagree with you, John. Longevity is not the only asset of synthetics at all. The film strenght is a lot greater, thus less wear. Also, synthetics are thermally stable, not forming varnish and sludge like petroleum. Synthetics don't thin when hot that much, thus plastic thickeners not needed. Synthetics don't thicken on the cold end as much, so there's a n oil film on the bearings the very instant you start the engine. Thus you get a much better mileage and drastically less wear during a cold start and the following minutes. Synthetiics do have a lower cf of friction, too. Synthetics (esters but not polyalphaolefin) are used in jet turbines because they are the only type which will survive the heat. Put the same stuff in your car and you'll never see sticking piston rings and lifters.