Canadian Flathead V8 with alloy headers? (?1947? heavy Ford pickup)

[Guest avoyk1]

Hello all,

I recently recovered an old Ford pickup truck from out bush here in AUS. Looks like a '47 model 1-tonne truck. Engine is a 24-stud V8 flathead and appears to be in pretty good condition, although missing a few parts. The heads are aluminum with the embossed fancy 'Ford' name in the center and underneath 'MADE IN CANADA', as well has the number '87' on a tag on the block just a little forward of the righthand side head unit. Also have the VIN number and some number from the gearbox, and I can't find a model number.

I read about certain Canadian alloy head flatheads being quite rare.

Can someone please help determine what model engine this is, and whats it worth (if anything)? I thought it would be better to check first before going any further with this project.

Thanks,

Alex

[DavidAU]

The cast numbers on the block mean nothing. They are production numbers only and do not identify the engine. The aluminium Canadian heads were usually fitted to trucks to try to make them run cooler.

They used to be quite common but a lot of them were broken when they were being removed for engine repairs as they grow onto the steel studs.

They are no higher performance than some of the steel heads although they look better when polished .

The stamped number on the gearbox is what identifies the year of the motor and it is a genuine Ford number as it has the stars at each end of it.

Looking at the number it appears to be 1946 and judging by the bell housing and heads it is no later than 1948. If you went to the Fordbarn.com site someone who knows trucks should be able to ID the prefix letters.

Is it worth anything? All flathead stuff, engines and body parts are worth good money these days as they are getting harder and harder to get.

I have put Vanpelts site below with engine numbers but these are for mainly for cars

Early Ford Serial Numbers For Cars and Trucks Manufactured for the USA Market from 1932 to 1953

[Rusty_OToole]

For some reason Canadian Fords used aluminum heads in the 30s and 40s while their American counterparts used cast iron. Possibly because Canada was a major manufacturer of aluminum and it was cheaper here.

Canadian Ford heads were a "speed secret" in the US. You could mill them for more compression without overheating, almost like aftermarket aluminum heads. But they were factory stock parts, which was important in certain types of racing.

In my tool box I have a special tool for removing heads that are frozen to the studs. It is a cutter in the shape of a steel tube, with saw teeth on one end and a tommy bar on the other. It was used for cutting the head loose from the stud. You slide it down over the stud and turn it .

British Empire and later British Commonwealth regulations allowed goods to go from one country to another free of tax or import duty. For this reason many American cars found in Empire countries were actually made in Canada, or assembled from parts sourced from Canada.

[Guest avoyk1]

Thanks for the info guys. I've been to that Vanpelts site already and wasn't able to match anything, not sure I understood the layouts. Rusty_OToole did you make that tool yourself or is it something you purchased? Seems like it would be quite useful. I'm thinking I can make one with an old hole saw, possibly.

[Guest avoyk1]

After some more internet searching I found this alloy flathead heads - THE H.A.M.B.

[DavidAU]

If you look on the Vanpelt site section below for 1946 you will see that the last six numbers on your gear box number (926122) falls between 650,280 & 1,421,709 which would make it about midway through the production run.

Mercurys and Fords had the same 100HP engine.

I still can't ID the letter prefix as my Canadian Ford workshop manual lists the model number of a 46 1/2 ton truck as C61C

[TABLE]

<TBODY>[TR]

[TD=width: 12%]1946[/TD]

[TD=width: 21%]Ford V8 - 100hp

Ford 6 - 90hp

Mercury V8 - 100hp

Lincoln V12[/TD]

[TD=width: 20%]69A

6GA

69M

66H[/TD]

[TD=width: 47%]99A-650,280 to 99A-1,412,709

1GA-227,524 to 1GA- 326,417

99A-650,280 to 99A-1,412,709

H-136,255 to H-152,839 [/TD]

[/TR]

</TBODY>[/TABLE]

[Guest avoyk1]

Ahh I see.

I'm sure it's more than a 1/2 ton though, had massive set of leaf springs on the back axle and dual rims as well as a huge chunky diff and fairly long wheel base. I've never worked with old cars before (this is my first, next project is an old F250, '72 I think) but in comparison with newer trucks, this looked like at least 3 ton. But I'm not sure they produced them that size. Please forgive my ignorance on the subject.

Alex

[Rusty_OToole]

Thanks for the info guys. I've been to that Vanpelts site already and wasn't able to match anything, not sure I understood the layouts. Rusty_OToole did you make that tool yourself or is it something you purchased? Seems like it would be quite useful. I'm thinking I can make one with an old hole saw, possibly.

The tool came with a job lot of old tools purchased at an auction sale. It is about 6 inches long, made of thin tough steel, just large enough to slip over the stud. You might be able to make one out of a tube of the correct size if you can file some teeth in the end, then case harden it. I don't know if you could buy one from a Ford antique specialist or tool company.

[Guest avoyk1]

Well I got the intake manifold and oil sump off. Everything in the top is covered in a thick black sludge, and seems to be free of any rust or other damage. When I pull off the sump (it was stuck one a piece of broken steel near the starter) got a tonne was water and oil all over the place. But upon inspection the crank and everything else I can see has a layer of black oil on it and after wiping it off, the parts all look like new (yay). Have been trying to take the heads off. Ended up welding the nuts back on to the studs and was able to get most of them off with a rattle gun. Some studs snapped off though at the block and some are still stuck. Any suggestions on removing these without any more studs shearing?

Alex

Edited June 14, 2013 by avoyk1
Typos (see edit history)

[Guest avoyk1]

So far I'm really surprised at the condition this motor is in. Considering its been sitting for over 50 years in the Australian bush and been through floods and bush fires. It might even turn over if the gear box wasn't all jammed up (stuck in gear).

[Rusty_OToole]

There should be an ID plate on the body someplace giving net weight (vehicle) and gross weight (vehicle plus load). If it is larger than a 1/2 ton pickup truck.

How many wheel bolts? Light trucks used 5 bolt wheels like a car. Larger than 1/2 capacity had 8 bolt or (even larger) 10 bolt. It appears the wheels are long gone so will not ask about tire sizes.

[Guest avoyk1]

Yes I went through some pics I have of it and found one where you can see the wheels studs. Looks like five. That seems odd to me as the truck looks like it could carry much more than 1/2 a ton. I can't get to the shop and have a look at anything because I have end of semester university exams over the following couple of days.

Thanks, Alex

[DavidAU]

The 1 1/2, 2 and 3 ton trucks were fitted with the overload springs shown in your photo.

All the trucks have only 5 wheel nuts and it would seem that the wheel base is as follows:

1/2 ton - 114 inch

1 & 1 1/2 ton - 122 inch

2 & 3 ton - 134 or 158 inch wheel base.

Some of the 2 & 3 tonners have a 2 speed diff.